**Forza Aerospace NEW Coolant Tank**

[dragonacc]

My guess is the baffles help with the sound of the sloshing.

That's my guess too.

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[Papaya]

There is a point FORD did put this into the tank. And as Mishimoto shows/wrote, there is a danger that air can get into the system. I was only wondering.....

 

[Coaster]

Isn't the tank there for coolant expansion? Its not a fuel tank with a motor that needs a constant supply or the engine will blow up.

I'm not saying the Mishimoto tank isn't well thought out, but I highly doubt having your coolant slosh around in the tank is a big deal. They appear to be the only ones with the baffles and replacement tanks aren't something new.

Just a thought.

Basically Mishimotos point is that Ford didn't put those baffle the tank to save costs, so there must be another reason. So they tested it.

It appears that under heavy maneuvering without baffles the coolant can all slosh to one side of the tank and leave the intake port on the bottom of the tank so it sucks in air. Pulling air into the cooling system isn't good especially under aggressive driving conditions.

 

[dragonacc]

Basically Mishimotos point is that Ford didn't put those baffle the tank to save costs, so there must be another reason. So they tested it.

It appears that under heavy maneuvering without baffles the coolant can all slosh to one side of the tank and leave the intake port on the bottom of the tank so it sucks in air. Pulling air into the cooling system isn't good especially under aggressive driving conditions.

If you look where the coolant leaves the tank there's nearly no way the pickup tube would ever not be covered by coolant no matter how hard you corner even without baffles. The only way I could see cornering forces being enough to uncover the "pickup" tube would be if you are running real low on coolant.

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

Are the prices for these tanks competitive? Seems like a lot of wasted effort in 'engineering' for something so ridiculously simple.

I think efforts could be more effectively focused on precision parts rather than something that can be thrown together by a 10 year old Chinese boy w/ a MIG. ROI can't be that good for this product. I would recommend to think more like businessmen and less like engineers.

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

:doh::doh:

I guess you missed the point of the post. Time is money. It seems too much engineering (time) has gone into this product, which really requires no 'engineering' at all. Any crap fab shop can throw these things together for next to nothing.

Great for the consumer...get 'em while you can...you'll be able to say you have the most advanced and thoroughly analyzed overflow bottle produced. Once these guys realize building car parts to 'aerospace' requirements (as they've stated in the past) is a waste of time and effort, if they're smart, they won't offer something like this again. Gotta make sure the tabs don't bear out assuming a 9g crash load...

Personally, assuming an engineering rate of $130/hr, I can't see a relatively low volume product of this nature paying for itself at $160ish.

 

[Forza Aerospace]

I guess you missed the point of the post. Time is money. It seems too much engineering (time) has gone into this product, which really requires no 'engineering' at all. Any crap fab shop can throw these things together for next to nothing.

Great for the consumer...get 'em while you can...you'll be able to say you have the most advanced and thoroughly analyzed overflow bottle produced. Once these guys realize building car parts to 'aerospace' requirements (as they've stated in the past) is a waste of time and effort, if they're smart, they won't offer something like this again. Gotta make sure the tabs don't bear out assuming a 9g crash load...

Personally, assuming an engineering rate of $130/hr, I can't see a relatively low volume product of this nature paying for itself at $160ish.

Lean Manufacturing is a wonderful thing. We are in the aftermarket Mustang scene to produce high quality parts at reasonable pricing, not to get rich off our comrades. The benefit of putting the time in on the front end is that you do it once and do it right. If I want to run a new batch of 100 coolant tanks all I do is send the engineering drawings out to my manufacturers and sit back and wait for the assembled tanks to come in.

To touch on the baffled tank concept. I'm glad other people are considering all factors when designing a product, but in this case the additional cost seems a bit unnecessary. Take a look at the big dogs, in regards to the coolant tanks (Moroso and Canton). You will not find any baffled tanks or any reported problems with people running their tanks. I know several people who competitively compete in drag and autocross with a non-baffled tank. It's all about your center of gravity... take a glass of water and spin in a circle. The water will stay exactly where it is when you have it sitting flat on a desk. I am yet to hear of any problems. Honestly, I'd be more worried about the baffles causing an issue. Seems like a lot more things could go wrong with an improper baffle design.

On a different note, I'm very excited to get these tanks out. They are looking great and I'm sure everybody will be happy!

 

[Papaya]

Thanks for the explanation. I am not in a hurry in the moment. But when the coolant tank arrives, it will be the first thinks I change on my car. :cheers:

 

[jtiedemann4]

Lean Manufacturing is a wonderful thing. We are in the aftermarket Mustang scene to produce high quality parts at reasonable pricing, not to get rich off our comrades. The benefit of putting the time in on the front end is that you do it once and do it right. If I want to run a new batch of 100 coolant tanks all I do is send the engineering drawings out to my manufacturers and sit back and wait for the assembled tanks to come in.

To touch on the baffled tank concept. I'm glad other people are considering all factors when designing a product, but in this case the additional cost seems a bit unnecessary. Take a look at the big dogs, in regards to the coolant tanks (Moroso and Canton). You will not find any baffled tanks or any reported problems with people running their tanks. I know several people who competitively compete in drag and autocross with a non-baffled tank. It's all about your center of gravity... take a glass of water and spin in a circle. The water will stay exactly where it is when you have it sitting flat on a desk. I am yet to hear of any problems. Honestly, I'd be more worried about the baffles causing an issue. Seems like a lot more things could go wrong with an improper baffle design.

On a different note, I'm very excited to get these tanks out. They are looking great and I'm sure everybody will be happy!

Do you have a ship date yet? I'm ready to get rid of that crappy tank.

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

Do you have a ship date yet? I'm ready to get rid of that crappy tank.

Speaking as an insider, welcome to how aerospace works...

 

[Forza Aerospace]

Do you have a ship date yet? I'm ready to get rid of that crappy tank.

Speaking as an insider, welcome to how aerospace works...

Welder sent the tanks straight to anodizing to avoid double shipping. I'm waiting to hear back on the ship date. I will update you guys as soon as I find out.

 

[Forza Aerospace]

I wish I was updating you with good news, but unfortunately the welder we used was very careless when welding the tanks. Unlike powder coating, anodizing will not hide any surface imperfections. Not only did the welder scratch the surface, but also the welds are not in accordance with the engineering drawing.

For the above stated reasons we can’t accept his work which will significantly delay the project. I am in the process of refunding everybody their money as I believe it is unfair to make you wait any longer. We are trying out a few new welders, but if anybody knows any precision welders please pass their information along.

Pre-order pricing will still be available to those on the list once we have inventory. I sincerely apologize; I am very disappointed things turned out this way.

 

[greg hazlett]

Well shit.....:(

 

[NewSVO]

Ouch all of that and going back to square one in production.

 

[Herr_Poopschitz]

I deal w/ primary structure analysis and airframe certification, so no welding advice, but if you're open to some general ideas, feel free to PM me.

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