Weight mods...

Darkane · Aug 6, 2016

nastang87xx said:
The fact that they didn't use aluminum on the doors, roof, and the trunk after using it on the F150 I personally think is just a ridiculous decision. That's probably 50lbs right there alone. Unless they couldn't pass safety or something.

EDIT: actually, probably more than 50lbs.

I think they would have to re-crash the vehicle with those aluminum components. So, just for the 350 it wasn't worth it. I'm not 100% sure either.

As a side note, I thought I read somewhere Ford didn't want to do an all aluminum mustang because the weight savings (150-200lbs) wouldn't result in great enough MPG increases for the price. In the car, the lower cd will allow it to be slippery enough to gain MPG from panel redesign and engine tech. Total weight is great for us enthusiasts and gear heads, but hard to quantify for the average joe mustang buyer. Also it would drive up the BASE price too much.

Donkey · Aug 6, 2016

Darkane said:
I doubt you'd save any weight with a hood. The front end of the car is aluminum. You might save 5 lbs with hood, and both fenders combined!

I've looked into this - it gets tricky.

Here are my suggestions: (keep in mind to keep the character of the car equal weight should be taken from front to back)

1) wheels: save 40-60lbs
2) rear seat delete: save 32lbs
3) headers and exhaust: save 20lbs

That is where most people will stop, let's keep going

4) lithium battery: saves 25lbs (at the front of the car!)
5) replace the rear diff pumpkin to the GT automatic unit. Being all aluminum it saves about 22lbs
6) Carbon fiber trunk lid: saves 20lbs
7) aluminum rear bumper beam: save 10lbs
8) lightweight seats: I wouldn't replace stock recaros but 50lbs or more can be saved here

That's the next batch of mods, next it gets really expensive

9) carbon ceramic rotors: I've been looking into ZR1 units to see if they'll work with our aluminum rotor hats. They might, the GTR camp has figured this out.
Save 8 lbs per corner for about 32 total
10) I DO NOT RECOMMEND THIS: carbon fiber doors save 50 lbs

Then you can do lexan windows, AC/radio delete, strip sound deadening/carpets.

Those total will give another 50-75lbs. I wouldn't do it.

Let's tally:

Step 1: 82-102
Step 2: 130ish
Step 3: 80ish
Step 4: 50-75

Total: 350-400lbs. Worth it?

Later some aftermarket may come out with aluminum subframes, control arms, hopefully next refresh Ford will have aluminum door skins etc. There's a bit more room.

How would the ZR1 rotor work with a pinned aluminum hat? Lol

You can't remove the rotor from the hat on 350 rotors.

1LEThumper · Aug 6, 2016

Donkey said:
How would the ZR1 rotor work with a pinned aluminum hat? Lol

You can't remove the rotor from the hat on 350 rotors.

Not only that but the carbon rotors and hats are assembled and measured as complete units. Carbon rotors wear via weight, not thickness and that assembled weight is on every set, changing that would not let you know when you needed to replace them.

Also carbon rotors do require a much deeper pad shape and calipers would have to go with it. Not saying it wouldn't work but generally speaking you should have to take the caliper and pads with it. Compare piston sizes to see if it would work with the OEM master setup and then make some sort of adapter bracket.

There are a few companies making aftermarket carbon/ceramic brakes but I don't really see the point, the stock ones work...just a bit dusty.

Now my buddy at Essex is working on a two piece floating AP hat and rotor for the car which will take a lot of weight off the car.

https://www.essexparts.com/my-vehicle/2016/Ford/Mustang/GT%20Performance%20Pack

They don't have the GT350 page up yet.

Variance · Aug 6, 2016

Myshelby3425 said:
The lithium batteries aren't very reliable on a daily correct? Also who makes the aluminum rear bumper beam?

My understanding is that it's actually the opposite. LiPo batteries or small AGM batteries work well in applications where the car is frequently driven, consistently charging the battery, but you can run into issues with parasitic draw when the car sits for an extended period of time (more than a week).

Darkane · Aug 6, 2016

Donkey said:
How would the ZR1 rotor work with a pinned aluminum hat? Lol

You can't remove the rotor from the hat on 350 rotors.

Like I said I've just begun looking at it. I thought the zr1 rotors were pinned with their own hat?

I could be wrong, not well versed in the brakes.

GTR guys are seeing about 55lbs in savings switching to the carbon units.

cjgt350 · Aug 6, 2016

No mention yet of a single piece carbon fiber driveshaft. Drop 18lbs and bonus being rotational mass.

Donkey · Aug 6, 2016

1LEThumper said:
Not only that but the carbon rotors and hats are assembled and measured as complete units. Carbon rotors wear via weight, not thickness and that assembled weight is on every set, changing that would not let you know when you needed to replace them.

Also carbon rotors do require a much deeper pad shape and calipers would have to go with it. Not saying it wouldn't work but generally speaking you should have to take the caliper and pads with it. Compare piston sizes to see if it would work with the OEM master setup and then make some sort of adapter bracket.

