[?] '18 Intake Manifold on '15-'17

Sticking my my GT350 setup for now. Going to see how it works with some L&M intake cams and a ported GT350TB.

Cream Puff said:

gt350 TB is poop.. it doesn't make any extra power on the 15-17's even with a GT350 manifold, and causes drivability/tune issues. Even with the GT350 intake tuners suggest using the adapter plate and the GT TB.

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Lund has done a really great job marketing that line. You hear it repeated all the time, stated as fact no less.

I ordered mine from Hellhorse Performance. I've never done business with them in the past, but they have been answering my facebook messages, so that's cool. On their site they offered Ford pigtail connectors, or MMR CCMV lockouts. I went with the Ford option, so hopefully my dealer doesn't have a fit over warranty stuff. I plan to run the Ford Procal tune, as again, I want to keep warranty (if possible). It might be a while before I install it, because I want to ship it off to be ported first. As of typing this, my car is 100% stock, so this would be my first mod. I'll try and rememebr to come back here and post results.

https://hellhorseperformance.com/co...d-mustang-gt-intake-manifold-15-18-mustang-gt

Was just talking about this with a buddy who also has a S550.

We're both going to run 18 intake manifolds on our 17's and were hashing out wether it's worth having them ported or not.

Does anyone on here have experience they can share around the gains that can be expected from porting the 2018 intake?

Both our cars are basically PP cars with FRPP2 kits and catbacks on them.

Anyone that wants to throw this manifold on without tuning for it should do so keeping an eye on your AFR and fuel trims. More power means more airflow which will take more fuel to achieve target AFR. Anyone on E85 should certainly be cautious as you could run out of injector and go lean up top.

Nuked said:

Anyone that wants to throw this manifold on without tuning for it should do so keeping an eye on your AFR and fuel trims. More power means more airflow which will take more fuel to achieve target AFR. Anyone on E85 should certainly be cautious as you could run out of injector and go lean up top.

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What's your opinion of running it with the Ford Procal tune and stock injectors on 93.

Anyone that wants to throw this manifold on without tuning for it should do so keeping an eye on your AFR and fuel trims. More power means more airflow which will take more fuel to achieve target AFR.

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While that's true and you should definitely be monitoring AFRs, the good news is that the computer is smart enough to make adjustments for these relatively minor changes. It's not like you're changing the airflow dramatically.

Older PCMs had a set amount of fueling delivered while WOT, so if you increased airflow the PCM would not be able to adjust. More air and same amount of fuel = lean as you eluded to.

However these PCMs are based of lambda and the amount of fuel going into the engine is not static. The PCM tries to maintain a certain lambda, and if it sees leaner fueling due to increased airflow, it can and will adjust fueling to maintain the targeted lambda...something older PCMs and other cars without wb o2 sensors could not do.

Again, this is all given the relatively small change in airflow from an 18 manifold. Other extensive mods of course require a tune.

Any updates on a plug & play installation kit for the 2018 GT manifold?

Joe 5.0 said:

Any updates on a plug & play installation kit for the 2018 GT manifold?

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find the part numbers for a female pigtail to plug the 15-17 connectors into and I'll see what I can do

EFI said:

While that's true and you should definitely be monitoring AFRs, the good news is that the computer is smart enough to make adjustments for these relatively minor changes. It's not like you're changing the airflow dramatically.

Older PCMs had a set amount of fueling delivered while WOT, so if you increased airflow the PCM would not be able to adjust. More air and same amount of fuel = lean as you eluded to.

However these PCMs are based of lambda and the amount of fuel going into the engine is not static. The PCM tries to maintain a certain lambda, and if it sees leaner fueling due to increased airflow, it can and will adjust fueling to maintain the targeted lambda...something older PCMs and other cars without wb o2 sensors could not do.

Again, this is all given the relatively small change in airflow from an 18 manifold. Other extensive mods of course require a tune.

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Yep, these are closed loop and don't go to open loop at WOT like the old days.

the 18GT pigtails are 25 bucks each in canada.. Rip my butthole :(

EFI said:

While that's true and you should definitely be monitoring AFRs, the good news is that the computer is smart enough to make adjustments for these relatively minor changes. It's not like you're changing the airflow dramatically.

Older PCMs had a set amount of fueling delivered while WOT, so if you increased airflow the PCM would not be able to adjust. More air and same amount of fuel = lean as you eluded to.

However these PCMs are based of lambda and the amount of fuel going into the engine is not static. The PCM tries to maintain a certain lambda, and if it sees leaner fueling due to increased airflow, it can and will adjust fueling to maintain the targeted lambda...something older PCMs and other cars without wb o2 sensors could not do.

Again, this is all given the relatively small change in airflow from an 18 manifold. Other extensive mods of course require a tune.

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While I agree in the short term this solution will work. I would not count on short term fuel trims to account for intake manifold changes. Sure it'll work but its better to have the extra flow accounted for in the tune.

Also there is some benefit to changing cam timings around anytime you increase the upper RPM efficiency of the engine. There's power to be made with tuning this manifold imo.

While I agree in the short term this solution will work. I would not count on short term fuel trims to account for intake manifold changes. Sure it'll work but its better to have the extra flow accounted for in the tune.

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STFT can go up to 25% and more...I can't imagine that just the manifold will increase flow by that much, especially at part throttle. Also there's nowhere for you to account for this flow in the tune...as DarkestHour said these don't go into open loop at WOT where one would account for extra flow. The PCM takes care of this extra flow through the use of wideband o2 sensors and lambda targets. In the older PCMs with open loop yes you would need to go into the tune and specifically have the extra airflow accounted for if you wanted to maintain the same AFR.

Also there is some benefit to changing cam timings around anytime you increase the upper RPM efficiency of the engine. There's power to be made with tuning this manifold imo

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That's correct that cam timing can be optimized for this manifold and of course there is power to be had by tuning, I don't think anyone is denying that. However I believe the conversation I was having was purely around fueling needs and the fact that the manifold does not absolutely require a tune to be able to run and keep fueling safe. Of course power can be had by tuning it further.

I feel like the MY18 IM is going to be great for "budget builds" (where you just stick with the OEM TB), and the GT350 + TB is more of a "max effort".

I mean, if I can get 80-85% of the power increase at 1/3rd the cost vs. a GT350 setup, sign me up.

I'm looking forward to more dyno graphs. its already proven to gain power/tq under the curve over the GT350 manifold from the dyno sheet posted earlier in the thread.