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stanglife

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To me, the mach1 isnt even really missing. In 03-04 we had the supercharged cobra and the NA DOHC Mach. I feel like the spirit of the Mach is here in the GT350.
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To me, the mach1 isnt even really missing. In 03-04 we had the supercharged cobra and the NA DOHC Mach. I feel like the spirit of the Mach is here in the GT350.
The 350 is more comparable to the BOSS cars, they were the corner carvers. The Mach1 was the light to light street brawler. Putting the 5.2 in a GT with a setup that more keeps it straight would be more Mach1 like.
 

jake_zx2

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Really, the roles were sort of reversed for 2003... the Cobra should have been the N/a IRS corner carver, the Mach 1 should have gotten the supercharger with the SRA to be a great straight-line car
 

stanglife

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None of these cars are anything like they were in the 60s and 70s, technology-wise. It’s simply a nostalgic theme at this point. Put stripes and some snakes on it, call it a Shelby.....paint it green with some modern torque thrust wheels and call it a Bullitt...rocker stripes and gimicky shaker hood and it’s a Mach 1.

Thankfully, SRA is dead. IRS has been in plenty of fast straight-line cars. It was only swapped due to durability issues.

My main point is that our desires are generated by the Ford marketing machine, as the current cars are nothing like the originals. If you want a fun Mustang, you have some great options right now.

A step in the right direction would be if they offered the 7.0 that was rumored for the GT500....as a modern SCJ, would make it feel like less of a “marketing only” effort.
 

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I would say the modern offerings are true to the spirit... The GT350 was always the lower-powered road racing car, while the GT500 was the all out halo mustang. Meanwhile, the GT was just that; a Grand Tourer. The modern cars fit pretty well into that classification. Hell, a 7.0 powered GT500 would be no more of a GT500 than a high HP boosted 5.2. And let's be honest, if we do see another 7.0 from anyone, its going to be quite a long time from now
 

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Really, the roles were sort of reversed for 2003... the Cobra should have been the N/a IRS corner carver, the Mach 1 should have gotten the supercharger with the SRA to be a great straight-line car
The problem there was SVT ego. The mach1 wasn't an SVT car and had to build to a lower limit. SVT wouldn't even allow them to use a Cobra Jet badge because they "feared confusion" so Mach1 owners had to settle for just an R VIN code. They even had to cut a shaker design that would open at higher speeds and closed at lower due to funding limits.

For the price difference though you could easily make the mach1 faster at the drag strip. Just needs a 4.30, rubber and full exhaust.
 

stanglife

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The problem there was SVT ego. The mach1 wasn't an SVT car and had to build to a lower limit. SVT wouldn't even allow them to use a Cobra Jet badge because they "feared confusion" so Mach1 owners had to settle for just an R VIN code. They even had to cut a shaker design that would open at higher speeds and closed at lower due to funding limits.

For the price difference though you could easily make the mach1 faster at the drag strip. Just needs a 4.30, rubber and full exhaust.
You can't really go down that road without acknowledging that the Cobra was just a pulley and tune away from substantial destruction in the 1/4.

I had an 03 Mach. I tried the NA route with that car. Ported heads, cams and the FR500 magnesium intake. I was just so so impressed. Ended up with a built motor and whipple, trapping 131.

If Ford wants to make the Mach a drag-strip king, IMO, it should go A10 and do a 428ci :) - then I start wondering if they need to somewhat gimp it or if the price would be very high - so that it doesn't cannibalize GT500 sales.

Aside from the marketing, it's starting to get hard to make a unique car for a specific purpose. ZL1 kinda does it all - and the public, at large, expects a car in this class and price to be able to go, turn and stop, very well. Hellcat is neat but it's regarding as a one-trick-pony and I have to imagine that if it was smaller, 500lbs lighter and could turn a bit better, that it would be simply bonkers and much more desirable.

So, I think a Mach 1 (Mustang) will need to be able to do it all to be impressive, like any car these days....just to what degree it does it, will be Fords concern.
 

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I personally think they should make their hybrid mustang the mach 1... 550 rwhp from a 4.5L TT V8 and electric motors driving the front wheels for a combined output of 700AWHP. It could be priced the same as the GT500, as it would be the heavyweight straight line killer and the GT500 would be the (Relatively) lightweight road racing monster
 

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You can't really go down that road without acknowledging that the Cobra was just a pulley and tune away from substantial destruction in the 1/4.

I had an 03 Mach. I tried the NA route with that car. Ported heads, cams and the FR500 magnesium intake. I was just so so impressed. Ended up with a built motor and whipple, trapping 131.

If Ford wants to make the Mach a drag-strip king, IMO, it should go A10 and do a 428ci :) - then I start wondering if they need to somewhat gimp it or if the price would be very high - so that it doesn't cannibalize GT500 sales.

Aside from the marketing, it's starting to get hard to make a unique car for a specific purpose. ZL1 kinda does it all - and the public, at large, expects a car in this class and price to be able to go, turn and stop, very well. Hellcat is neat but it's regarding as a one-trick-pony and I have to imagine that if it was smaller, 500lbs lighter and could turn a bit better, that it would be simply bonkers and much more desirable.

