I am at about 31,000 in 5+ years. It’s fully warranted for about 3 more years and another 69,000 miles under the Ford extended warranty I bought...I need to drive it more!
Great post.
Well put.
Truth be told, the Voodoo's up-down-up-down crankshaft wasn't the best way to go about building a FPC engine either.
Torque ends up being primarily a function of displacement, and 84 ft*lbs per liter naturally aspirated is right up there.
more a function of stroke. the stroke gets squared in the full equation for torque per stroke, while the piston area is only multiplied once. And an increase in bore results in an increase in friction(albeit not as much as it adds in power). one of the other reasons the coyote achieves such high numbers for it's displacement, bring a 'square' design. albeit all of the modulars have been square or over square. The fact that they turn as many RPMs as they do though with a >3.5" stroke is pretty darn impressive, that would normally be reserved for smaller stroke motors., hence all the tech. Yeah, Ford did good.
Very true. I got into an argument with someone once who refused to admit that the coyote had any advantages over the LS/LT at all and refused to acknowledge just how much the Coyote is doing with that 307 cubic inches. He called it "bench racing". Sure, its a lot larger and heavier, but the powerband and smoothness/ease of pulling revs is truly a joy. And its only making 10 less horsepower and 50 less torque despite being way down on displacement. BMEP wise it shames the LT engines. And my favorite part, it can do all of this without a gas guzzler tax, and without stupid tricks like cylinder deactivation or skip shift. All while sounding amazing.
10 less hp than what? The Gen 3 Coyote is rated at 460 hp and 420 ft-lbs torque, and the LT1 at 455 hp and 455 ft-lbs torque. So it's +5 hp and -35 ft-lbs torque. The difference grows if you're comparing to an LS3, which had 426 hp and 420 ft-lbs. Comparing hp/liter or BMEP between two different engine designs (DOHC vs OHV) isn't the best comparison. It's really only a fair comparison if you're comparing similar engine technology. Also, the LT1 and Gen 3 Coyote weigh pretty close to the same amount. The Coyote is physically larger than the LT1, due to the large heads holding 4 cams.
Sorry, I should have clarified I was talking about the LS2 in the new c8 when I gave the horsepower comparison. And thats fair, i do think BMEP gives a good idea of efficiency, but its not fair between architectures especially since displacement can compensate for it.
yes, but you're really using the piston area there not the bore exactly, whereas with the stroke you are talking about that specific dimension. Semantics,yes. Still goes to show, Ford did an awesome job with this motor. it is only unfortuante they did somewhat neuter themselves with sticking with the 5.0 monikor/displacement instead of going with more (say....351...)
I'm pretty sure the gen 3 coyote is actually lighter than the lt1 by like 20lbs (444 vs 465) in any case they are close enough in weight to make next no real difference.
And that is if you really only compare what the ratings are. The gen 3 is underrated in hp and tq, Gen 3's are rated at only 20 more ft-lbs than the gen 2 yet if you look at stock gen 2 dyno's they normally make 350-360wtq while gen 3's normally make 390-400wtq. For another comparison point the stock lt1 rated at 450tq normally dyno's 400-410wtq.
Ah yes, the Bullitt/Mach 1 Coyote vs the base C8 LT2, that makes sense.
Good stuff. I agree the Gen 3 Coyote feels more advanced in tech. than the LT1. Have you read this article about the development of the Coyote? They tortured the crap out of it.I think there are probably a dozen ways to compare engines, I would argue the total BMEP under the curve, which would mean the coyote would annihilate the LS because the coyote in stock form can rev way higher than the LS/LT. If you compare tech, the coyote blows them away as well. Even the cam-in-a-cam for the LT* was present in limited form in the 2008 Viper (Exhaust only) and 2013 Viper (Both I & E). If the comparison was the power per weight, then it all depends on the weight. I saw a video comparing them somewhere and I think the weights were quite close. If the comparison is peak torque per physical size, then the LS/LT would win. If it was purely a bang-for-the-buck, the LS/LT would blow away the coyote because the LS has to be so much cheaper to make.
In case it isn't already evident, I am an engine snob, I buy the engine first, and then get the car for free. The coyote is simply built more like a race car engine (*) then the LS/LT. It loves to rev, and in my opinion sounds orders of magnitude better than the LS/LT. And this is coming from a guy that also has a hemi right now, and I've had four camaro's in the past. I'll fully admit this is a over-generalization, but to me, compared to the coyote, the LS/LT feels as if you're trying to race with a diesel engine...Just when the engine starts to get alive, you have to shift back into 'boring' speeds.
* Yes, I will agree that Nascar and Top Fuel pushrod engines do exist and they certainly are race car engines, but I would argue that the majority of race cars use multicam "screamers" (read: high rpm engines).
Now I will give credit to the LS/LT in that it has a far superior dry-sump oil system. For the money, it's hard to find a dry-sump system anywhere near the price. Even the Viper in all it's glory didn't have it, and instead had the silly-but-effective swinging pickup.
Lest we forget the oil pump gears in the coyote though, perhaps the only part in the coyote that blatantly screams for help. Ford's not the only mfg that has succumbed to the powdered-metal-gear mistress though, but nevertheless going with a forged or billet piece wouldn't have cost that much more when accounting for the qty of the gears needed. Especially if the gear is used for other engines (I'm not sure if this is the case though, although it is common at least in the case of Dodge where the lowly SRT-4 engine used the same oil pump as the 4.7L truck engine **).
** I spent a little bit of time trying to find the reference, and I can't find it anymore so take that with a grain of salt.
Not that it really matters, but I think the pinnacle of engine designs -bar none- if the Koenigsegg milles with the freevalve technology. If hybrid/all-electric cars weren't the rage, then I think everyone would have went with the freevalve technology within the next 20 years. In one fell swoop, it makes the camshaft appear about as useful as a muffler bearing.
I apologize to the OP, I know I got way off track. But as far as redlining the coyote, as far as I'm concerned, the single-most point of failure is the oil pump gears. People that have blowers on the cars have more problems than others and there are two theories that I have read, one is the extra harmonics introduced through the blower drive and the other is simply the force of the high belt tension on the front of the crank, which happens to be right where the oil pump gears are. So long as you're not disturbing the oil pump gear, whether it be by cavitation or by inertial disturbances (e.g. a violent RPM change like with a fuel shut off), then I think it's fine. Many manufacturers test the engines way harder than the average customer. It's simply cheaper for them to overbuild an engine then to "right size" it and have to deal with warranty issues for guys/gals like us that can't leave well enough alone
I know it is widely reported by Allpar that Dodge designs their engines to last over 150,000 miles at >95% of typical consumer use - meaning that they beat on it harder than 95% of their customers and still expect 150k miles out of it. I've read about other manufacturers that will go through hot/cold cycles up to redline, for hours at a time. Back when I was in college, I interned for Eaton and was literally paid to drop parts on the ground and then report on if they still worked. It was a cool job.
He was just talking about the engines.