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Shudder / Shaking Misfire Under Load - not spark plugs
TEXAS HEAT
Well-Known Member
NGK Iridium's? What heat range? I would recommend a minimum of a .028 gap and one heat range colder than stock. The iridium's can be gapped with a set of feeler gauges, you just need to be very careful not to damage the tip on the electrode.
Turbong
Well-Known Member
I think he is talking about the MC plugs, I did see the box mentioned not gap them which I also thought "well how the hell am I suppose to get them to spec?". Based on what evidence should it be one step colder on a stock or FP tune? I ran those on stock tune on my observed evidence they looked kind of fouled up within a few thousand miles which reads too cold for the stock setup.
TEXAS HEAT
Well-Known Member
One heat range colder plug will help to mitigate LSPI by creating an environment in the combustion chamber that is less conducive for pre-ignition. The stock heat range plugs work well, but the OP is having an undiagnosed issue, which could be LSPI.
I do think he mentioned he used NGK's though, presumably one heat range colder...? Misfires, bucking and the other symptoms he's experiencing, sounds either spark or fuel related.
Turbong
Well-Known Member
Okay but that may be so in theory and depending on one's mod level or engine, for this case of these engines and my observed evidence (which im not the only that has reported this) how would you explain prematurely excessive fouling other than it's just too cold for this setup? I too fell for the "LSPI prevention, buy these now" but it seems vendor's claims do not always line up with reality.
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krack999
Well-Known Member
Not to hijack this thread, but...
Hmm, I have the "Ocatane Adjust" switch to "ON" for my 2017 MT PP ecoboost. Should I switch it to "OFF"? Does everyone else switch it to "OFF"?
I also run the NGK's with the gap hovering on what could be too much (0.030). Crazy thing that seemed to help my car run better was honestly adding 2 gallons of E85 along with 93 to make my care E20. It really seemed to help the performance of the car in this configuration.
Hmm, I have the "Ocatane Adjust" switch to "ON" for my 2017 MT PP ecoboost. Should I switch it to "OFF"? Does everyone else switch it to "OFF"?
I also run the NGK's with the gap hovering on what could be too much (0.030). Crazy thing that seemed to help my car run better was honestly adding 2 gallons of E85 along with 93 to make my care E20. It really seemed to help the performance of the car in this configuration.
Turbong
Well-Known Member
I would not switch it on unless necessary as it states in the procal manual, which in this case might help the OP since he IS having misfire issues.
"The Profile Learning switch should only be switched to “ON” when the engine is reporting a misfire DTC such as P0300-P0316. By enabling this switch, the engine will prompt the driver to rev the engine to a specific rpm until the PCM relearns the fire pattern characteristics of the trigger wheel."
RedEcoJet
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My 2015 automatic has this same stumble/misfire like problem. I feel it when I go up overpasses or slight rises on the road. Only seems to do it upon a slight load. Very annoying. I had the Brisk plugs one heat range cooler for about 15K miles when this started. I replaced them thinking it was the plugs. Seemed slightly better for about 1500 miles. Since it's middle of winter I thought going back to stock plugs (hotter) might fix it. Replaced the Brisks with the exact same model plugs that came in the car. That didn't help either. I hope someone figures this out. I drive on a lot of flat roads in Ohio, but this past weekend it drove me nuts in the hills of PA.
Apple
New Member
RedEcoJet, being that you have been driving in the frigid north like myself, have you noticed any temperature related patterns? When I drive the car on a cold engine, it smoothly responds to throttle inputs under light loads in the 1250 to 1600 RPM range. -and then sure as $hit, every time, when CHT's stabilize around 180*, the throttle no longer works in that range. It'll stumble, hesitate, and vibrate until the transmission downshifts.
Traditionally, this sounds like an ignition problem the more I dig into it. Temperatures and resistance rise in either the distributor, coil pack, or wires leading to a weak spark. As RPM increases, the problem becomes less noticeable. It might be worth trying new coil packs.
