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EcoVert

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Statistically, from those that track those sort of things, the former Chrysler (Chrysler, Jeep, Ram, Dodge) brands are near or at the bottom in reliability as they have been for many years. There's a reason they went bankrupt TWICE....

I don't get the "sky is falling" with Challenger outselling the Mustang. It was 293 cars. I still think it's partly because Ford has little incentives on the Mustang and there is the wrong option mix on the ground. Will be interesting to see if this is a pattern or anomaly.
The key for Challengers success is Chrysler advertises the hell out of them. I can't remember the last time I saw a Mustang commercial.
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Chameleon

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The key for Challengers success is Chrysler advertises the hell out of them. I can't remember the last time I saw a Mustang commercial.
I will say their advertising is great.
 

itguy08

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Don't worry man, FCA isn't going to make it to 2022. :lol:
FCA may well make it but Dodge and Chrysler may not. No new product, declining sales doesn't make for a long healthy life.
 

Asharus

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LOL
 

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speedfrk

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FCA may well make it but Dodge and Chrysler may not. No new product, declining sales doesn't make for a long healthy life.
Ford's problem is that they have new products and declining sales... don't get me wrong, I love Mustangs- I've had 10 of them from my 66 GT to my 2015 (which was a nightmare that Ford would never fix), but when they are outsold by a 10 yr old platform that has had one major refresh, that's a big problem.
I really think that the Challenger is the modern "personal luxury coupe" like the T-Birds and Cutlass/Regal used to be. It's big, rides nicely, fits 4 adults, plenty of power and great styling. I wish Ford would bring back the T-Bird SC. That was a great car.
 
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Supermike

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Most of the people that drive dodge challengers are good people, my coworker who is a sweetheart of a guy drive a challenger scat pack, my manager own a RT nice guy too they always complimenting my car.

I remember meeting a guy with a Camaro in the casino parking lot and he start shitting on my mustang gt telling me things like “you see mustang everywhere” “there’s no power on the coyote engine until 5k rpm” in my mind I was laughing the rivalry is real.

I’m a watch collector, when you go to an Omega watch dealer the salesman tells you how better Omega is than Rolex. When you go to a Rolex dealer you know what they say about Omega??? Zero nothing

When you go to a Chevrolet dealer to buy the Camaro the first thing they tell you is how better it is than the mustang.
When you go to a ford dealer to buy a mustang they don’t say anything about the Camaro.

Drunk post btw
 

itguy08

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Ford's problem is that they have new products and declining sales... don't get me wrong, I love Mustangs- I've had 10 of them from my 66 GT to my 2015 (which was a nightmare that Ford would never fix), but when they are outsold by a 10 yr old platform that has had one major refresh, that's a big problem.
They were outsold 1 month this year by less than 300 cars. It's not a pattern nor is it the end of the world. And it's not like Challenger sales were up in Feb. According to http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2018/0...est-selling-cars-in-america-every-car-ranked/

The Challenger was -0.2% from last Feb as well. Yes, -30.1% was bad for Mustang but is that the beginning of a trend? We'll see what March brings. The whole segment is changing and in decline.
 

TomcatDriver

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They were outsold 1 month this year by less than 300 cars. It's not a pattern nor is it the end of the world. And it's not like Challenger sales were up in Feb. According to http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2018/0...est-selling-cars-in-america-every-car-ranked/

The Challenger was -0.2% from last Feb as well. Yes, -30.1% was bad for Mustang but is that the beginning of a trend? We'll see what March brings. The whole segment is changing and in decline.
So I am left with the basic question, what changed from last year? Competitors are still pretty much the same. The big thing remaining is a minor face-lift and HP bump accompanied with a fairly large (~9%) price hike.
 

itguy08

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So I am left with the basic question, what changed from last year? Competitors are still pretty much the same. The big thing remaining is a minor face-lift and HP bump accompanied with a fairly large (~9%) price hike.

I have no idea. Competitors are not pretty much the same. From Goodcarbadcar.net - Feb 2018:

Mustang: 5800 (-30.1%)
Camaro: 3680 (-21%)
Challenger: 6093 (-0.20%)

Jan 2018 (when the same big thing also existed):
Mustang: 4732 (-6.2%)
Camaro: 2867 (-20.1%)
Challenger: 3405 (+0.40%)

Dec 2017 (when the same big thing also existed):
Mustang: 7714 (+9.20%)
Camaro: 3802 (-45.70%)
Challenger: 7714 (-22.70%)

If you look at the chart here: http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2018/01/sporty-car-sales-america-december-2017/, you'll see that even before the changes, Mustang sales were off in 2017, down 22.7%, well before the 2018 changes everyone looks to point to.

