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MT Head 2 Head - 2018 Camaro SS 1LE vs 2018 Mustang GT

Trackaholic

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I disagree with that. The GT350 specifically can't get out of the way of a similarly sized, cheaper Camaro 1LE with a lot less power, and costing a lot less.

Is not a matter of being "defective" or "incorrect". It is a matter of how good it can be on track while meeting a design point for road comfort.

I think both the GT350 as well as the Ford GT fall short on handling compared to cheaper GM products. It all comes down to experience and development budget. GM cumulatively has spent a lot more hours and a lot more $$$ tuning magnetic shocks than Ford.
You say this alot, but I'm not seeing evidence to back it up. GT350 and 1LE seem to be pretty even from what I can tell.

The GT350R is also quite a bit faster, and seems to be tuned just fine. I don't think this is a matter of capability, but rather intent.

I think you should just get the 1LE, since it seems to have everything you want.

What are you waiting for? Just do it....

And be sure to post track vids with the PDR. ;-)

-T
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1320'

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You say this alot, but I'm not seeing evidence to back it up. GT350 and 1LE seem to be pretty even from what I can tell.

The GT350R is also quite a bit faster, and seems to be tuned just fine. I don't think this is a matter of capability, but rather intent.

I think you should just get the 1LE, since it seems to have everything you want.

What are you waiting for? Just do it....

And be sure to post track vids with the PDR. ;-)

-T
Pretty much.

If the love affair with the Camaro is so real...go make it happen.
 

gmlt1

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The same argument can be made comparing the GT350R to the ZL1. How one has more power yet we know who won that comparison.



While your entitled to your opinion, I can’t see where this post has any factual merit. The GT350 is magical. Period. It’s sum is greater than its parts, and you never hear anyone praising any Camaro like they did that GT350. As for the Ford GT, it won Le Mans first time out. It best the best from Ferrari. Last I remember no GM product even finished the race. Car and Driver just ran the GT at VIR and it set the record. They were faster than even the Porsche 918.

I have tremendous respect for what GM has brought to the peformance table over the years. They have a very good Racing program and compete and win. But less not get carried away. GM has nothing on the GT and never will. They don’t have that kind of pedigree.

The Gt350 is magical?? I have not seen any track times for the GT350, the SS1LE does on the other hand have many track time's listed. Has there ever been a SS1LE GT350 H2H on any track? For 10k more and 70 horse power more I would hope it would be competitive. The GTLM class that the GT competes in, Corvette won the Manufacture's title. For a street car you are correct, GM has nothing on the $500,000 car, but the $100,000 ZO6 was only 1.6 seconds slower on the VIR, and the $70K ZL11LE was 2.7 seconds slower.
 

thill444

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The Gt350 is magical?? I have not seen any track times for the GT350, the SS1LE does on the other hand have many track time's listed. Has there ever been a SS1LE GT350 H2H on any track? For 10k more and 70 horse power more I would hope it would be competitive. The GTLM class that the GT competes in, Corvette won the Manufacture's title. For a street car you are correct, GM has nothing on the $500,000 car, but the $100,000 ZO6 was only 1.6 seconds slower on the VIR, and the $70K ZL11LE was 2.7 seconds slower.
There is so much more to the driving experience than just magazine race times. The sound. The steering feel. The shifter feel. The way an engine is tuned and responds to throttle input.

The GT350 is not the fastest car around the track, but it's still very fast but nailed all those other area I mentioned that don't translate to metrics or performance specs. It's why many people (including Motor Trend) often pick the GT350 vs the completion. They simply prefer driving it more.

If all anyone ever cared about was performance specs and nothing else it would be a boring place. As many people who like to go fast straight would all be driving a Tesla.

It's why it's nice having a choice. I totally get why somoeone would want a Camaro over a Mustang and vice versa. Or a Charger, etc.
 

Eritas

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Trackaholic

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GM is definitely killing it in the performance department these days. Cadillac, Camaro, Vette, some of the best handling cars around right now. I think Ford is right there with the GT350, so it would be nice to see some of that trickle down to the standard Mustang. The PP2 is close, but some coolers would make it just about perfect.

