Mustang GT Non performance pack 4 piston brakes - Track use

[shogun32]

what is the part number for DTC-30 compound rear pads? Oddly enough the Hawk website doesn't actually list them.

The OE Ferodo DS2500 don't strike me as all that expensive at $233 vs Hawk being north of $190.

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[PaddyPrix]

Not true they are borderline dangerous because they are not cooling proparly:

The brakes were atrocious. If I tried to stop with more than .85g it would overheat the pads in two stops (2 corners). After a total of 8 hot laps I lost brakes completely, even babying the pads with 8/10ths stops.

This is because the rotors cooling is on the front of the rotors so no way for them to feed air into the rotors cooling which is why this 14" rotors warp etc. I strongly suggest upgrading to the brembo brakes.

It certainly depends on the track, for instance out here we have Buttonwillow which is lots of rhythm and scrubbing 30-40 in most turns, and one small/medium straight, and totally different from Auto Club Speedway which has 3 straights, and they mostly exit to heavy braking zones where you have to scrub off 80+ mph every 30 or so seconds. This run was on stock brakes, and made up my mind, not that it was ever really up for debate. Looking back, I was teetering on that boiling point, and one turn went from lesser stopping to absolutely no stopping. Now that experience was mine, and may differ from those who may autocross, but I wouldn't advise tracking the non-performance pack, especially when you can get 6 piston Brembos for like $1100. The difference between the two is absolutely night and day, and while I've upgraded to G-Loc's, the stock Ferodo pads that come with them are actually rather nice, certainly good enough to get the job done if you're going to street and track.

 

[bnightstar]

Now that experience was mine, and may differ from those who may autocross, but I wouldn't advise tracking the non-performance pack, especially when you can get 6 piston Brembos for like $1100. The difference between the two is absolutely night and day, and while I've upgraded to G-Loc's, the stock Ferodo pads that come with them are actually rather nice, certainly good enough to get the job done if you're going to street and track.

Sure if you are Autocrossing you probably don't need the 6 piston brembos but for real truck I think the 6 piston's are must. At my local track I get 3 truckdays out of stock Ferodo Pads but the thing is that you can have other pads for cheaper.

 

[Thub]

I've used the base GT and the PP brembos on a track, spending any more time on the base brakes is throwing bad money in after good. You might be able to get the base brakes to hang on a bit longer at the higher heat, but not for less money than swapping the brembos on.
My local track is pretty hard on brakes, and I actually destroyed the pads in the base calipers, The pads disintegrated and the rotors were badly cracked at all four corners. I ended up spending $400 just to replace the parts I destroyed, using cheap parts. And on top of all that, the fluid boiled almost immediately, and the pads faded within a lap or two, taking a whole lap and a slow cruise down the pit lane to recover at all.This was on the original all season tires.
With the PP brembos, and some Motul fluid, a total of ~$700 in my case, still using OEM pads, I was able to hit 1.3G in the heavy braking zones, on an 80 degree day, without much fear of heat related fade. As my experience increased, I was able to 'max out' the heat capability of the stock pads, but half a lap of easy driving and they were back. A better pad would have eliminated that issue entirely.
For my money, I can't imagine a better upgrade than the PP brembos.

 

[2015Etrac]

I upgraded from base brakes to the Brembos. I went with all new factory parts which cost me around $900 from Levittown Ford. I decided to go with the red Bullitt calipers. I finally had a chance to track the car this weekend. The brakes are incredible, there's not much more I can say about them. Maybe someone with more experience can push them to the limit, but I feel like they should be more than enough for me, even in the faster groups. I knew they would be good, but I never imagined they would work as well as they did. Even on the street the difference is noticeable. Maybe in the summer there may be some fade? If so, I'll just add some cooling ducts.

 

[ihasnostang]

i have a PP1 ecoboost (same as base gt as i have read). can you just throw better rotors on and keep stock calipers? i haven't been on track yet but when i do road america is closest.. and is DOT4 fluid correct?

 

[shogun32]

can you just throw better rotors on and keep stock calipers?

Yes, if you can actually find some that vent on the backside, ie correctly. I would have though between Baer, Woodward, Brembo, EBC, and another half dozen players, *somebody* would have cast one instead of blindly adhering to Ford's questionable decision tree. Maybe @SteedaTech can fulfill this need? But then again if you want serious brakes, you go 6-pots so it's understandable that the manufacturers have all relegated the 4-pot community to their own devices.

 

[2015Etrac]

i have a PP1 ecoboost (same as base gt as i have read). can you just throw better rotors on and keep stock calipers? i haven't been on track yet but when i do road america is closest.. and is DOT4 fluid correct?

I believe a few companies make 2 piece rotors for the 4 piston brakes with rear vents, however, they are expensive and for the price you'd pay for them you could pick up a set of 6 piston Brembos which are significantly better.

 

[ihasnostang]

I believe a few companies make 2 piece rotors for the 4 piston brakes with rear vents, however, they are expensive and for the price you'd pay for them you could pick up a set of 6 piston Brembos which are significantly better.

randomly saw these pop up in my email. $591

https://www.steeda.com/steeda-s550-...E1xyxglNE44FLzfyX_hVGkDNVOkJhU-4aAt8KEALw_wcB

 

[Bluemustang]

I have been told basically do not track the base GT 4 piston calipers without fixing the front rotor design. Some track guys have done this and found themselves suddenly with no braking power after one hard lap although YMMV. I have also been told that if you fix the rotor design with something like the Steeda or Baer Eradispeed and pair with a good set of track pads you're probably okay. The base GT calipers are actually pretty good just the rotor design is wrong. But, the 6 piston Brembos are better. I surmise the main issue is cooling. As long as you are able to get some cooling to brakes, you should be fine until you become faster and also doing longer sessions. Overall 6 pistons are better, but I don't think there is a problem running the 4 pistons for awhile, especially if you are not that fast yet.

