Have any of you changed the MT-82 and Torsen fluids really early???

[Elp_jc]

Hey gang, with less than 3 quarts in the tranny, and less than 2 in the Torsen, it should be quite cheap to replace the fluid in both. I've read in every instance that the diff fluid always comes out nasty, so with such an expensive differential (and with no filter), why not change it along with the first or second oil change? And the tranny is not the most robust manual, so it'd also benefit from new fluid without all the break-in crap (and possible test-drive abuse), no? The good news is Torsens have both drain and fill plugs, so zero mess. Hope the fluids are not that expensive, but there're only 5 total.

I'm planning to change the oil around 1k miles (350 now), before a long trip in July. It might be too early to change the tranny and differential at 1K too, but maybe by the second oil change 5K miles later. Those definitely produce a lot more break-in crap than the engine, especially the differential, so why not give them fresh fluid early in their lives, so they live longer and healthier? Finally, do Torsens need the friction modifier menitoned in the manual, or just the clutch-type LSDs? I'm pretty sure it's not needed on the Torsens, but want to make sure . Thanks gang. All comments welcome, even if it's against what I want to do.
JC

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[ice445]

Gear oil breaks down much more slowly than engine oil. There's no real harm in changing it early, but it's not really going to do anything good either. Personally I wouldn't even bother to change that stuff until the 50K mark if this is just a street driven car. If you regularly track it then that's different since the trans and diff will actually get hot.

 

[Elp_jc]

No, I don't plan to ever track the car, but I live in hot TX . I know it's not necessary now, but if I do it soon, I could wait later than 50K for the second one, so not really wasting any money or oil. And at least the diff would have clear oil, rather than the black crap that comes out probably due to break-in, and crap from the manufacturing process. The tranny might be cleaner, but if test-drivers (66 miles on my car) ground any gears, and also assembly crap, better to run in clean fluid, no? Will check how much factory oil for both cost. Guess will make the decision of how soon based on that. Ha ha. Thanks for your input.

 

[ice445]

No, I don't plan to ever track the car, but I live in hot TX . I know it's not necessary now, but if I do it soon, I could wait later than 50K for the second one, so not really wasting any money or oil. And at least the diff would have clear oil, rather than the black crap that comes out probably due to break-in, and crap from the manufacturing process. The tranny might be cleaner, but if test-drivers (66 miles on my car) ground any gears, and also assembly crap, better to run in clean fluid, no? Will check how much factory oil for both cost. Guess will make the decision of how soon based on that. Ha ha. Thanks for your input.

Some people like switching to BG Syncroshift II for the transmission, you could look into trying that. I'm not saying don't do it, its just that I'm lazy. If you do it now at least you'll have peace of mind for a few years.

 

[Biggus Dickus]

Let me tell you a story: I had a 2011 GT with the first gen MT-82. I bought it brand new and sold it - still running well - at just over 190K miles. I have never had a lick of trouble with that tranny. And, I never changed the trans fluid and it still had the stock clutch when I sold it (which put down 390 whp on the dyno totally stock at 175K miles) with no slippage or problems. It worked flawlessly for over 190K miles on the original stock fluid and clutch.

Oh - I also recommend you leave the factory oil in place until the OLM says change me.

 

[Sabre]

Just as we do for an engine, I think it's a great idea to change out the fluid of anything metallic after it's initial run in....and as you pointed out, it's not an expensive proposition....it certainly can't hurt anything. I plan to do the same with my 2020 when I reach the 3000 mile mark. From there, I won't worry about them until their recommended regularly scheduled maintence period.

 

[Chef jpd]

Changed mine with BG synchroshift at 3k miles.
Shifts much more smoothly and the 1-2 nibble.is gone forever.

 

[kz]

Hey gang, with less than 3 quarts in the tranny, and less than 2 in the Torsen, it should be quite cheap to replace the fluid in both. I've read in every instance that the diff fluid always comes out nasty, so with such an expensive differential (and with no filter), why not change it along with the first or second oil change? And the tranny is not the most robust manual, so it'd also benefit from new fluid without all the break-in crap (and possible test-drive abuse), no? The good news is Torsens have both drain and fill plugs, so zero mess. Hope the fluids are not that expensive, but there're only 5 total.

