2020 GT500 Power Figure Clarification

[Snoopy49]

I've been into cars for a long time and I've never heard anyone quote a horsepower figure based on the losses to a supercharger...because it DOESN"T MATTER and WHO would care??because it's not like you can go without the blower, lol! Some claims have been made as to efficiency of a power adder assisting in that final number, but that's much different.

Go to 6:15 in the video below.

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[DRP Motorsports]

I think it will be interesting to see what the new GT500 will make at the rear wheels. I would not be surprised to see some SAE wheel figures on a Dynojet clip the 700HP mark in good air. If so, that would not be far from what a stock Demon does on 93 octane.

 

[9secondko]

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/08/05/ford-shelby-mustang-gt500-engine-details/

So Autoblog has apparently weighed in earlier today. but they confuse the issue. They seems to understand that the supercharger is what takes the number down from 850, but then they go ahead and say it’s 850 before “driveline loss.” That would mean that the car is 760 at the wheels.

The direct quote:

“Ford considered turbochargers, but the parasitic loss from a supercharger was worth it to improve throttle response and power delivery. Ford engineers say the engine makes “well over 850 gross horsepower” before driveline loss.”

I am wagering they simply mixed up their words. Something tells me Ford PR is going to have a training day for the engineers to know how to speak to the simpler minds of auto journalists.

<Begin Rant>
And by the way, for what it’s worth, the line about turbos is way off. If that was the case, the GT would be supercharged as well and the upcoming FI C8s would be also. We will see about those. It’s more that the 5.2 and 5.0 were already setup fro supercharging and Hackett didn’t want to spend anything on developing a proper ecoboost V8. Throttle response is great on a TT setup done right. the supercharging is great. But let’s not be mindless when Ford rolls out the “reasons” why it’s not TT. Not only would the power figures be 100+ hp higher at the same boost level, but the engine would be working easier as well.
</Rant>

 

[GrabberBlue]

Hopefully it is underrated, a higher than expected wheel horsepower number would be great.

 

[Myshelby3425]

If this car makes 760whp and runs a 10.8 in the 1/4 im canceling my order.

 

[V00D00]

If this car makes 760whp and runs a 10.8 in the 1/4 im canceling my order.

at 760whp its running deep 10s at 140. at 760 chp its likely a 10.8/133

 

[jwhite]

Just going to share my little experience with a supercharger, on my 15 Mustang Gt/PP, stock hp was rated 430 crack. I added a twin clutch 1pc driveshaft and an Eaton/Roush 2.3 SC’er. The car was dyno’ed and produced 630rwhp. I did not dyno the car prior to install. Roush was claiming 727 crank hp. That’s a 300hp gain. If no improvements to the 5.2 FPC was done and crank hp is 526, you add a similar SC’er couldn’t we assume a similar gain? You do the math, but that’s darn close to 850?
And yes I know the gt500 is a cross plane crank, with much better internals and better air flow. So,,,,,,,,,,? I’m still on the fence with the supposed hp #’s

 

[BmacIL]

What??? Uhh, no.

Uhh, yes.

Gross HP is HP w/o subtracting parasitic or accessory loads. Parasitic includes driving the supercharger.

 

[jwhite]

Uhh, yes.

Gross HP is HP w/o subtracting parasitic or accessory loads. Parasitic includes driving the supercharger.

I’m sure some have miss typed or something, but people are acting like a Supercharger actually robs power?? Heard a guy on YouTube say the engine probably made 850 and the drain of the supercharger brought it down to 760??? Lol
Yes a SC’er uses power, but it makes a LOT more !

 

[BmacIL]

I’m sure some have miss typed or something, but people are acting like a Supercharger actually robs power?? Heard a guy on YouTube say the engine probably made 850 and the drain of the supercharger brought it down to 760??? Lol
Yes a SC’er uses power, but it makes a LOT more !

Yes, that's how it works. You get a lot more than you draw, but it does draw a significant amount of power. The cooling system has to cool the gross power. What goes to the transmission is SAE net brake horsepower.

 

[Hack]

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/08/05/ford-shelby-mustang-gt500-engine-details/

So Autoblog has apparently weighed in earlier today. but they confuse the issue. They seems to understand that the supercharger is what takes the number down from 850, but then they go ahead and say it’s 850 before “driveline loss.” That would mean that the car is 760 at the wheels.

The direct quote:

“Ford considered turbochargers, but the parasitic loss from a supercharger was worth it to improve throttle response and power delivery. Ford engineers say the engine makes “well over 850 gross horsepower” before driveline loss.”

I am wagering they simply mixed up their words. Something tells me Ford PR is going to have a training day for the engineers to know how to speak to the simpler minds of auto journalists.

