Gun owners living in pro-gun States (They Agree with the 2nd Amendment)

[95CobraR]

Maybe you should learn how to comprehend English.

Go read your state gun laws - it might be too confusing since it seems you have a hard time comprehending. If you think convicted felons, sycos and children should legally own guns because of your "interpretation" of the Constitution , then maybe you should move to a lawless country.

Go commit and get convicted of a felony and see what happens to your gun ownership. The 2A does not give felons the right to legally bear arms, and never will. If you think it should, then take it to the Supreme Court ... good luck with that, lol.

I asked you, as the liberal pundit, to write your correction of the Second Amendment. Please write it.

I agree with every word.of the current 2A.

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[GT Pony]

I asked you, as the liberal pundit, to write your correction of the Second Amendment. Please write it.

I agree with every word.of the current 2A.

You think anyone who has any common sense about guns is a "liberal pundit" - typical BS troll response. I bet you're someone that lets politics run your whole life. Just goes to show the narrow fanatical thinking on the subject matter.

I've been a legal gun owner with a CWP for decades. I'm a strong believer in the 2A. And I have no problem with laws that keep guns out of hands of people who shouldn't possess them. I do however have problems with laws that infringe on law abiding citizen's gun rights. For instance, magazine capacity, banning certain guns, etc that really won't make any differenece to any criminal or syco who wants to commit gun crimes. Don't penalize the upstanding law abiding gun owners, instead penalize the gun toting criminals - very hard!

So you believe there should be absolutely no gun laws at all, and everyone should be able to own guns because of the wording of the 2A?

If that's the case, then let's go back to the 1800s cowboy gun slinger days and legalize gun fight call-outs at high noon ... I'm in. It's still legal to open carry here, so maybe I'll get my two SA cowboy Colt style 6-shooters out and sport them around tomorrow.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Please be very specific in your liberal views of who can legally own a gun and who can not?

That's not the way it works, or should work. You should be looking at who should not be allowed to own a firearm.

I'm sure that you believe that the default position per 2A is that gun ownership is permitted, even though the way you are asking amounts to defining exceptions allowing gun ownership against non-ownership being the default.

Going with ownership being the default necessarily implies that responsibility must accompany that ownership. The crux of the matter is then defining either responsibility or that which demonstrates irresponsibility. Irresponsibility is easier to identify and more accurately identifies "who should not", which is what the safety of others is more heavily dependent on.

Once that is established, the focus becomes that of defining what demonstrations of irresponsibility would reasonably exclude an individual from gun ownership. For starters, those convicted of violent crimes or crimes aggravated by the presence of a firearm would meet such an exclusionary criterion (though those convicted of certain nonviolent crimes might be permitted to regain their right to purchase a firearm). Those convicted of specifically violating certain firearms laws such as straw purchasing would be barred, and I can see where a domestic abuse complaint should reasonably trigger a temporary red flag confiscation (subject to due process protections) even if no case ever goes to trial..

That's enough for now.


Norm

 

[GT Pony]

Yeah, sorry Doc, that's what you want the 2nd amendment to say. What it really says is "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed". Not the same thing.

If someone wanted to be totally literal about that 2A statement, one could say that everyone has the right to own and use tanks, bazookas, nuclear weapons, Gatling guns, hand grenades, chemical weapons, etc because those are all forms of "Arms". Like that's ever going to happen, but maybe when Pres Camacho gets in office it might.

 

[bigfoot21075]

You think anyone who has any common sense about guns is a "liberal pundit" - typical BS troll response. I bet you're someone that lets politics run your whole life. Just goes to show the narrow fanatical thinking on the subject matter.

I've been a legal gun owner with a CWP for decades. I'm a strong believer in the 2A. And I have no problem with laws that keep guns out of hands of people who shouldn't possess them. I do however have problems with laws that infringe on law abiding citizen's gun rights. For instance, magazine capacity, banning certain guns, etc that really won't make any differenece to any criminal or syco who wants to commit gun crimes. Don't penalize the upstanding law abiding gun owners, instead penalize the gun toting criminals - very hard!

So you believe there should be absolutely no gun laws at all, and everyone should be able to own guns because of the wording of the 2A?

If that's the case, then let's go back to the 1800s cowboy gun slinger days and legalize gun fight call-outs at high noon ... I'm in. It's still legal to open carry here, so maybe I'll get my two SA cowboy Colt style 6-shooters out and sport them around tomorrow.

I too am a long time supporter of the 2nd amendment, I am also a former LEO and I agree with you, i also agree with Norm's point that, "those convicted of violent crimes or crimes aggravated by the presence of a firearm would meet such an exclusionary criterion (though those convicted of certain nonviolent crimes might be permitted to regain their right to purchase a firearm). Those convicted of specifically violating certain firearms laws such as straw purchasing would be barred, and I can see where a domestic abuse complaint should reasonably trigger a temporary red flag confiscation (subject to due process protections) even if no case ever goes to trial." for the most part. I will NEVER get behind any "Red Flag Law" that denies Due Process PRIOR to confiscation.