I have new plugs on the way to test, Procal profile learning, and then coil packs.
Hopefully there aren't larger problems, but I'm going to do a compression tests on the cylinders just so I feel better. (Or worse)
GJarrett
Well-Known Member
- Thread starter
- #40
I tried the ProCal profile learning, but Procal needs a CEL to do it. When you load the profile learning test, the computer will instruct you to blip the throttle to 4k rpms until the "MIL" (check engine light) goes off. My CEL is not on.
Before the rapidly building mini-thread about spark plugs overtakes this one; as the title states, my problem is not spark plug related. With tune, now without tune, with original plugs, with replacement plugs, the problem remains. It ran fine on stock heat range plugs with the tune per FP's recommendation to keep stock heat range plugs for their tune, and is now back to stock factory tune which seems to work fine with the gaps I have and the heat range it came with that tens of thousands of other Ecoboost owners have no problem with.
I am going to wait to hear from my service mgr what Ford has to say before making more assumptions. I do think two things are interesting. The cold weather guys not having the issue until the engine warms up may be an important clue. Also what I've learned about imbalance with the harmonic balancer causing a misfire might be akin to a belt tensioner going out - I do think I can almost hear a wobbly sound right before it starts misfiring.
I'll try to keep the thread clean and attempt to refrain from making too many more comments until we get this sorted out with a true fix.
Before the rapidly building mini-thread about spark plugs overtakes this one; as the title states, my problem is not spark plug related. With tune, now without tune, with original plugs, with replacement plugs, the problem remains. It ran fine on stock heat range plugs with the tune per FP's recommendation to keep stock heat range plugs for their tune, and is now back to stock factory tune which seems to work fine with the gaps I have and the heat range it came with that tens of thousands of other Ecoboost owners have no problem with.
I am going to wait to hear from my service mgr what Ford has to say before making more assumptions. I do think two things are interesting. The cold weather guys not having the issue until the engine warms up may be an important clue. Also what I've learned about imbalance with the harmonic balancer causing a misfire might be akin to a belt tensioner going out - I do think I can almost hear a wobbly sound right before it starts misfiring.
I'll try to keep the thread clean and attempt to refrain from making too many more comments until we get this sorted out with a true fix.
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ElAviator72
Well-Known Member
Do something to cause a CEL: Disconnect the upstream oxygen sensor and start up, then plug it back in ;) Hopefully, that's one of the ones that takes 2-3 starts before the code self clears...
ElAviator72
Well-Known Member
Taking a plug out should work, then :lol:It needs to be a misfire CEL, silly
RedEcoJet
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I do think mine is better when cold. Or before it's warmed up. I've always used 93 but I'm going to try 89 for a few weeks and see if there is any difference. The misfire seems like it has too much spark advance. Then drops back when giving it more pedal.
RedEcoJet
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89 better
I'm on day three of using 89 instead of 93. Been through a tankful and just filled up again last night. The mis-fire feeling is still there, but if I wasn't already sensitized I don't think I would notice it. When going up a hill at a steady speed, I now get more of a typical loaded growl for just a bit then it will downshift if needed.
I don't think this fixes it by any means, but it is less noticeable. The performance difference is almost negligible. Seems to maybe have slightly less raw power (if that's a thing), but is seems more snappy.
I'm going to drive on the 89 for a few more weeks and then switch back to 93 to see if the mis-fire is any different.
I'm on day three of using 89 instead of 93. Been through a tankful and just filled up again last night. The mis-fire feeling is still there, but if I wasn't already sensitized I don't think I would notice it. When going up a hill at a steady speed, I now get more of a typical loaded growl for just a bit then it will downshift if needed.
I don't think this fixes it by any means, but it is less noticeable. The performance difference is almost negligible. Seems to maybe have slightly less raw power (if that's a thing), but is seems more snappy.
I'm going to drive on the 89 for a few more weeks and then switch back to 93 to see if the mis-fire is any different.
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