Rev Matching?

ihc95 · Jan 16, 2015

Hey guys, I'm curious as to why the new GT350(R) does not come with rev-matching on the 6-speed manual. Chevy, Nissan, BMW, and Porshce all give you rev-matching with their manuals. I just find it a bit odd Ford would leave this off the Mustang, especially the GT350 where the rev matching would be really helpful on the track. This feature would also make the car easier to drive in traffic.

Anyone else want rev-matching?

Cruzinaround · Jan 16, 2015

ASFAIK... Rev matching is typically a learned skill after you've become accustomed to the RPM band on the vehicle and of course also familiar with heel toe shifting.

The auto rev matching is the lazy man's way of doing it. Its also the way of the grandfather that's too old to wanna do the leg work but wants a nice ride like my dad and his Corvette Stingray. If the experience in this car is meant to be more of a traditional old school visceral experience then it makes sense for the buyer..to be a bit more advanced in skills than a computer cued rev match.

Cruzinaround · Jan 16, 2015

But, I also wouldn't complain if the feature was there for me to turn on or off as desired.

ihc95 · Jan 16, 2015

Cruzinaround said:
ASFAIK... Rev matching is typically a learned skill after you've become accustomed to the RPM band on the vehicle and of course also familiar with heel toe shifting.

The auto rev matching is the lazy man's way of doing it. Its also the way of the grandfather that's too old to wanna do the leg work but wants a nice ride like my dad and his Corvette Stingray. If the experience in this car is meant to be more of a traditional old school visceral experience then it makes sense for the buyer..to be a bit more advanced in skills than a computer cued rev match.

I hear you, but for someone like myself, it would be a huge bonus. Having never actually owned a manual car myself, I'm far from good at heel toe shifting. As I do plan to track my next vehicle, I think auto rev-matching would be a great tool to both learn from and prevent any potential damage to the car from a not-so-ideal shift.

Cruzinaround · Jan 16, 2015

ihc95 said:
I hear you, but for someone like myself, it would be a huge bonus. Having never actually owned a manual car myself, I'm far from good at heel toe shifting. As I do plan to track my next vehicle, I think auto rev-matching would be a great tool to both learn from and prevent any potential damage to the car from a not-so-ideal shift.

May I suggest racing school. It would do you better to actually learn how to do it....besides as is...if you want this car...you're gonna need to.

It's almost an automatic reflex to just do it once you get used to it. You'll be doing it everywhere you go just because you can.

And When your friends are in the Passenger seat it really let's them know...you got this.

OppoLock · Jan 16, 2015

Cruzinaround said:
ASFAIK... Rev matching is typically a learned skill after you've become accustomed to the RPM band on the vehicle and of course also familiar with heel toe shifting.

The auto rev matching is the lazy man's way of doing it. Its also the way of the grandfather that's too old to wanna do the leg work but wants a nice ride like my dad and his Corvette Stingray. If the experience in this car is meant to be more of a traditional old school visceral experience then it makes sense for the buyer..to be a bit more advanced in skills than a computer cued rev match.

That is strictly from a purist's perspective. You could make the same argument toward ABS and traction control systems. Automated rev matching is more efficient - end of story. You could learn how to perfect threshold braking, meter out throttle inputs, and blip the throttle to just the right degree on a downshift, but having ABS, TCS, and auto rev-matching will make you more consistent every single time.

I wish my GT came with it.

w3rkn · Jan 16, 2015

Oppo^
I can almost thread my gears without a clutch (not racing of coarse) because you learn the gearbox.

Secondly, there are times when You hold a higher rev, than nec for meshing gears, because I am using the clutch as a form of traction, etc. A lot of people let their left foot modulate hp to the ground, HOW they like it. Rev-matching is great for people who don't want to make a conscious effort all the time, if ever.

But rev-matching merits are gained in throttle racing. (ie: replacing heal-toe)

Cruzinaround · Jan 16, 2015

OppoLock said:
That is strictly from a purist's perspective. You could make the same argument toward ABS and traction control systems. Automated rev matching is more efficient - end of story. You could learn how to perfect threshold braking, meter out throttle inputs, and blip the throttle to just the right degree on a downshift, but having ABS, TCS, and auto rev-matching will make you more consistent every single time.

I wish my GT came with it.

There's a reason there are defeats to over ride the very safety features you're speaking about. It's not so much a purist thing as it is a requirement is some racing events. So like I said... I wouldn't mind having it so long as I can turn that feature on or off as desired, But I also ain't crying that it's not there because I like to employ the Heel/toe and rev matching that I actually took the time to learn how to do.

Cruzinaround · Jan 16, 2015

w3rkn said:
Oppo^
I can almost thread my gears without a clutch (not racing of coarse) because you learn the gearbox.

Secondly, there are times when You hold a higher rev, than nec for meshing gears, because I am using the clutch as a form of traction, etc. A lot of people let their left foot modulate hp to the ground, HOW they like it. Rev-matching is great for people who don't want to make a conscious effort all the time, if ever.

But rev-matching merits are gained in throttle racing. (ie: replacing heal-toe)

I get that. Sometimes the effort to use engine braking on the tracks you're more familiar with serve the driver better than simply applying the brakes. Depends on how you attack into the apex.

It's not like rev matching is a safety feature in normal driving though. Where ABS and Traction control are.