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[95CobraR]

I can't really address every question here.

I do 100% agree with all the stuff in our State of Georgia Laws. This is a Castle State.. Here:

https://www.georgiapacking.org/law.php

Summary:
Definitions
Forcible Felony - Any felony which involves the use or threat of physical force or violence against any person. (16-1-3 as used anywhere in Chapter 16, except 16-11-131)
Forcible Misdemeanor - Any misdemeanor which involves the use or threat of physical force or violence against any person. (16-1-3 as used anywhere in Chapter 16)

Public Place - Any place where the conduct involved may reasonably be expected to be viewed by people other than members of the actor's family or household. (16-1-3 as used anywhere in Chapter 16)

Possession

The general definition of possession is having control of an object. Possession does not necessarily mean ownership of an object. Since there are different ways to control an object, the legal system has various ways to describe the different situations in which a person has control of an object (active, illegal, legal, criminal, physical, sole, joint, etc). Most of those descriptions boil down to a person having either Actual or Constructive possession. Actual possession is when you are in physical or close contact with an item. If you are carrying a firearm on your person or under the driver's seat of your car, then you have actual possession of a firearm. Constructive possession is when you have the power and intention to later take control of the object not currently in your actual possession. If you leave your home and lock all your firearms in your safe, you have constructive possession of those firearms. Laws that prohibit possession are judged based on the ability to control an object, which is why it is possible to charge multiple people with possession of a single object because each of those people had the ability to control the object.

Possession of firearms during certain crimes by those previously convicted: It is a felony for any person who has previously been convicted of or previously entered a guilty plea to the offense of murder, armed robbery, kidnapping, rape, aggravated child molestation, aggravated sodomy, aggravated sexual battery, or any felony involving the use or possession of a firearm and who shall have on or within arm's reach of his or her person a firearm during the commission of, or the attempt to commit:

1. Any crime against or involving the person of another;
2. The unlawful entry into a building or vehicle;
3. A theft from a building or theft of a vehicle;
4. Any crime involving the possession, manufacture, delivery, distribution, dispensing, administering, selling, or possession with intent to distribute any controlled substance
5. Any crime involving the trafficking of cocaine, marijuana, or illegal drugs

Registration of Firearms
Georgia does not require the registration of firearms owned by citizens. Georgia law actually prohibits local city/county governments from registering firearms when applying for a firearms license. However dangerous weapons (as described above) must be registered in compliance with the National Firearm Act (NFA) of 1934 and Federal Gun Control Act (GCA) of 1968 (information on how to register an NFA firearm is beyond the scope of this document).

Purchasing of Firearms
Georgia has only 2 laws that regulate the purchasing of firearms. All other purchasing laws come from Federal law. The BATFE has a reference page that explains those laws (at that site, when the BATFE says "licensed" they mean firearm dealers and "unlicensed" means private individuals).

Straw Purchase / Anti-Bloomberg Law - Any person who attempts to solicit, persuade, encourage, or entice any dealer to transfer or otherwise convey a firearm other than to the actual buyer, as well as any other person who willfully and intentionally aids or abets such person, shall be guilty of a felony. (16-11-113)

Furnishing a Pistol to a Minor - It is illegal to sell or give a pistol or revolver to a person under 18 years old. Possession of handguns by minors is only allowed as explained in the Possession section above. (16-11-101.1)

Carrying Weapons


Short Version
Basically, to carry a long gun you do not have to have a license to carry as long as you are not prohibited from owning a firearm. To carry a handgun openly or concealed in the state of Georgia (other than on your property or inside your home, car, or your place of business), you must have a Georgia Weapons Carry License (or the older Georgia Firearm License) issued under code 16-11-129. To carry a knife designed for offense and defense with a blade over 5 inches you must have a Georgia Weapons Carry License (or the older Georgia Firearm License) issued under code 16-11-129. There are exceptions, read below to find out what those are.

Deadly Force

There are 3 code sections that govern when lethal or deadly force may lawfully be used.

Defense from a forcible felony; A person is justified in using threats or force to the degree they reasonably believe it is necessary to stop another person's imminent use of unlawful force. A person is justified in using deadly force which may harm or kill only if he or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent death or great bodily injury to himself or herself or a third person or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony (unless it is regarding defense of habitation, which has its own requirements below). You are not justified if you were the aggressor or you are/were/on-the-way-to committing a felony. (The state has pre-empted local cities and counties from further restricting this defense.)(16-3-21)

Defense of habitation; (here habitation means dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business) A person is justified in the use of force which is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm only if any one of the following is met:

1. A person is breaking\has broken into your home in a violent and tumultuous manner, and you think that the intruder is going to assault you or someone else living there.
2. A person who is not a member of the family or household and who unlawfully and forcibly enters the residence and you know it is an unlawful entry.
3. The person using such force reasonably believes that the entry is made or attempted for the purpose of committing a felony therein and that such force is necessary to prevent the commission of the felony.

