Who Has A Deposit on a Mach E

[w3rkn]

It might be a mustang by name... just not in the hearts of many Americans.

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[IronG]

I did. It must have been deleted. I replied to you being a condensing douche to other form members for no reason. Don't try to back track now and say you weren't trying to be an ass. Like you said move along.

Hmmmmmm......I think you have a lot of hate in you and that is a shame, I hope it does not affect you adversely in real life. As for being a douche, not quite sure where you picked that up from. Neither Bike nor I was intending to be one, but it is easy to misinterpret short conversations like this and why I mentioned that talking to someone takes that out. It is nice that you stuck up for him though, so I give you kudos for that.

I would like to see you reply to my post #101 though. I wonder if that is really what set you off on me. If it is I'm sorry, but I could not resist as you were quite rude. I'm sure your insulting of me and others won't stop, but I am a positive type of person so I'm hoping you change it up a bit.

As for the Mach E itself, Ford has taken a calculated risk by identifying it as a Mustang. They knew that Mustang fans would not be happy, but we are a small group (based on sales only) and figure since we are not really the intended market, it won't really matter. They want people that already have or want an EV. They don't care for what reasons people want a EV, they just want to make money off of them. Ford's best chance at getting that money was to make a big splash and that is what they are attempting to do with the big reveal and reservations. I don't blame them for doing any of it. They like any company are in a fight for their survival every day and will use whatever IP they have to try to get an edge. EV's are unfortunately part of the car future and every car mfr is trying to get their foot in the door. They are all fighting for a fairly small market at the moment and they will need to do some crazy stuff to get the attention. Tesla with their wacky looking truck is another example. They went so over the top with the design on purpose. They knew full well what the response was going to be, in fact they counted on it. Even the fiasco with the cracked windows will play in their favor and could have been part of the plan for them to crack. It certainly got more attention for it. In the end, people will make their decision to buy what they buy for whatever reason suits them and that is how it should be. With that said, no one should be stifled for giving their opinion or providing feedback on someone else's. Without being able to do that, the Mach E and Cybertruck would not exist.

 

[martinjlm]

Just speaking from my experience, I spent 11 years traveling a lot for work. My gas stops took about 5 minutes. Gas up, take a leak, MAYBE grab a quick bottle of water. The only thing I wanted to do was get back home to my family. In those days, any EV that took longer than about 5 minutes to charge would have been an absolute deal breaker for me. But I can see how that is not the norm. My time, especially with family, is worth WAY more than possibly saving a few bucks.

When I drove to CamaroFest from Detroit to Knoxville (did the Tail of the Dragon first) I made one stop for gas and a drive thru meal. Maybe 10 - 15 minutes total. Likewise driving back from Bowling Green, Kentucky to Detroit. One gas stop plus fast food, 10 - 15 minutes. When I drive the 250 miles to Buffalo or the 270 miles to Chicago alone I never stop. When I make the Buffalo or Chicago trips with other carbon-based life forms in my vehicle, we.....always.....frigggin’.....stop. My opinion doesn’t count, even though I’m always the one gripping the steering wheel. And those stops ALWAYS last longer than what I would consider reasonable to take a dump, buy a coffee and fill the tank. I have a sneaky suspicion that that’s how it works in most family trip situations. So, since those stops ALWAYS happen, I’m good if my vehicle is charging while that’s happening. Besides, how often does John Q. Public take a trip that exceeds the total range of the newer EVs? Once a year? Three times? I for one do not allow my vehicle purchase decisions to hinge on something I only do once or twice a year. That’s why God created Hertz, Avis, and National.

 

[w3rkn]

When I drove to CamaroFest from Detroit to Knoxville (did the Tail of the Dragon first) I made one stop for gas and a drive thru meal. Maybe 10 - 15 minutes total. Likewise driving back from Bowling Green, Kentucky to Detroit. One gas stop plus fast food, 10 - 15 minutes. When I drive the 250 miles to Buffalo or the 270 miles to Chicago alone I never stop. When I make the Buffalo or Chicago trips with other carbon-based life forms in my vehicle, we.....always.....frigggin’.....stop. My opinion doesn’t count, even though I’m always the one gripping the steering wheel. And those stops ALWAYS last longer than what I would consider reasonable to take a dump, buy a coffee and fill the tank. I have a sneaky suspicion that that’s how it works in most family trip situations. So, since those stops ALWAYS happen, I’m good if my vehicle is charging while that’s happening. Besides, how often does John Q. Public take a trip that exceeds the total range of the newer EVs? Once a year? Three times? I for one do not allow my vehicle purchase decisions to hinge on something I only do once or twice a year. That’s why God created Hertz, Avis, and National.