<Begin Rant>
And by the way, for what it’s worth, the line about turbos is way off. If that was the case, the GT would be supercharged as well and the upcoming FI C8s would be also. We will see about those. It’s more that the 5.2 and 5.0 were already setup fro supercharging and Hackett didn’t want to spend anything on developing a proper ecoboost V8. Throttle response is great on a TT setup done right. the supercharging is great. But let’s not be mindless when Ford rolls out the “reasons” why it’s not TT. Not only would the power figures be 100+ hp higher at the same boost level, but the engine would be working easier as well.
</Rant>

Generally turbos DO slow down throttle response. There are some newer technologies companies like Ferrari are working on to reduce turbo lag, but superchargers do have the benefit of a quicker response time than turbos. The turbos need exhaust to spin up, whereas superchargers are always spun up due to being belt driven.

I still would have liked to see Ford make the best TT V8 setup they could rather than the supercharged version. It would probably give at least a higher peak power.

 

[PP0001]

Generally turbos DO slow down throttle response. There are some newer technologies companies like Ferrari are working on to reduce turbo lag, but superchargers do have the benefit of a quicker response time than turbos. The turbos need exhaust to spin up, whereas superchargers are always spun up due to being belt driven.

I still would have liked to see Ford make the best TT V8 setup they could rather than the supercharged version. It would probably give at least a higher peak power.

Jim, to your point about turbo's slowing down throttle response, I remember when I was racing back in the day when I had an '86 Dodge Omni GLH and was sponsored by Goodyear for my tires and we would actually shave the tires down to two or three 32nd's for less tread roll over. When Yokohama came out with the A008R's they were an outstanding tire for the track and it did not take me long to switch tire brands.

Getting back to turbo lag it was quite noticeable back in the mid 80's with my GLH and other cars such as the Merkur and the SVO's as well.

I can tell you without any hesitation that once the new GT500 is launched that there will be a lot of casualties with the GT500 based on a great deal of power and immediate throttle response.

I would suggest that a great deal of people purchasing this very powerful GT500 may have never experienced a 760 HP automobile let alone operating a vehicle with that kind of horsepower that is directly linked to a supercharger.

Something that I am not proud of was when I wrote off a brand new 2009 GT500 as I was not paying attention during a Sunday morning spirited drive in backroads of South Carolina which included cold tires (Goodyears on that car were brutal), a couple of increased HP modifications, dense cool air and when I got on it things did not turn out well.

Just a couple years ago I was given a 707 HP Richard Petty Mustang for the weekend and again I almost lost it on numerous occasions due to the cold tire issue, cool morning with dense air, lots of horsepower and immediate throttle response.

I hope that I am wrong but I will still suggest that we can expect numerous mishaps when in the hands of some enthusiasts that have never driven a vehicle generating this kind of horsepower, torque and immediate throttle response.

 

[Tomster]

Jim, to your point about turbo's slowing down throttle response, I remember when I was racing back in the day when I had an '86 Dodge Omni GLH and was sponsored by Goodyear for my tires and we would actually shave the tires down to two or three 32nd's for less tread roll over. When Yokohama came out with the A008R's they were an outstanding tire for the track and it did not take me long to switch tire brands.

Getting back to turbo lag it was quite noticeable back in the mid 80's with my GLH and other cars such as the Merkur and the SVO's as well.

I can tell you without any hesitation that once the new GT500 is launched that there will be a lot of casualties with the GT500 based on a great deal of power and immediate throttle response.

I would suggest that a great deal of people purchasing this very powerful GT500 may have never experienced a 760 HP automobile let alone operating a vehicle with that kind of horsepower that is directly linked to a supercharger.

Something that I am not proud of was when I wrote off a brand new 2009 GT500 as I was not paying attention during a Sunday morning spirited drive in backroads of South Carolina which included cold tires (Goodyears on that car were brutal), a couple of increased HP modifications, dense cool air and when I got on it things did not turn out well.

Just a couple years ago I was given a 707 HP Richard Petty Mustang for the weekend and again I almost lost it on numerous occasions due to the cold tire issue, cool morning with dense air, lots of horsepower and immediate throttle response.

I hope that I am wrong but I will still suggest that we can expect numerous mishaps when in the hands of some enthusiasts that have never driven a vehicle generating this kind of horsepower, torque and immediate throttle response.

And for that reason, I think people with superior skills and reflexes who fly high performance jet aircraft should get their VINs first. They should report back on the handling characteristics as well as provide multiple YouTube videos demonstrating how they handle on the track as well.

I would like to volunteer......

 

[65Terdlingua]

The 850hp rating is based on the cylinder pressure that is produced in the engine thanks to the supercharger. Mathematically, the engine makes gross (total) hp of 850 based on this pressure. However, in order to create that much pressure you have to turn the supercharger, and that's what 'robs' 90hp from the engine. So your net power is 760 at the crank, not wheels.

 

[machsmith]

You will have the occasional guy who doesnt know when to keep his foot out of it (see cars a coffee mustang YouTube vids), otherwise 760 hp is easy to handle. It's not, touch gas and all 760 come on. I'm sure it will take a good amount of throttle feed to make it jump on you, not just a tap.
On the object of turbo lag, I believe the GT has an anti lag spool feature in certain drive modes, which reduces lag almost entirely. You won't notice much difference between it and the supercharger.

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