Still better to learn how to do it than just rely on it automatically. Or simply just wait for the next gen Mustang to come out with a DCT. This has a Tremac and a row your own setup. So learning how to "rev your own would only be beneficial. Especially since AFAIK there is no rev matching in this GT350 so .... embrace it.

Trackaholic · Jan 16, 2015

Defeatable auto rev-match should be a no-brainer on a car like this.

It is can be very helpful when learning a new track, learning the car, or when going for that ultimate lap. In all cases, it allows the driver to focus more on the line, the braking points, and being smooth. Also, I will always prefer a stick shift over an automatic like a DCT, and I am hopeful that a feature like this will help keep the manual relevant enough so it doesn't disappear completely.

The ability to turn the feature off is a necessity, because there are other times when performing a good heel/toe shift brings a sense of accomplishment and satisfaction.

When I drove the C7 at Ron Fellows (after a couple sessions devoted only to heel/toe), I really appreciated the ability to have the auto rev-match turned on while still attempting my own heel/toe shifting. When I'd screw it up, the auto feature would fix it. When I did a good one, the car wouldn't need to do anything. You could listen outside the car and if you heard a "double-blip" you'd know that I didn't get it quite right.

Very glad Nissan got this started back on the 370Z, and hope that more MFG's follow up with the feature.

-T

vanguard · Jan 16, 2015

my guess is cost: the mustang is a relatively cheap car

OppoLock · Jan 16, 2015

Cruzinaround said:
There's a reason there are defeats to over ride the very safety features you're speaking about. It's not so much a purist thing as it is a requirement is some racing events. So like I said... I wouldn't mind having it so long as I can turn that feature on or off as desired, But I also ain't crying that it's not there because I like to employ the Heel/toe and rev matching that I actually took the time to learn how to do.

Race regs can vary to make TCS a mandatory inclusion or forbidden. For road-going cars, it can be weather or performance related. Either way, I'm agreeing with you that having the feature and including the ability to disable it is an ideal scenario.

But my whole issue in the beginning was your use of "lazy", that's all.

w3rkn said:
Oppo^
I can almost thread my gears without a clutch (not racing of coarse) because you learn the gearbox.

Secondly, there are times when You hold a higher rev, than nec for meshing gears, because I am using the clutch as a form of traction, etc. A lot of people let their left foot modulate hp to the ground, HOW they like it. Rev-matching is great for people who don't want to make a conscious effort all the time, if ever.

But rev-matching merits are gained in throttle racing. (ie: replacing heal-toe)

I think the only really necessary time to heel-toe is under heavy braking, like you mentioned in a racing scenario. Having the ability to focus strictly on braking pressure while leaving your foot anchored in place and letting the computers sort out throttle stabs is a huge boon. If you want to engine brake or practice heel-toes because they're fun, the feature could be defeated.

OppoLock · Jan 16, 2015

Trackaholic said:
Defeatable auto rev-match should be a no-brainer on a car like this.

It is can be very helpful when learning a new track, learning the car, or when going for that ultimate lap. In all cases, it allows the driver to focus more on the line, the braking points, and being smooth. Also, I will always prefer a stick shift over an automatic like a DCT, and I am hopeful that a feature like this will help keep the manual relevant enough so it doesn't disappear completely.

The ability to turn the feature off is a necessity, because there are other times when performing a good heel/toe shift brings a sense of accomplishment and satisfaction.

When I drove the C7 at Ron Fellows (after a couple sessions devoted only to heel/toe), I really appreciated the ability to have the auto rev-match turned on while still attempting my own heel/toe shifting. When I'd screw it up, the auto feature would fix it. When I did a good one, the car wouldn't need to do anything. You could listen outside the car and if you heard a "double-blip" you'd know that I didn't get it quite right.

Very glad Nissan got this started back on the 370Z, and hope that more MFG's follow up with the feature.

-T

I was blown away by its concept back when the Z debuted. Such a great idea.

Max57 · Jan 16, 2015

For me, rev matching would be a nice option, but no where near a necessity or deal breaker. What I really like is the 'Hill Assist', especially in these hilly roads in Central VA. ;)

Cruzinaround · Jan 16, 2015

OppoLock said:
Race regs can vary to make TCS a mandatory inclusion or forbidden. For road-going cars, it can be weather or performance related. Either way, I'm agreeing with you that having the feature and including the ability to disable it is an ideal scenario.

But my whole issue in the beginning was your use of "lazy", that's all.

Being lazy is my mental association on it. Simply because I saw the progression in my Grandfather then my Father with no desire to do the foot clutch thing anymore as they aged. Patience with it and timing degrades as we age... so until I get there myself I can only see it as lazy for a younger person and as possibly a convenience for elderly person's.

Its like having a discussion about the weight of a 3.5Lbs Vs a 2.5Lbs laptop being uncomfortable to carry around when that person complaining is a young spry and healthy individual. Its different when its an older person that is frail and weak.

That's my connection to it anyway. It wasn't meant to label anyone.

Rev Matching?

ihc95

Well-Known Member

Cruzinaround

Banned

Cruzinaround

Banned

ihc95

Well-Known Member

Cruzinaround

Banned

OppoLock

RWD Addict

w3rkn

Well-Known Member

Cruzinaround

Banned

Cruzinaround

Banned

Trackaholic

Well-Known Member

vanguard

Well-Known Member

OppoLock

RWD Addict

OppoLock

RWD Addict

Max57

Well-Known Member

Cruzinaround

Banned