I did Steeda slotted rotors all around and G-LOC pads. With the correct rotor, good track fluid and pads I think you'll be okay. That said for all that, 6 piston Brembos are a cheaper and better option. The reason I did what I did is because the Brembos won't clear my stock 18" rims, which I was not ready to get rid of.

I plan on swapping to the PP front undertray in the spring which has airflow channels which helps cool the brakes. And from the recent discovery from the Vorshlag thread, it's been shown that air deflectors can be used in conjunction with the undertray airflow channels to create more cooling than actual ducting would, funneled right to the rotor. In summary, I believe if you can adequately cool the brakes 1). change front rotor to proper vented design 2). get air to the brakes and also using high temperature pads and fluid that can take the track abuse, the 4 pistons should be more than satisfactory for most people. However, the 6 piston Brembos will give more stopping power and added consistency and pedal feel.

 

[2015Etrac]

Nice deal. For that price though you're only about $200 off a brand new factory Brembo setup or you can buy a set of used take off Brembos for about $550. The stock brakes worked really well on the street for me, but the Brembos are significantly better on both the street and track. I see they have the PP rotors on sale for $719, which is a really good price too.

 

[2015Etrac]

I have been told basically do not track the base GT 4 piston calipers without fixing the front rotor design. Some track guys have done this and found themselves suddenly with no braking power after one hard lap although YMMV. I have also been told that if you fix the rotor design with something like the Steeda or Baer Eradispeed and pair with a good set of track pads you're probably okay. The base GT calipers are actually pretty good just the rotor design is wrong. But, the 6 piston Brembos are better. I surmise the main issue is cooling. As long as you are able to get some cooling to brakes, you should be fine until you become faster and also doing longer sessions. Overall 6 pistons are better, but I don't think there is a problem running the 4 pistons for awhile, especially if you are not that fast yet.

I did Steeda slotted rotors all around and G-LOC pads. With the correct rotor, good track fluid and pads I think you'll be okay. That said for all that, 6 piston Brembos are a cheaper and better option. The reason I did what I did is because the Brembos won't clear my stock 18" rims, which I was not ready to get rid of.

I plan on swapping to the PP front undertray in the spring which has airflow channels which helps cool the brakes. And from the recent discovery from the Vorshlag thread, it's been shown that air deflectors can be used in conjunction with the undertray airflow channels to create more cooling than actual ducting would, funneled right to the rotor. In summary, I believe if you can adequately cool the brakes 1). change front rotor to proper vented design 2). get air to the brakes and also using high temperature pads and fluid that can take the track abuse, the 4 pistons should be more than satisfactory for most people. However, the 6 piston Brembos will give more stopping power and added consistency and pedal feel.

The Performance Pack belly pan and spoiler are on my list of spring upgrades as well. I didn't realize how effective they made the cooling system on the PP cars using just the deflectors. I wish I could keep my California Special splitter though, I like it more than the PP version. Another downside is that it's about a $800 upgrade if you get the control arms with deflectors, belly pan, and spoiler. Shipping is a fortune too for those parts.

 

[Bluemustang]

The Performance Pack belly pan and spoiler are on my list of spring upgrades as well. I didn't realize how effective they made the cooling system on the PP cars using just the deflectors. I wish I could keep my California Special splitter though, I like it more than the PP version. Another downside is that it's about a $800 upgrade if you get the control arms with deflectors, belly pan, and spoiler. Shipping is a fortune too for those parts.

I agree on the CS splitter - have it on my car. Looks great. I can't see how functional it actually is because it flexes so much. Might smooth out the airflow a little bit as it hits the front bumper, but other than that... I'll probably do the PP belly pan/splitter along with the ZL1 addons splitter extension for a little added functionality. From hearing that Flyhalf had his ZL1 splitter on without splitter rods for over a year and was fine - tells me it's ok. Maybe you do the same.
You could also later on add a wicker bill to the GT350 track pack spoiler for more downforce.

If you're willing to get PP control arms, just get the Steeda control arms. I can't remember which one (lateral or tension link) has the air deflector on it but the Steeda lateral arm is more functional than the PP one. The roll center correction has some magic. Makes the car feel just right - not to mention being able to push it harder due to more grip.

 

[2015Etrac]

I agree on the CS splitter - have it on my car. Looks great. I can't see how functional it actually is because it flexes so much. Might smooth out the airflow a little bit as it hits the front bumper, but other than that... I'll probably do the PP belly pan/splitter along with the ZL1 addons splitter extension for a little added functionality. From hearing that Flyhalf had his ZL1 splitter on without splitter rods for over a year and was fine - tells me it's ok. Maybe you do the same.
You could also later on add a wicker bill to the GT350 track pack spoiler for more downforce.

If you're willing to get PP control arms, just get the Steeda control arms. I can't remember which one (lateral or tension link) has the air deflector on it but the Steeda lateral arm is more functional than the PP one. The roll center correction has some magic. Makes the car feel just right - not to mention being able to push it harder due to more grip.

Yeah, I'm looking to get the Steeda control arms. They have a really good sale right now for the bearing version, but with Christmas coming they will have to wait. Hopefully by spring I'll have new camber plates, PP splitter and belly pan, and the control arms. Oh, and tires. I really want to start tracking the car this year. I was amazed how well the stock Brembos worked on the track last month, and I'm sure the cooling vents will make them even better.

 

[shogun32]

Shipping is a fortune too for those parts.

not necessarily. I got my belly pan for $130 at the local dealer a mile from me. They get parts shipped in every day. And it arrived next day to boot.

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