Shorty vs. Long Tube Headers

[Grimace427]

Can anyone tell from the pics above where are the provisions (bungs) for the oxygen sensors?

Just after the start of the collector, on the top(right side of photo) side of the header.

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[Free Agent]

Just after the start of the collector, on the top(right side of photo) side of the header.

I see it now, good catch, you can barely see the bung. Thanks.

 

[wproctor411]

The main advantage of long tubes is the fact that it removes the cats. You will get the biggest gain by removing the cats, a small gain from going to a well designed short header over the factory header and another small gain from well designed long tubes over shorties. With proper design, the H/X pipe work in conjunction with the headers to change the shape and area under the power curve.

I'm not sure where these comments of the coyote being peaky are coming from. Its not a peaky motor.

I have long tubes and both on road and off road x-pipes. Honestly the torque and cooler running engine are what I see as the main benefit. You'll save about 10 degrees from burnout box to end of a quarter mile run. I've had all the dyno runs for both combos done along with some other bits. The OR/X pipe only adds 5-7 rwhp, both add about 40rwhp and 30rwtq and throttle response is improved with long tubes and the ORX helps a little more. I gained about 70whp and 50rwtq with long tubes, tune, and CAI. I'm sitting on 425/405 on 93 pump gas up from 355/346. When we ran on 100 low lead with very aggressive tuning added another 15hp but only a few ftlbs. All runs were done in 2 days at similar times in similar weather on the same dyno at Brenspeed. A throttle body can help throttle response and smooth out the idle even more with this combo, but is worthless for stock motor and exhaust, unless you race tool boxes and dyno sheets.

The torque curve is much broader, I get about 390-400 ft lbs over a 3000 rpm band, just falling off as the HP hits 400 at the wheels. The engines love high rpm but the long tubes bring on the torque sooner.

Food for thought-
During m y test runs another car had similar mods and this is what we found.
A 1-3/4 primary had 5 more torque and 5 less HP than than 1-7/8 on an NA motor. Flatter torqu.
Use 1-7/8 primary if your adding boost.
Both left the engines 15-20 degrees cooler after a dyno pull.
Normal driving has minimal affect on temp.

Check out my pics you can see both cars being worked on- same color and options which was wild. Then I drove it like I stole it.

 

[RTD]

And someone please clarify for me as I'm not up on this, is that an undercarriage picture of the S197 or S550?

If that is the S550 it looks like the cats are in the exact same positions. EDIT (Judging by the color I'd see it looks like Grabber Blue, so I'm guessing S197 and the cats look different too)



I did not see that in the article. Where did you pull that from?

This is the only other picture I could find and I can't tell if the cat in integrated or not into the passenger side manifold. I'll have to take your word for it.

Dafuq is that thing up top where the H crossover should be?

 

[StangBANG]

Looks like a mac prochamber ..when ever this becomes available for the 550 it will be on my car.. I think it produces the best sound for a stang. I've had one on all of my stangs and love it.

 

[Free Agent]

I'm guessing its a stock resonator since this is the stock exhaust.

My thing is that the whole exhaust looks welded, looks like you will have to cut & weld to do exhaust. I was hoping for bolt on axle backs or mid pipes frankly.

 

[StangBANG]

After closer look it is not a prochamber. .like free agent said it's probably a resonator of some form

 

[Tim Hilliard]

I have long tubes and both on road and off road x-pipes. Honestly the torque and cooler running engine are what I see as the main benefit. You'll save about 10 degrees from burnout box to end of a quarter mile run. I've had all the dyno runs for both combos done along with some other bits. The OR/X pipe only adds 5-7 rwhp, both add about 40rwhp and 30rwtq and throttle response is improved with long tubes and the ORX helps a little more. I gained about 70whp and 50rwtq with long tubes, tune, and CAI. I'm sitting on 425/405 on 93 pump gas up from 355/346. When we ran on 100 low lead with very aggressive tuning added another 15hp but only a few ftlbs. All runs were done in 2 days at similar times in similar weather on the same dyno at Brenspeed. A throttle body can help throttle response and smooth out the idle even more with this combo, but is worthless for stock motor and exhaust, unless you race tool boxes and dyno sheets.

The torque curve is much broader, I get about 390-400 ft lbs over a 3000 rpm band, just falling off as the HP hits 400 at the wheels. The engines love high rpm but the long tubes bring on the torque sooner.

Food for thought-
During m y test runs another car had similar mods and this is what we found.
A 1-3/4 primary had 5 more torque and 5 less HP than than 1-7/8 on an NA motor. Flatter torqu.
Use 1-7/8 primary if your adding boost.
Both left the engines 15-20 degrees cooler after a dyno pull.
Normal driving has minimal affect on temp.

Check out my pics you can see both cars being worked on- same color and options which was wild. Then I drove it like I stole it.

Thanks for posting this. Your data follows what would be expected (plus your 1/4 mile time clears up any doubt) The smaller diameter long tube will provide a better torque curve but once a blower goes on you don't want velocity you want volume (bigger is better-roughly) Great post with factual information.

 

[S550Boss]

It's a resonator that Ford patented well over a year ago.

 

[908ssp]

It's a resonator that Ford patented well over a year ago.

I think it will improve the sound with free flowing end cans. There is something happening when you put a muffler in the middle like that and run pipe afterwards that doesn't happen when the mufflers are at the ends of the pipes.

 

[MustangSteve]

And someone please clarify for me as I'm not up on this, is that an undercarriage picture of the S197 or S550?

If that is the S550 it looks like the cats are in the exact same positions. EDIT (Judging by the color I'd see it looks like Grabber Blue, so I'm guessing S197 and the cats look different too)



I did not see that in the article. Where did you pull that from?

This is the only other picture I could find and I can't tell if the cat in integrated or not into the passenger side manifold. I'll have to take your word for it.

The photo is from a recent Ford media event where they announced the power and weight numbers for S550. The big assembly on the table is actually the entire exhaust system for the 2.3 Ecoboost engine. That's why it only has the one side cat because that bolts up to the turbo outlet. After the resonator it splits into the dual outlet system.

The smaller unit is the V8 header with integrated cat.

 

[Free Agent]

The photo is from a recent Ford media event where they announced the power and weight numbers for S550. The big assembly on the table is actually the entire exhaust system for the 2.3 Ecoboost engine. That's why it only has the one side cat because that bolts up to the turbo outlet. After the resonator it splits into the dual outlet system.

The smaller unit is the V8 header with integrated cat.

Are you sure about that? I see another inlet/outlet coming out of the resonator. To me it just looks like they removed the header and cat and set it on the table. These shots I believe are from SVTPerformance.com. I could be wrong of course.

 

[Chameleon]

The Kooks super street headers are impressive w/ tune. I would still opt for full long tubes.

 

[FreddyG]

The main advantage of long tubes is the fact that it removes the cats. You will get the biggest gain by removing the cats, a small gain from going to a well designed short header over the factory header and another small gain from well designed long tubes over shorties. With proper design, the H/X pipe work in conjunction with the headers to change the shape and area under the power curve.

I'm not sure where these comments of the coyote being peaky are coming from. Its not a peaky motor.

..............and they add torque. Which is what helps a heavy car to get moving!

 

[jayman33]

I would personally opt for LT's, the stock headers from Ford are actually a decent design for a shorty header. You'll have more impact going to LT's.

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