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- #16
AmenTrust me, the team that made the vehicle knows more than you.
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AmenTrust me, the team that made the vehicle knows more than you.
Exactly. I use to own a car of another brand and was part of another forum where every person there thought they knew more than the manufacturer. From wheel size to oil that should be used to torque spec to mods that everyone else said ya know dont put those on and they would anyway. It was generally then these same people that in a month or two would come back with their car all F*%k#d up and blame the Manufacturer for making junk and refused to admit that it was what they did to it ignoring others advice. The ones I will never understand are the ones who claim they know better than the Manufacturer on oil weights and use oil weights other then what is recommended.Trust me, the team that made the vehicle knows more than you.
9. Using the special tool and a soft-faced hammer, drive the pinion assembly out of the outer pinion bearing and remove it through the rear of the differential housing.
Everybody has an opinion... You just have to be careful who you listen to. Pick and choose wisely.But when an engineer who was at one time very close to the modular engine development program says he would never use 5W20 in any modular engine I'm going to listen to him.
I'm going to note that even factory shop manuals sometimes gloss over the amount of difficulty involved. Like this little item I'm currently wrestling with . . .
Norm
In reasonably normal driving - reasonably normal use being what Ford considers that to be, with the nod going to lower viscosities specifically for fleet mpg reasons - we're not likely to hear much of anything. It's a case of designing for the non-enthusiast mass market, where it only takes only "good enough" to be good enough for their light duty.I personally have never heard of a Coyote having problems with longevity because they were using the manufacturer spec of 5w-20. I bet you haven't either.
One engineer? who use to work ? I mean ok but anyone can find 1 person who agrees with them to back up what they say. IM not being mean or rude but what i mean is let's look at anti vaccers.. Not a single shred of evidence but the whole medical industry is wrong and they are right because they found one guy who said so. Artificial sweeteners, specifically aspartame, one o the most studied substances on the earth with zero scientific proof they cause alzheimer's or any of the other claims against them yet they found one study somewhere and herold that as proof. even though is has long been proven fake facts. Again no offence but when someone wants to believe something they will find and take any proof to say hte are right even though 99 percent of the industry says it is false.But when an engineer who was at one time very close to the modular engine development program says he would never use 5W20 in any modular engine I'm going to listen to him.
I'm going to note that even factory shop manuals sometimes gloss over the amount of difficulty involved. Like this little item I'm currently wrestling with . . .
Norm
Yes, meeting happens, "we want to sell these lowering springs but if we tell people that removing the pins is a chore that will take magor tools and hours of time they won't buy them". Solution. make a video that is not a lie but "can be" done with hand tools and just say take out this pin and leave it at that. Make the video look as easy as possible.The makers of the instructions don't want to scare you away with the inevitable hiccups that you'll encounter so they purposely make them seem like a piece of cake. I've said as much to 1 or 2 vendors on here already.
Just be thorough and explain how to deal with the hiccups … but then that makes for longer instructions, ergo scaring customer away, so ain't happening.
Honestly, you could put a variety of oils in your Mustang and never have an issue. Yes, they switched to 5W-20 for CAFE reasons, but there is nothing wrong with running a 5W-20 oil in your Mustang on the street. That oil can take whatever abuse you throw at it... on the street. I wouldn't put it in a track car.In reasonably normal driving - reasonably normal use being what Ford considers that to be, with the nod going to lower viscosities specifically for fleet mpg reasons - we're not likely to hear much of anything. It's a case of designing for the non-enthusiast mass market, where it only takes only "good enough" to be good enough for their light duty.
What you or I or that ex-Ford engineer consider "reasonably normal" may well differ enough from that to make 5W20 marginal at best. Things like normally running at higher revs in lower gears, swapping to steeper axle gears, shorter tires, harder acceleration, harder braking, and harder cornering all work the oil harder in one way or another.
Just so you know, I'm not pitching for the use of something like straight 40 or 20W50 weight here. But a small step up to, say 10W30 that some of the earliest modular engines specified, for enthusiastic normal driving would probably be a wise choice. I think the Boss engines got something like a 15W40 recommendation for their track time . . . must have been a reason for that, that could be extended to using more than 5W20 in situations midway between easy street driving and all-out track.
Norm
He ended up being a crew chief at the NASCAR Cup level. Downplaying his credentials like that is your loss. Einstein was only one person . . .One engineer? who use to work ? I mean ok but anyone can find 1 person who agrees with them to back up what they say.
I'm afraid you're missing the point. They're not saying go back to 5W20 for reasons involving most aspects of oil performance. They're saying that because once back on the street Ford wants you to run the more fuel-efficient oil. And they have a vested interest in saying that almost certainly because that's the way the car was certified for both emissions and mpg.Further proof that you should NOT change your oil weight is again the manufacturer of the car and in the section in your owner's manual under tracking (p248) the car they specifically say to change to a different oil weight (5w30) but to then to NOT run that weight after tracking the car to go back to 5w20. they are very admit that you only use 5w20 daily. But again (not directed at you) people say they know better than the manufacturer.
Maybe it can, and just maybe not as well. But if it's all the same to you I'd rather have oil that's a little more than 20 weight any time I'm up over half a lat-g and the inboard cam cover is draining faster than usual and faster than what most drivers put their cars through. Which I suspect happens more often than you might expect.Honestly, you could put a variety of oils in your Mustang and never have an issue. Yes, they switched to 5W-20 for CAFE reasons, but there is nothing wrong with running a 5W-20 oil in your Mustang on the street. That oil can take whatever abuse you throw at it... on the street. I wouldn't put it in a track car.
Already considered.There's a lot of variables here. Climate is very important when it comes to oil.
One of the things I understand about VI improvers is that the more widely separated the two numbers are, the more of that stuff you have to use and that there is a downside involved.The way an oil shears is pretty important to keep in mind here as well. 5W-20 grade oils tend to have less VII's than the broad range of 5W-30 grade and therefore are less prone to shear. I would consider all 0W and 5W-20 oils to have a very good base stock.
You run 10W-30 and I currently run 0W-30 lol. Guess that makes me a hypocrite .He ended up being a crew chief at the NASCAR Cup level. Downplaying his credentials like that is your loss. Einstein was only one person . . .
I'm afraid you're missing the point. They're not saying go back to 5W20 for reasons involving most aspects of oil performance. They're saying that because once back on the street Ford wants you to run the more fuel-efficient oil. And they have a vested interest in saying that almost certainly because that's the way the car was certified for both emissions and mpg.
Do you follow the directions precisely for every single thing in your life precisely as outlined in the directions? Or do you allow yourself a few reasonably well considered variations?
If it matters, I run 10W30 year round, street and track. Though for the first 10,000 miles or so I did stay with the 5W20.
Norm