I don't know what changed but I can tell you the mix of available Mustangs at local dealers here (NE) stinks. Basically GT + PP1 and nothing else. Cloth, base stereo, no active exhaust, no magnetic ride, and in the NE, SUMMER TIRES! Uh, yeah no thanks.
 

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TomcatDriver

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I have no idea. Competitors are not pretty much the same. From Goodcarbadcar.net - Feb 2018:

Mustang: 5800 (-30.1%)
Camaro: 3680 (-21%)
Challenger: 6093 (-0.20%)

Jan 2018 (when the same big thing also existed):
Mustang: 4732 (-6.2%)
Camaro: 2867 (-20.1%)
Challenger: 3405 (+0.40%)

Dec 2017 (when the same big thing also existed):
Mustang: 7714 (+9.20%)
Camaro: 3802 (-45.70%)
Challenger: 7714 (-22.70%)

If you look at the chart here: http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2018/01/sporty-car-sales-america-december-2017/, you'll see that even before the changes, Mustang sales were off in 2017, down 22.7%, well before the 2018 changes everyone looks to point to.

I don't know what changed but I can tell you the mix of available Mustangs at local dealers here (NE) stinks. Basically GT + PP1 and nothing else. Cloth, base stereo, no active exhaust, no magnetic ride, and in the NE, SUMMER TIRES! Uh, yeah no thanks.
Sorry, when I meant competitors pretty much the same, I mean no major changes for Camaro/Challenger, but yea the segment overall is down. And I also feel your pain with the dealer option selections. A LOT of GT PP1, and virtually none with magnaride, but they all have the $900 factory nav, which with Carplay/Android Auto seems completely superfluous. I had to drive quite a ways to test drive one with magnaride, and that was a fully loaded 401A stickering at ~$50K.
 

EcoVert

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Most of the people that drive dodge challengers are good people, my coworker who is a sweetheart of a guy drive a challenger scat pack, my manager own a RT nice guy too they always complimenting my car.

I remember meeting a guy with a Camaro in the casino parking lot and he start shitting on my mustang gt telling me things like “you see mustang everywhere” “there’s no power on the coyote engine until 5k rpm” in my mind I was laughing the rivalry is real.

I’m a watch collector, when you go to an Omega watch dealer the salesman tells you how better Omega is than Rolex. When you go to a Rolex dealer you know what they say about Omega??? Zero nothing

When you go to a Chevrolet dealer to buy the Camaro the first thing they tell you is how better it is than the mustang.
When you go to a ford dealer to buy a mustang they don’t say anything about the Camaro.

Drunk post btw
When your number 2 and increasingly number 3 behind the competition like camaro you try hard to convince everyone how bad the number 1 car (Mustang) is and how superior your failing car is. The thing is the harder your try the worse your product (camaro) looks.
 

EcoVert

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They were outsold 1 month this year by less than 300 cars. It's not a pattern nor is it the end of the world. And it's not like Challenger sales were up in Feb. According to http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2018/0...est-selling-cars-in-america-every-car-ranked/

The Challenger was -0.2% from last Feb as well. Yes, -30.1% was bad for Mustang but is that the beginning of a trend? We'll see what March brings. The whole segment is changing and in decline.
What Mustang needs to really take over the segment is a descent ad campaign. I see Challenger commercials all the time and that's why I believe Challenger sales haven't really dropped off.
 

Asharus

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the other thing that challengers have are lease deals. sure, the camaro and mustang lease deals are available, but mostly for the ecoboost and v6 models. when you step up to the v8, the lease deals are non existent.

step over to dodge, and you'll see that lease deals are available and pretty amazing. not too long ago they were leasing hellcats for around 600 a month.

people, especially the younger generations today, are leasing more than buying. they like to have a fresh new car every few years. this could be another reason why the challengers are still doing well.
 

6String

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I don't know what changed but I can tell you the mix of available Mustangs at local dealers here (NE) stinks. Basically GT + PP1 and nothing else. Cloth, base stereo, no active exhaust, no magnetic ride, and in the NE, SUMMER TIRES! Uh, yeah no thanks.
You're not wrong with the numbers. But, to make sense of them you cannot narrow the view to Mustang, Camaro, and Challenger. The entire market, with a few exceptions was down in February. There has been a major shift in consumer confidence (overall people are spending less). Investors are nervous, as the stock market waffles (waiting to see how the tariff thing plays out). And interest rates are rising. People buy less when it costs more to borrow the money.

Taking a narrow perspective not much has changed. The price went up on the GT, but actually dropped on the EcoBoost. But taking a wider view, the buying public has shifted away from coupes and sedans in favor of CUVs, SUVs, and trucks. It costs more to borrow, and consumers are nervous. It will be interesting to see what happens in March. I suspect an up-tick in Camaro and Mustang sales will happen. I think GM and Ford will be forced to offer some incentives to clear inventory.
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