So, I think a Mach 1 (Mustang) will need to be able to do it all to be impressive, like any car these days....just to what degree it does it, will be Fords concern.
Personally I've never cared for FI, I'm more impressed with a nice NA build. Probably why the GT500 never appealed to me. I was more of a fan of the Shelby GT, Bullitt and BOSS cars.

THe big issue is that no one wants a "drag strip king" or a car that is only good in corners and not a line. Ford needs to find a way to merge the two like Chevy is doing. A car that is fast in a line, but can also turn. Let's face it most that buy it are if anything be enjoying it on the highway, not a track.

IMO using the GT350 as a base for that is a good start. They seem to be applying what they learned from it to the PP2 and the GT500. They just need to keep having car that is a great balance, like the ZL1, but then maybe has 2 package options. 1 more power focused the other more handling focused. A GT500 that is good in a line, and then a GT500 1LE competitor. The aftermarket can deal with the rest. The turn over in my area on Hellcats is pretty huge. I think it is due to people realizing it can ONLY do a line. The ZL1 and GT500's less so.

Personally I have no intention of ever buying Electric or Hybrid. They don't interest me at all from a driving POV, but they do appeal to the IT guy in me. I like that they exist and what they can do, but they just don't feel fun to drive. I felt that exact way about a co-workers Tesla, and its best comparison is the GT-R. Bot are fast and advanced, but both just feel soul-less. I don't care if I'm slower than the guy in the Electric car as long as I am enjoying my drive. I've yet to get that enjoyment from any non-manual car really. I don't get the engagement I want. I just feel like I'm there for the ride, not helping create the ride.
 

jake_zx2

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It really appeals to the "Pissing contest" kind of guys though... you know, the ones who will brag for days about how their car is the fastest factory car, but will never actually run it. And unfortunately, those are usually the guys with the money to buy such cars. Turn over rate on Hellcats doesn't matter all that much, what matters is TONS of people are buying them new, and that's what makes money for the manufacturer. All it needs is curb appeal and braggable numbers, and that's really all that a drag strip king consists of.

Also, keep in mind, fully electric and Hybrid are 2 totally different animals... if you offered me either a GTR or a McLaren P1, I'm sure you could guess which one I'd take, and I'd take either over a Tesla
 

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UAmach1

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It really appeals to the "Pissing contest" kind of guys though... you know, the ones who will brag for days about how their car is the fastest factory car, but will never actually run it. And unfortunately, those are usually the guys with the money to buy such cars. Turn over rate on Hellcats doesn't matter all that much, what matters is TONS of people are buying them new, and that's what makes money for the manufacturer. All it needs is curb appeal and braggable numbers, and that's really all that a drag strip king consists of.

Also, keep in mind, fully electric and Hybrid are 2 totally different animals... if you offered me either a GTR or a McLaren P1, I'm sure you could guess which one I'd take, and I'd take either over a Tesla
True enough, those are still sales and that is all Dodge cares about.

For me the PP2, Bullitt, Shelby GT, Boss and GT350 are the ONLY Mustangs to interest me since the Mach1 came out. They all have in common that they are not the fastest, but the can take a turn better than your typical Mustang.
 

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THe big issue is that no one wants a "drag strip king" or a car that is only good in corners and not a line. Ford needs to find a way to merge the two like Chevy is doing. A car that is fast in a line, but can also turn. Let's face it most that buy it are if anything be enjoying it on the highway, not a track.
They are - it's called the GT500. That's my point - people expect the cars to do everything....as manufacturers start to succeed in this - the difference between their variants of a single model (Shelby, Bullitt, Mach 1) will come down to styling and marketing...and it makes it harder and harder to carve out a performance niche case for a Mach 1, for example. Long gone are the days of being able to order whatever engine you want in a specific car - so you'll take what you're given.

If Hackett is embracing the Mach as his pet project, I'd put money on it that we will see Hybrid...if not fully electric....It could be REALLY fast.
 

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For me the PP2, Bullitt, Shelby GT, Boss and GT350 are the ONLY Mustangs to interest me since the Mach1 came out. They all have in common that they are not the fastest, but the can take a turn better than your typical Mustang.
Agreed, I'm 100% a road racing guy. I really wanted a PP2, but couldn't stretch the extra $6500 :( but the straight line cars are kinda cool just for bragging rights :ford:
 

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the difference between their variants of a single model (Shelby, Bullitt, Mach 1) will come down to styling and marketing...and it makes it harder and harder to carve out a performance niche case for a Mach 1
Performance niche case for Mach 1: dodge hellcat/demon sales
 

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Performance niche case for Mach 1: dodge hellcat/demon sales
It would be kind of cool for Ford to release a 1-2 year limited run of Mach1 CobraJet JUST to be a Demon beater. Just as a "yeah can do that too, It's just not our focus."

If Whipple really is reliably getting 775whp reliably from a 5.0 on 93 then Ford should be able to do similar for the 5.2. The demon on pump only makes 724whp.
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