There are a few companies making aftermarket carbon/ceramic brakes but I don't really see the point, the stock ones work...just a bit dusty.

Now my buddy at Essex is working on a two piece floating AP hat and rotor for the car which will take a lot of weight off the car.

https://www.essexparts.com/my-vehicle/2016/Ford/Mustang/GT%20Performance%20Pack

They don't have the GT350 page up yet.

Sounds like a major pain in the ass.

The ap deal sounds promising.

Aren't a lot of z28 guys switching to iron due to maintenance costs? I know I've read that somewhere.

Darkane · Aug 6, 2016

cjgt350 said:
No mention yet of a single piece carbon fiber driveshaft. Drop 18lbs and bonus being rotational mass.

Yeah I didn't mention it for a reason. The static weight drop it ok, however the rotational mass is so close to its centre axis it doesn't actually help that much.

Think of it this way: swing a mass with a 24" rope and the same mass with a 6" rope. Try to reach the same rotational speed.

Wheels work the best here because of outer barrel weight reduction. A carbon fiber barrel wheel with aluminum or steel center should have less rotational forces at the barrel than an equal weight flow forged aluminum wheel. Therefore quicker responses.

GoneFlying · Aug 7, 2016

Some input on lithium batteries!!!!
I haven't personally used lithium in a car application but we use them a lot in the experimental aircraft market. We have had great success with the EarthX line of lithium batteries. We have gone from using 15.5 lb batteries to 5.5 lb EarthX. I noticed they have a automobile line of batteries. EarthX has designed and engineered a completely redundant battery management system to protect their battery from over discharge, over charge, built in cell balancing, short circuit protection, and excessive cranking protection in addition to the integrated cell balancing technology. EarthX is located in the Denver area and has awesome customer support.

http://earthxbatteries.com

If you call EarthX let them know that STOLQuest recommended them.
Cheers!!!!

Stuntman · Aug 7, 2016

There's a bunch of OEMs using lithium and high quality aftermarket offerings. IMO that would be my first mod since its where you don't want the weight: high and up front.

xt6wagon · Aug 7, 2016

One of the issues is that the GT350 is nose heavy at 54/46. All the easy wieght is low and/or to the rear. This means that weight reduction can be counter productive. Things like the mufflers and the rear bumper beam shift the wieght even more on the nose. Driveshaft will have minimal effect outside of the slight power to wieght buff as its central and low.

Unfortunately there is no easy weight on the nose. You like the radiator. You like the oil cooler. You like the transmission cooler. You really like that engine.

TTony · Sep 18, 2016

Darkane said:
I think they would have to re-crash the vehicle with those aluminum components. So, just for the 350 it wasn't worth it. I'm not 100% sure either.

As a side note, I thought I read somewhere Ford didn't want to do an all aluminum mustang because the weight savings (150-200lbs) wouldn't result in great enough MPG increases for the price. In the car, the lower cd will allow it to be slippery enough to gain MPG from panel redesign and engine tech. Total weight is great for us enthusiasts and gear heads, but hard to quantify for the average joe mustang buyer. Also it would drive up the BASE price too much.

Incorrect regarding the re-crash item. Ford certainly crash tested the 350 as the engine is different (and especially fuel related components that are key item analyzed in crash testing...) .

I'm going with the path you were heading down on your second point and saying it was due to cost of the components themselves. And they weren't willing to launch new suppliers or create new versions of those parts (that looked the same) just to switch them to aluminum.

2morrow · Nov 25, 2017

Bringing this back...Great thread.

I'm looking to do a lot of what [MENTION=22615]Darkane[/MENTION] laid out but my budget will definitely fall short of the 350 total pounds lost.

sublime1996525 · Dec 5, 2017

opcorn:

mkonrad · Dec 6, 2017

I think most of those numbers are optimistic, and too much weight is coming off the rear. My few data points follow.

My diet is coming in under budget.

* I fit a carbon fiber trunk to mine, and it was 9#, have seen estimates as low as 7#, compared to stock at 20#. That's 10#, not 20#.
* Unless you get a lucky wheel config at 21-22#, or carbon fiber takeoffs, mine were a somewhat typical 23# which is 8# under stock. Tires may save a bit if you pick PSC2 over PSS, but you're closer to 40# and again on the low side of estimates.
* My Sparco reclining seats saved 25# over tech sofas.
* FP Borla is lighter than stock exhaust due to resonators being deleted. Closer to 10# on the high side, but the claim included headers.

Weight mods...

Darkane

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Donkey

Large member

1LEThumper

Well-Known Member

Variance

Well-Known Member

Darkane

Well-Known Member

cjgt350

Adrenaline Junkie

Donkey

Large member

Darkane

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GoneFlying

Active Member

Stuntman

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xt6wagon

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TTony

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2morrow

DesignR/DriveR/RiceEatR

sublime1996525

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mkonrad

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