760hp may have been a lie.

[millhouse]

186mph is redline in 5th gear for the DCT. It is highly unlikely that the GT500 would be able to accelerate beyond that speed once shifted into a .68 6th gear. It would be drag/power limited.

Um, I don't think so.

Using Tremecs DCT published ratios for 5th gear of 0.81 or 0.86...using a 3.73 rear gear (I can't see it being any higher) puts the max mph at 202 mph for the .81 and 191 mph for the .86 with an RPM limit of 7500.

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[Snoopy49]

 

[FastCarFanBoy]

Um, I don't think so.

Using Tremecs DCT published ratios for 5th gear of 0.81 or 0.86...using a 3.73 rear gear (I can't see it being any higher) puts the max mph at 202 mph for the .81 and 191 mph for the .86 with an RPM limit of 7500.

Uhhh, It's easily verifiable using a gear ratio speed calculator. I have also watched the Goodwood in car video of the tach and speed in each gear and max speed in 5th cannot be more than 188 and is most likely actually the 186mph that has been recently hinted at.

 

[millhouse]

Uhhh, It's easily verifiable using a gear ratio speed calculator. I have also watched the Goodwood in car video of the tach and speed in each gear and max speed in 5th cannot be more than 188 and is most likely actually the 186mph that has been recently hinted at.

You're correct, which is exactly how I (as well as Snoopy49) came up with 191mph.

Please do tell how your 186 mph came to be. What transmission ratios did you use? What final drive ratio did you use? What tire diameter did you use? What RPM did you use?

 

[shogun32]

geezus, marketing == "bald-faced lies" has been true since the first cave man was selling real estate. And that's ignoring the fact that English majors have no clue about engineering terms and get them wrong all the damn time. It's obvious no engineer actually fact-checks marketing copy.

 

[shogun32]

puts the max mph at 202 mph for the .81 and 191 mph for the .86 with an RPM limit of 7500.

under what conditions? Sitting still on a dyno? Or outside on the track? A dyno offers no wind resistance. Outside there is that minor factor of wind resistance (speed cubed as I recall). Who gives a sh*t if Ford put in an ECU limit? If you're buying yours to take to the Salts to set a class record, I'm sure Ford will sell you an unlocked ECU along with a stack of paper (technical and legalese) to read and understand.

 

[millhouse]

under what conditions? Sitting still on a dyno? Or outside on the track? A dyno offers no wind resistance. Outside there is that minor factor of wind resistance (speed cubed as I recall). Who gives a sh*t if Ford put in an ECU limit? If you're buying yours to take to the Salts to set a class record, I'm sure Ford will sell you an unlocked ECU along with a stack of paper (technical and legalese) to read and understand.

So only mustangs are effected by wind resistance? The ZL1 is quite capable of hitting 200 mph without running into wind issues, yet people think that the GT500 is a flying brick? Come on now, you don't really believe it's power limited because of wind do you?

 

[shogun32]

The ZL1 is quite capable of hitting 200 mph without running into wind issues, yet people think that the GT500 is a flying brick?

It took ~1000HP to hit 217mph with the modern ZL1 (http://hennesseyperformance.com/veh...camaro/the-exorcist-hpe1000-supercharged-zl1/). This (https://autowise.com/2017-chevy-camaro-zl1-passed-200-mph-measuring-top-speed/) claims 202mph out of the 650HP engined car. Neither one states what the limit was - HP, lift, drag, RPM, balls?

I'm sure if you punched into the calculator the particulars it would claim the ZL1 could go faster than either of these measured results. Believing some simpleton calculator is as useful as touting HP numbers where parasitic loss was artificially set to zero.

Nobody knows what the unleashed top speed is of a production GT500. First because there are no production GT500 cars in existence and nobody has an unlocked ECU handy. I can't believe anybody is bitching about an electronic top speed limit.

 

[millhouse]

It took ~1000HP to hit 217mph with the modern ZL1 (http://hennesseyperformance.com/veh...camaro/the-exorcist-hpe1000-supercharged-zl1/). This (https://autowise.com/2017-chevy-camaro-zl1-passed-200-mph-measuring-top-speed/) claims 202mph out of the 650HP engined car. Neither one states what the limit was - HP, lift, drag, RPM, balls?

I'm sure if you punched into the calculator the particulars it would claim the ZL1 could go faster than either of these measured results. Believing some simpleton calculator is as useful as touting HP numbers where parasitic loss was artificially set to zero.

Nobody knows what the unleashed top speed is of a production GT500. First because there are no production GT500 cars in existence and nobody has an unlocked ECU handy. I can't believe anybody is bitching about an electronic top speed limit.