I agree Martin... but could the Mach GT make it to Grattan, do laps & make it back to the D …?

I've looked and there are not too many " EV super-chargers" out there. I can easily have the car on a charger for 1.5h while I eat a leisure lunch, etc. (That's about +50 miles). How about going to a Michigan/Michigan State game in Lansing next year, from downriver (160 mile round trip w/heater on)..? What if there is a traffic jam after the game & it's touch and go for an extra hour...? And it's Winter.

Simple scenarios that I myself would already question the trip, or make a plan.

 

[IronG]

I’ve always thought this to be an interesting argument. My family takes a vacation every year that covers 885 miles (Detroit to Hilton Head Island). We typically do it over two days and stop at least one time each day for gas and food. Those stops tend to last 30 - 45 minutes. In that 30 - 45 minutes any of the long range EVs that we would consider buying or leasing could fast charge from a 20% level to a 60% or 80% level. That would depend on which vehicle we actually chose. Since we tend to cover about 400 - 500 miles on the first day, that could easily be managed with one 30 - 45 minute stop. Then the car charges to 100% overnight and finishes the trip the next day. Ok, maybe there are other EVs charging and we have to wait for a charger to open up. Cool. Our stop now takes an hour and a half. In the course of a 13+ hour trip, big whup.

VERRRY overlooked point. This is our current situation (no pun intended). Even though our current EV (ok, maybe that one) is a Chevrolet Volt and can easily make the entire trip, we don’t take it because we have Dino-powered SUVs in the garage that can fit all the stuff we like to take on this vacation. If we replaced the Volt or my SRX with a Mach E I’d have no problem taking the Mach E. You know which vehicle we’d NEVER drive on a family vacation? My Camaro (or Mustang if I were driving one)

Also my experience. And I feel the same way. I like the vehicle. I wish they had NOT called it a Mustang, but ya know what?

They did. And sooo.....


This.

Not surprised it works for you as you are all in on EV's. You plan your trip around your EV and that is great, however, most people don't and/or don't want to plan their trip around their vehicles capabilities. The Mach E for example takes 10 minutes on a fast charger to get 47 miles. So in 40 minutes at best you will get about 188 miles. Not really all that great if you ask me (pales in comparison to getting 400 miles in about 5 minutes) Also, are there really that many places with fast chargers that offer a sit down meal? I don't look for them, but I do travel a lot with my family on both short and long trips and have not seen any. Since I don't need to look for them though that could just mean that they are around, but not very noticeable. In my opinion, you are in a small group that have accepted the added logistics an EV requires. Your group is absolutely necessary in order for EV's to become the norm though. The extra work (to you probably seems trivial) though is what will prevent EV's from gaining significant market share. Once the infrastructure is mainstream (not tucked away somewhere) and available like gas stations are (with lots of slots for charging since it takes a long time), it will pick up steam. I think it will be a while before there are major breakthroughs in battery and charging tech to break out of the 300 mile barrier without adding significantly more weight. I am a tech guy who loves gadgets and has a job that gets to play with them and then making them available for a couple hundred thousand users worldwide. The more cutting edge and crazy the more I like them. My company is not a tech company so most users don't see the tech like I do. They see it as just a tool to get their job done. Getting them to change what they use or how they use it is difficult. I see EV's in the same way and most people just see their car as a tool to get around as quickly and easily as possible. It is certainly cool tech and it draws me in because of it. I would own one, but so far, the implementation of the vehicles is what holds me back. Sorta like a foldable phone, they are really cool, but not quite ready for prime time as no matter how much you like the idea, the current implementation is not quite there yet. Like EV's foldable/expandable phones are the future and just like EV's they will take a while to make it mainstream. Anyway, thanks for being a trailblazer and hopefully you and the others of your ilk will have helped make the transition to EV's better in the future. Just please help make the designers see the error in their ways with the bonkers interiors. I am hoping it is just a fad as it is the number one reason I won't buy one.