I'm planning to change the oil around 1k miles (350 now), before a long trip in July. It might be too early to change the tranny and differential at 1K too, but maybe by the second oil change 5K miles later. Those definitely produce a lot more break-in crap than the engine, especially the differential, so why not give them fresh fluid early in their lives, so they live longer and healthier? Finally, do Torsens need the friction modifier menitoned in the manual, or just the clutch-type LSDs? I'm pretty sure it's not needed on the Torsens, but want to make sure . Thanks gang. All comments welcome, even if it's against what I want to do.
JC

I've changed mine in the transmission about month and half a ago - car is year and half old, has been autocrossed many times (so driven much harder than average), fluid looked visually perfectly fine (OEM fill). Replaced with BG Syncroshift and can tell you that there is literally no difference vs. OEM - which wasn't the case on the 15-17 (I've had 15 and BG fluid made quite a difference there).

Haven't replaced diff fluid but when I have done that on the previous car - again - after two years, fluid looked almost brand new.

Bottom line - save yourself some work / money and don't worry about it. You're overthinking it a bit.

 

[austexstang]

Hey gang, with less than 3 quarts in the tranny, and less than 2 in the Torsen, it should be quite cheap to replace the fluid in both. I've read in every instance that the diff fluid always comes out nasty, so with such an expensive differential (and with no filter), why not change it along with the first or second oil change? And the tranny is not the most robust manual, so it'd also benefit from new fluid without all the break-in crap (and possible test-drive abuse), no? The good news is Torsens have both drain and fill plugs, so zero mess. Hope the fluids are not that expensive, but there're only 5 total.

I'm planning to change the oil around 1k miles (350 now), before a long trip in July. It might be too early to change the tranny and differential at 1K too, but maybe by the second oil change 5K miles later. Those definitely produce a lot more break-in crap than the engine, especially the differential, so why not give them fresh fluid early in their lives, so they live longer and healthier? Finally, do Torsens need the friction modifier menitoned in the manual, or just the clutch-type LSDs? I'm pretty sure it's not needed on the Torsens, but want to make sure . Thanks gang. All comments welcome, even if it's against what I want to do.
JC

"OE" fluid isn't that cheap......Local dealer is getting about $25.00 a qt for trans fluid and about $22.00 a qt for diff fluid plus the additive....

 

[Elp_jc]

I plan to do the same with my 2020 when I reach the 3000 mile mark.

Hey, when do you think that will be? And are you going to go with the stock fluid (is it full synthetic?), or the BG Syncro Shift II? I just checked it, and it says it's compatible with Ford spec WSS-M2C200-D2, so it shouldn't be an issue, but curious what are you planning to do. And for the Torsen, the Ford stuff, and the 3.28 fl oz of friction modifier called for? Any preferred vendor where to buy the fluids? Thx.

Finally, does anybody here have the instructions to change both MT-82 D4 and Tremec fluids from the service manual? It'd be greatly appreciated . Need the torque values, and the sealant to use on the drain/fill plugs. If the tranny drain plug is at the front or rear of the tranny, I could just lift the car to drain the most fluid, and just pour back the drained amount, without having to level the car. But if it's more in the middle, then I'd have no choice. I'd probably put the car on ramps in the front, and lift the rear from the jacking points. I'm going to mark a level where it is now, so I put it exactly at the same stance on the air. Thanks guys.

 

[JohnVallo]

Thought I would pass on some info & maybe a tip for the fluid changes. especially concerning the rear-end.
For the trans, early change is OK, but highly recommend the: BG Syncro Shift II
For the rear axle, you may not be aware that the ring and pinion gears have a black oxide finish on them (from a manufacturing process). This black oxide finish wears off into the fluid, and it takes awhile. I don't believe Ford considers this a problem.

The Black Oxide Finishing Process:
https://gearsolutions.com/features/black-oxide-finishing-for-gears/

If it were me I would do the following for the rear axle fluid change:
1. wait at least 5-10,000 miles.
2. when you do change it, try to change it right after a long trip, and when the rear-end is still hot.
Here are some pictures of the settlement from the black oxide residue after setting in my jug for a few months.

This is what I drained into a clean jug, from my 2016 Mustang rear axle after around 12,000 mi.

When I tip the jug on its side you can see the black oxide residue that has settled to the bottom.

Here is another:
This was a 3.15 ratio rear-end after being drained, (It had 3,000 miles on it)
This is what you could expect to see inside the rear-end after draining the factory fluid.

 

[Elp_jc]

For the trans, early change is OK, but highly recommend the: BG Syncro Shift II
For the rear axle, wait at least 10,000 miles.