You're mistaking the ZL1 with an M6 with one with the A10. A10 ZL1 in stock form is capable of 200 mph stock due to it's 0.85 eighth gear.

https://autowise.com/2017-chevy-camaro-zl1-passed-200-mph-measuring-top-speed/

The calculator doesn't lie....and the 191 mph calculation is likely the absolute minimum as there is no way they are using any more than a 3.73 rear end in the thing...and they certainly aren't hitting a wall with power output vs aero.

 

[shogun32]

A10 ZL1 in stock form is capable of 200 mph stock due to it's 0.85 eighth gear.
...and they certainly aren't hitting a wall with power output vs aero.

Hey genius, how come the Camaro didn't go even faster than 202mph when they shifted into 9th and 10th gears? I mean, that's what they are there for, right? To go even faster?

Hell, I could get the GT500 to go to 209.2MPH, just by clicking the trans into 6th and loaf around at 6500 RPM.

 

[millhouse]

Hey genius, how come the Camaro didn't go even faster than 202mph when they shifted into 9th and 10th gears? I mean, that's what they are there for, right? To go even faster?


Hell, I could get the GT500 to go to 209.2MPH, just by clicking the trans into 6th and loaf around at 6500 RPM.

Because you really don't seem to be grasping what we are saying here, I'll answer.

It's because 9th gear is too steep of an overdrive to continue to accelerate due to wind resistance.

With that said, why don't you go back and look at the gear ratios that I posted for the GT500’s 191 mph top speed (unlimited). Notice that this is not an excessive overdrive gear, but a usable high speed acceleration overdrive. Look at the final drive ratio of the ZL1 camaro. Take the 8th gear ratio of 0.85 and multiply it by the rear end ratio of 2.85 and you end up with a final drive ratio of 2.42:1. Now do the same with the mustang. 0.86 x 3.73 gives a final drive ratio of 3.21:1. This gives the advantage to the mustang at those speeds. Remember, this is multiplying the torque from the engine…the higher the number here the more rear wheel torque…the more instantaneous acceleration. At 7500 RPM, the mustang is still accelerating.

If the GT500 has any less than a 3.73 gear (or an overdrive in-between 5th and 6th), the car would absolutely hit an unlimited 200 mph. It has the power and aero to do so.

 

[shogun32]

oh so wind resistance matters now?

The ZL1 in (edit: 7)th gear tops out ~180mph at 6500 RPM supposedly () so for the car to have gone any faster they clicked into (edit: 8)th gear. A theoretical 202mph run while also running max tire PSI could be accomplished (assuming no slippage) around (edit: 6194) RPM which is well below red-line.

Another perfectly valid reason for Ford to curtail top speed to 185mph is that there are precious few tires rated any higher than that.

 

[millhouse]

oh so wind resistance matters now?

The ZL1 in 8th gear tops out ~180mph at 6500 RPM supposedly () so for the car to have gone any faster they clicked into 9th gear. A theoretical 202mph run while also running max tire PSI could be accomplished (assuming no slippage) around 5930 RPM which is well below red-line.

Another perfectly valid reason for Ford to curtail top speed to 185mph is that there are precious few tires rated any higher than that.

God your dense. I never said wind wasn’t a factor. Go back and read my posts and links. The 200 mph runs are done in 8th gear. Go back and read the article I posted. The ZL1 shifts INTO 8th gear at 180mph. If not for the lack of power and wind, it has a theoretical speed in that gear of 217 mph. Run any simple RPM calculator and you’ll get the same answer I’m telling you.

Your 185 mph guess is complete BS.

 

[millhouse]

Just Incase you don’t believe the previous article. Here is a another.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-ca...amaro-zl1-shifts-into-eighth-gear-at-180-mph/

 

[shogun32]

Y-rated tires are certified to 186mph. Aside from dedicated racing tires, there isn't a higher classification that seems to be defined. Why is it so unthinkable that the lawyers would have capped the car at the highest rated street tire speeds?

If the Camaro can only hit 202'ish out of a theoretical max of 217, it's short 5-7% of what could be accomplished. So your theoretical max of 191 for the GT500 becomes 181. Even if Ford pulled a rabbit out of their hat and only suffers a 3% shortage, that's 185MPH.

Or are you saying you have insider knowledge that the GT500 engineering is so excellent it will pull all the way to redline in 8th gear and bounce off the rev limiter and thus has proven to reach the theoretical max a simple-minded calculator says is possible? And you're pissed because they won't let you go all the way?

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