 

[martinjlm]

I agree Martin... but could the Mach GT make it to Grattan, do laps & make it back to the D …?

. You could. You’d need to make a side trip to Smyrna, where there are several fast charge plugs. You’d want the CCS/SAE combo plug.

I've looked and there are not too many " EV super-chargers" out there. I can easily have the car on a charger for 1.5h while I eat a leisure lunch, etc. (That's about +50 miles). How about going to a Michigan/Michigan State game in Lansing next year, from downriver (160 mile round trip w/heater on)..? What if there is a traffic jam after the game & it's touch and go for an extra hour...? And it's Winter.

Simple scenarios that I myself would already question the trip, or make a plan.

I’d take that bet. There are enough alternative routes once you get east of Fowlerville To get around the slog of traffic. Finding chargers would not be too difficult along the I-96 corridor. With a 270 - 300 mile range you’ve got plenty of buffer.

 

[martinjlm]

Not surprised it works for you as you are all in on EV's. .....

Actually, I am really not all in on EVs. My most requested presentation from the company I work for is titled “Rumors of My Death Are Greatly Exaggerated - The Internal Combustion Engine”.

It would be correct to say that I understand EVs and recognize that they have a very legitimate space in the automotive landscape. And I understand their limitations. I am one of very few people who have experienced range anxiety in a very real way. Getting a Chevrolet Spark EV to the charger with 2 miles on the clock. With 4 people in the car. In winter. I can tell you the order in which each of the power drawing systems shut down in order to allow you to crawl to the charger. And that was NOT done on purpose.

I consistently project to the customers of our forecasts and analysis the expectations that EVs will be less than 10% of US vehicle purchases at least until 2025. And I cannot see it crossing 50% until....well....I don’t forecast out that far. And currently my forecast goes out to 2031.

***EDIT***. Actually, if you really wanted to know where I stand on ICE and EV, you can watch me yak about it with other industry experts in an interview back in June (before GT500 hp reveal and C8 launch, btw ).

 

[w3rkn]

I don't believe there are enough Electrify America DC fast chargers out there. If you look, not too many are the ultra fast ones.

If I can feel confident, I can get to 80% in about 1 hour, I don't see that as much of a hinderance. BUT... I am seeing plugs on Ford's finder site, that only do 32 Miles/ per 1 hour of charging. Which is nice for your Garage, or while at work, but not when traveling, or on the road..!



And if you look, the nearest DC FAST CHARGER to me is in Ypsilanti… and the nearest to you is in Novi. (Coincidentally, those are the ONLY 2 in Metro Detroit.)
https://www.electrifyamerica.com/locate-charger

If Ford just had a bank of those in EVERY Ford Dealer lot, I would feel more confident too...

 

[nastang87xx]

You know that EV's have a significant need for maintenance and repair. Right? Tesla's besides accidental damage really never get up keep besides balancing the tires.

Well and that's why I'm asking. I honestly hae no clue

 

[martinjlm]

You know that EV's have a significant need for maintenance and repair. Right? Tesla's besides accidental damage really never get up keep besides balancing the tires.

Well and that's why I'm asking. I honestly hae no clue

One of the reasons EVs make a lot of sense in some applications is “lifetime cost of ownership”

LCoO = Cost to acquire [higher for EV] + cost of “fuel” [much lower for EV] + cost of maintenance [significantly lower for EV]

With an EV you don’t have:

• Fluid changes (except washer fluid)
• Exhaust system maintenance
• Tune ups (even though those are now far and few between for ICE vehicles these days)

You still have tire rotation / replacement, call that even. You still have brake system maintenance, but more infrequent for EVs because the electric motors do a lot of the braking. You still have suspension system maintenance. That’s a hard call without knowing the specifics of EV skateboard suspension systems, the costs of the components, and the impact of a heavier vehicle due to the battery mass.