Hey John, thank you very much for your suggestions; greatly appreciated. As far as the transmission, do you think the BG SSII is better for the D4 trannies than the stock DCT fluid too? People suggesting that all had the previous gen. Only 1 person with a D4 said he put BG, and he didn't notice a difference. Since the BG fluid meets Ford spec, I don't have any issues using it. It's more expensive than the Ford fluid, but I don't care, since it's not that much difference. What I'm most concerned about with any manual transmission is winter use, when most of the problems arise, including crunching synchros, difficulty shifting, etc. I noticed it takes longer than I expected for my tranny to reach operating temperature, even near 100 deg, like it's now, and for the notchiness to go away. So it might benefit from a different fluid, especially in winter. My specific question is this: Do you think the BG fluid will be better in both summer and winter for the D4 tranny? If yes, then I'm sold, and I'd change it along with the oil soon, so it's in there for winter. Thanks man, and sorry for the questions, but you seem very knowledgeable, and appreciate very much your input for me, and the other forum members . Take care.
JC

 

[JohnVallo]

Hey John, thank you very much for your suggestions; greatly appreciated. As far as the transmission, do you think the BG SSII is better for the D4 trannies than the stock DCT fluid too? People suggesting that all had the previous gen. Only 1 person with a D4 said he put BG, and he didn't notice a difference. Since the BG fluid meets Ford spec, I don't have any issues using it. It's more expensive than the Ford fluid, but I don't care, since it's not that much difference. What I'm most concerned about with any manual transmission is winter use, when most of the problems arise, including crunching synchros, difficulty shifting, etc. I noticed it takes longer than I expected for my tranny to reach operating temperature, even near 100 deg, like it's now, and for the notchiness to go away. So it might benefit from a different fluid, especially in winter. My specific question is this: Do you think the BG fluid will be better in both summer and winter for the D4 tranny? If yes, then I'm sold, and I'd change it along with the oil soon, so it's in there for winter. Thanks man, and sorry for the questions, but you seem very knowledgeable, and appreciate very much your input for me, and the other forum members . Take care.
JC

While I am definitely a proponent of BG fluids (My favorite), as I use it in both my Tremec trans, and Torsen Rear-Ends, I see your concern for the colder weather operation. Being in Florida, heat is my main concern, and not so much concern for cold weather operation. My suggestion is do your homework, and you very well may want to stick with the DCT fluid.

 

[Elp_jc]

Well, I've been doing it, but basically no input from D4 owners. Ha ha. Guess very few are like me, who like to change fluids the first time early. I need protection for both, since now it's in the 100s here, and it stays for many months. But winters are cold too; not brutally cold like in the north, but it gets in the 30s for several months too. Doesn't freeze every day, but it's common. Hard freezes are not common, however. And with the Pilot 4S tires, it's not safe to take it out that cold anyway.

So bottom line, if my car was yours, would you replace the DCT fluid with the BG? And how about the Torsen fluid? Stick to OEM, or also BG? And if yes, which fluid for the Torsen? What's weird is Ford doesn't differentiate from the different rear axles; it just calls for XY-75W85-QL synthetic hypoid gear fluid, but there's no specification (and XL-3 friction modifier). The tranny calls for DCT fluid XT-11-QDC.

 

[Sabre]

Hey, when do you think that will be? And are you going to go with the stock fluid (is it full synthetic?), or the BG Syncro Shift II? I just checked it, and it says it's compatible with Ford spec WSS-M2C200-D2, so it shouldn't be an issue, but curious what are you planning to do. And for the Torsen, the Ford stuff, and the 3.28 fl oz of friction modifier called for? Any preferred vendor where to buy the fluids? Thx.

Finally, does anybody here have the instructions to change both MT-82 D4 and Tremec fluids from the service manual? It'd be greatly appreciated . Need the torque values, and the sealant to use on the drain/fill plugs. If the tranny drain plug is at the front or rear of the tranny, I could just lift the car to drain the most fluid, and just pour back the drained amount, without having to level the car. But if it's more in the middle, then I'd have no choice. I'd probably put the car on ramps in the front, and lift the rear from the jacking points. I'm going to mark a level where it is now, so I put it exactly at the same stance on the air. Thanks guys.

Hopefully not too long from now. I've had the car for a couple of months, but no real opportunity to go anywhere long distance to put some miles on it. I plan to go to the Carlisle Ford Nationals in PA at the end of July. I should easily have the 3 thousand miles on it when I get back. That's when I'll do the engine oil, manual trans ( will use either BG or Redline ) and the rear diff (Redline)....all at the same time when I have it up on my lift.

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