(16-3-23)


Defense of property other than habitation; Lethal force cannot be used to protect real property unless the person using such force reasonably believes that it is necessary to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.(16-3-24)

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You dudes are from up in the Pacific NW (a liberal breeding ground), on I-95 (all of the Eastern U.S.), and a former LEO from Maryland which has Baltimore with the highest murder rate in the U.S.A.. (good LEO's and terrible politicians).

I don't go to the inner City of Atlanta without three loaded guns, but the rest of the State is really good.

 

[bigfoot21075]

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You dudes are from up in the Pacific NW (a liberal breeding ground), on I-95 (all of the Eastern U.S.), and a former LEO from Maryland which has Baltimore with the highest murder rate in the U.S.A.. (good LEO's and terrible politicians).

I don't go to the inner City of Atlanta without three loaded guns, but the rest of the State is really good.

Gotta be good at SOMETHING.

All kidding aside, GA has the right outlook. It views its law abiding citizens as a plus, Maryland (and other liberal states) views them as a threat which is totally INSANE. At the same time, they release even the most violent offenders back on the streets all while trying to eliminate your chances of protecting your family. BIZZARE!

 

[Norm Peterson]

You dudes are from up in the Pacific NW (a liberal breeding ground), on I-95 (all of the Eastern U.S.), and a former LEO from Maryland which has Baltimore with the highest murder rate in the U.S.A.. (good LEO's and terrible politicians).

Try to understand that there are any number of positions less conservative than yours that fall well short of what the far-left crowd would like to force on us. Right of center is possible, at least if taken in an overall sense.

You may well identify certain regions of the country as being "liberal breeding grounds", but that does not mean everybody living in such regions holds many - or any - liberal views. Most times, job location determines (generally) where you end up rather than political views.

I have a feeling that when people just can't get away from each other that tensions and frustrations build while patience drops. So perhaps it is not possible for a "one size fits all" solution here.

Even if I applied for concealed carry here and by some miracle was actually granted such permission, I still wouldn't travel to the inner city neighborhoods of, say, Camden.


Norm

 

[95CobraR]

Try to understand that there are any number of positions less conservative than yours that fall well short of what the far-left crowd would like to force on us. Right of center is possible, at least if taken in an overall sense.

You may well identify certain regions of the country as being "liberal breeding grounds", but that does not mean everybody living in such regions holds many - or any - liberal views. Most times, job location determines (generally) where you end up rather than political views.....

Norm,
The problem with your post (which I mostly agree with) is that anti-gun people will not stop at one or two restrictions. Their goal is voiding the 2A and taking all guns from all private citizens.

We will then be subject to a Federal Government Police State. This is why we have the 2A as it protects us from the Washington Swamp of Bureaucrats. The top dudes in the FBI have been corrupt and who else is next?

I do not own a AR-15 type sporting rifle (the liberal media calls it an assault weapon). I don't need one. I also don't need a 20 round magazine. Yet, I do not trust them, and many American citizens agree with me.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Norm,
The problem with your post (which I mostly agree with) is that anti-gun people will not stop at one or two restrictions. Their goal is voiding the 2A and taking all guns from all private citizens.

We will then be subject to a Federal Government Police State. This is why we have the 2A as it protects us from the Washington Swamp of Bureaucrats. The top dudes in the FBI have been corrupt and who else is next?

I do not own a AR-15 type sporting rifle (the liberal media calls it an assault weapon). I don't need one. I also don't need a 20 round magazine. Yet, I do not trust them, and many American citizens agree with me.

No real argument here. More moderate philosophical positions exist but the real question is how many minimally liberal people will stake out any such moderate position and stick to it. Unfortunately, "liberal" implies "progressive", which in turn implies continual change. Maybe it's people afraid of being seen as switching sides if they jump off the train once it's reached a comfortable point for them somewhere in the middle.


Personally, I don't need an AR or a 20-round magazine either. But my reasons (I find long magazines a bit clunky to work with at the range and I'm not entirely on board with the notion of direct impingement) have nothing in common with those of anybody who would deny such items out of hand to those who do want them.


Norm

 

[95CobraR]

No real argument here. More moderate philosophical positions exist but the real question is how many minimally liberal people will stake out any such moderate position and stick to it. Unfortunately, "liberal" implies "progressive", which in turn implies continual change. Maybe it's people afraid of being seen as switching sides if they jump off the train once it's reached a comfortable point for them somewhere in the middle.

Norm,
You remind me of a Psychology professor during my college years. Unlike you she was hot and good in the sack. I got an A.

The 2A protects us from evil forces that wish to harm our Country and our Constitution.

 

[Digital_Synapse]

Shooting someone over property will in most cases get you sent to prison.

Not in Texas.

 

[95CobraR]

Not in Texas.

We have a town in GA that requires every home (without a felon) to own a firearm. Their crime rate is low.

My choice if only for one:

 

[Phoenix]

We have a town in GA that requires every home (without a felon) to own a firearm. Their crime rate is low.

My choice if only for one:

shotguns are terrible choices for home defense.

11.5" AR pistol is a much better choice.

 

[Caballus]

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kennesaw-gun-law/

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