Love what Ford did with the Ford GT. Probably the only car I’d be willing to spend $500,000 on. Will probably “settle” for a mid-engine vette at some point, assuming it maintains the pace of improvements that the Vette has been seeing. Hopefully Ford will continue pushing the performance envelope as well, but I honestly don’t have much faith given their recent cuts and strategy. A Lincoln GT based on the Mustang would be a good start.

-T
 

jake_zx2

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So where are all these other 11.8s at? I mean there should be plenty of them out there right?
Just wanted to update you, there was just a post in the Anything Coyote facebook page in which 3 (last time I saw, could have gone up by now) have already posted their bone stock A10 GT 11.8-11.9 runs
 

thehunterooo

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Just wanted to update you, there was just a post in the Anything Coyote facebook page in which 3 (last time I saw, could have gone up by now) have already posted their bone stock A10 GT 11.8-11.9 runs
Can we trust a Mustang Facebook group?
 

jake_zx2

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Can we trust a Mustang Facebook group?
I mean, with time slips posted, how is it any less credible than the C6 fast list (which the camaro guys like to quote quite often... they didn't care about magazine times until the mustang started running 11.8)
 

millhouse

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I love my Mustang but you can't argue how much better stuff the Camaro has (coolers, diff, lighter). Plus, I just read this:
Man, it's a good thing they all have those fancy coolers for their daily commutes. How in the world we survived with only one cooler instead of three is beyond me. :shrug:
 

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There are a lot of misconceptions here as to how the "magnetic suspension" works and what it can do.

First, there is no such thing as "magnetic suspension". They are magnetic shocks. The shocks are the only things that can be adjusted electronically.

The mag shocks only work well, if:
1 - The rest of the suspension (geometry, springs, anti-roll bars, attach points) also works well.
2 - Their programing is done well.

Ford just started using magnetic shocks. GM (and its subsidiaries) invented the technology and have been using it and learning to tun it for the better part of a decade - on Corvette, Camaro, CTS-V, ATS-V, etc.

Who do you think has a better chance of getting it right?
I don't think anyone here believes the springs can be adjusted. Most of us know it is a magnetorheological fluid filled damper and separate spring.
1 - The suspension setup for the 2018 is mostly borrowed design from the GT350.
2 - The programming is done as a joint development project between Delphi and Ford. As a 2018 owner, I can tell you the programming is just fine.

Ford has been using magneride for years on the GT350, and the system was handed down to the 2018 PP. GM didn't invent magneride. Delphi invented the technology for GM to use on the Cadillac Seville. I think Ford and GM have equal chances to get the system right, as they both rely heavily on Delphi. I work as a supplier to the big automotive companies. You think we don't use lessons learned on one company's projects and apply them to another company's project?
 

bootlegger

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Man, it's a good thing they all have those fancy coolers for their daily commutes. How in the world we survived with only one cooler instead of three is beyond me. :shrug:
Honestly, all the extra coolers are completely pointless for most. Unless you hit decent length road courses regularly, you will never see the benefit. I am glad they weren't standard on the PP1. Just more places for possible leaks as the car ages. Sure, it would be nice to see them as an option, but I have no problem with the car as is.
 

millhouse

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Honestly, all the extra coolers are completely pointless for most. Unless you hit decent length road courses regularly, you will never see the benefit. I am glad they weren't standard on the PP1. Just more places for possible leaks as the car ages. Sure, it would be nice to see them as an option, but I have no problem with the car as is.
Exactly. They have their place, but it's foolish to think it's somehow an advantage for cars that will never see the track.
 

MaskedRacerX

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Man, it's a good thing they all have those fancy coolers for their daily commutes.
"Hey Bro, on my way, I'm in the Starbucks drive through ..."

"What's that? Nah, no issues with overheating I've got mad coolers."

"My Frappuccino Mocha is up Bro, see you at the gym!"
 

jake_zx2

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I'm glad the PP1 didn't have coolers, but I have to say, I'm really disappointed that the PP2 didn't get them... that's a more track-focused car, and it really does deserve them
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