 

[IronG]

Actually, I am really not all in on EVs. My most requested presentation from the company I work for is titled “Rumors of My Death Are Greatly Exaggerated - The Internal Combustion Engine”.

It would be correct to say that I understand EVs and recognize that they have a very legitimate space in the automotive landscape. And I understand their limitations. I am one of very few people who have experienced range anxiety in a very real way. Getting a Chevrolet Spark EV to the charger with 2 miles on the clock. With 4 people in the car. In winter. I can tell you the order in which each of the power drawing systems shut down in order to allow you to crawl to the charger. And that was NOT done on purpose.

I consistently project to the customers of our forecasts and analysis the expectations that EVs will be less than 10% of US vehicle purchases at least until 2025. And I cannot see it crossing 50% until....well....I don’t forecast out that far. And currently my forecast goes out to 2031.

***EDIT***. Actually, if you really wanted to know where I stand on ICE and EV, you can watch me yak about it with other industry experts in an interview back in June (before GT500 hp reveal and C8 launch, btw ).

Ah but I think you are all in, as far as compared to others. Does not mean you are only about EV's though. Where I work, there are 22 registered owners so that they can use the chargers connected to the dozen slots that feed off of the solar panels on the parking lot canopies. None of the 10 or so owners I know will use it for much beyond the max range. Most are Tesla's and they all have other vehicles to use. There are also a couple my neighbors own and they too are the same. Most got them because they are the "it" car to have and believe they are cheaper to own for commuting. So for you to want to use it on long trips means to me you are all in as you seem to use it more like an ICE car rather than a EV. It is true, I am only basing my opinion on a small group so the overall use of EV's may differ across all owners.

 

[GT Pony]

. You could. You’d need to make a side trip to Smyrna, where there are several fast charge plugs. You’d want the CCS/SAE combo plug.

If EVs are going to take over the world they better standardize the charging plug configuration. It's like having a dozen different fuel nozzels at the "gas station".

 

[martinjlm]

Ah but I think you are all in, as far as compared to others. Does not mean you are only about EV's though. Where I work, there are 22 registered owners so that they can use the chargers connected to the dozen slots that feed off of the solar panels on the parking lot canopies. None of the 10 or so owners I know will use it for much beyond the max range. Most are Tesla's and they all have other vehicles to use. There are also a couple my neighbors own and they too are the same. Most got them because they are the "it" car to have and believe they are cheaper to own for commuting. So for you to want to use it on long trips means to me you are all in as you seem to use it more like an ICE car rather than a EV. It is true, I am only basing my opinion on a small group so the overall use of EV's may differ across all owners.

While I understand what you’re saying I still think you’re overstating my position. I’m not “all in”. I’m all about best tool for the job. Our Volt is perfectly capable of making our Detroit to Hilton Head annual drive and could do the trip at at much lower cost than our Cadillac SRX. But we take the SRX because we can fit 4 people plus golf clubs plus bikes plus whatever else we wanna take. An EV CUV or SUV with 300 mile range could carry all the same stuff the SRX could carry and make the trip with minimal cost.

When we drive to Ann Arbor for whatever reason we typically take the Volt because we can get there on no gas, charge while we’re there (or not) and get home on no gas if we were able to charge. Unless it’s a warm sunny day. Then we take the Camaro convertible for obvious reasons.

 

[frank s]

Nominating this thread for Second-Most-Boring Scroll-Past, close behind the Poll thread.

 

[zackmd1]

I don't believe there are enough Electrify America DC fast chargers out there. If you look, not too many are the ultra fast ones.

If I can feel confident, I can get to 80% in about 1 hour, I don't see that as much of a hinderance. BUT... I am seeing plugs on Ford's finder site, that only do 32 Miles/ per 1 hour of charging. Which is nice for your Garage, or while at work, but not when traveling, or on the road..!



And if you look, the nearest DC FAST CHARGER to me is in Ypsilanti… and the nearest to you is in Novi. (Coincidentally, those are the ONLY 2 in Metro Detroit.)
https://www.electrifyamerica.com/locate-charger

If Ford just had a bank of those in EVERY Ford Dealer lot, I would feel more confident too...

To top it off, the Mach E can't take advantage of the 350kw charger. I believe charge rate is capped under 200kw for the Mach E.

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