Static_LV
Well-Known Member
This.
A stock GT PP is actually handles amazingly well. In stock trim, it is more capable than most drivers. It is an out of the box car that can play in M3/4 territory for half the price.
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A stock GT PP is actually handles amazingly well. In stock trim, it is more capable than most drivers. It is an out of the box car that can play in M3/4 territory for half the price.
Genxer
Well-Known Member
Another thing that can make people pucker is being heavy on the throttle and coming up on something simple like a small, but unexpected water puddle or gravel. It can get ugly real fast. Situational awareness and calculated moves are your friend.
2morrow
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I totally agree. It teaches me something every time I take it to the track.
I try to teach that to my children. Its an uphill battle...lol
TexasRebel
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Teach them to play chess.
2morrow
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^^^on the "to-do" list for sure.
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TexasRebel
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also 9-ball.
Definitely a forward looking game. It's never about the shot your taking, but where the cue ball will end up 4 shots later.
Definitely a forward looking game. It's never about the shot your taking, but where the cue ball will end up 4 shots later.
Dave
Active Member
Absolutely, there are variants of summer tires which do better in cold, or rain, etc. than others. Think of it like the 4 seasons in a square, and you pick a point somewhere... Is it closer to cold, or closer to summer, or closer to snow etc. No summer tire will work very well in freezing temperatures and snow, but you can also get All Seasons which are really just summer tires that stay soft enough to provide reasonable grip down into freezing temperatures (and may or may not get you killed in an inch of snow). You probably wouldn't want to do track days in 100 degree temperatures, but they'll grip in the summer, too.
The tires on my other car are Potenza S001's (summer tire) and I have no problem with them at anything above 35, as long as it's dry. Wet, down to 40 - 45 they do pretty well. The tire industry updates compounds regularly, providing better treadwear with more grip and more resistance to temperature extremes. I called the Pirelli's "crap" for the reason that they're simply old and outdated tire technology. They were a middle-of-the-pack tire when they were state of the art, IIRC.
Trackaholic
Well-Known Member
What catches me out is when the car starts to come around and I panic and suddenly lift the throttle.
Typically I can feel pretty well when the car starts to come around, I countersteer, and continue to feather the throttle and gradually bring the car in line. As the car gets in line the rear tires will hook, so the wheel needs to be relatively straight at that point or you will start to come around in the other direction.
However, on a couple of occasions the car has come around suddenly (this was in my 350Z at the track, or once in an empty pickup truck in the rain), causing me to not only countersteer, but also to panic and lift the throttle. What typically happens here is the car will get sideways, and since power has been removed the rear tires can hook while the car is still very sideways. At this point the front tires are still turned into the skid and the suspension is compressed, so when those rear tires hook the car will start to rotate in the opposite direction (which will allow the suspension to rapidly uncompress and help to propel the car in an even greater spin opposite to the initial one). Usually this second spin is much more violent and is the one that catches people out.
In most videos you will see a very small slide in one direction, which will cause the driver to countersteer and panic, lifting the throttle, overcorrecting, and spinning off in the other direction.
I've found that if I can remain calm and feather the throttle, it is much easier to catch the slides. Suddenly lifting will almost always result in an overcorrection and a spin.
Of course it helps to have lots of practice so that when something unexpected happens, you don't panic. AutoX is a great way to start, because the speeds are low and there is typically quite a bit of runoff. Drivers Schools are great as well, because they will usually do some amount of skid pad work. Unfortunately they will usually use a different car than your own, so the applicability to your own situation may vary. Some schools let you set up private lessons where you can bring your own car and focus on specific goals, so that is a great option.
I would say that track days are probably not a good option, because the speeds are quite high and there is often not much runoff. They are excellent for continuous improvement, and if you find a track with the right combination of speeds and room, then they can also be a great place to learn. They are also a great way to learn the theory of going fast and the importance of being smooth, but I would definitely exercise caution initially.
Getting comfortable with more slip on the rear is one area in which I would definitely like to improve. Headed to the GT350 Track Attack program in a couple of weeks, so we'll see how much confidence that will give.
-T
Typically I can feel pretty well when the car starts to come around, I countersteer, and continue to feather the throttle and gradually bring the car in line. As the car gets in line the rear tires will hook, so the wheel needs to be relatively straight at that point or you will start to come around in the other direction.
However, on a couple of occasions the car has come around suddenly (this was in my 350Z at the track, or once in an empty pickup truck in the rain), causing me to not only countersteer, but also to panic and lift the throttle. What typically happens here is the car will get sideways, and since power has been removed the rear tires can hook while the car is still very sideways. At this point the front tires are still turned into the skid and the suspension is compressed, so when those rear tires hook the car will start to rotate in the opposite direction (which will allow the suspension to rapidly uncompress and help to propel the car in an even greater spin opposite to the initial one). Usually this second spin is much more violent and is the one that catches people out.
In most videos you will see a very small slide in one direction, which will cause the driver to countersteer and panic, lifting the throttle, overcorrecting, and spinning off in the other direction.
I've found that if I can remain calm and feather the throttle, it is much easier to catch the slides. Suddenly lifting will almost always result in an overcorrection and a spin.
Of course it helps to have lots of practice so that when something unexpected happens, you don't panic. AutoX is a great way to start, because the speeds are low and there is typically quite a bit of runoff. Drivers Schools are great as well, because they will usually do some amount of skid pad work. Unfortunately they will usually use a different car than your own, so the applicability to your own situation may vary. Some schools let you set up private lessons where you can bring your own car and focus on specific goals, so that is a great option.
I would say that track days are probably not a good option, because the speeds are quite high and there is often not much runoff. They are excellent for continuous improvement, and if you find a track with the right combination of speeds and room, then they can also be a great place to learn. They are also a great way to learn the theory of going fast and the importance of being smooth, but I would definitely exercise caution initially.
Getting comfortable with more slip on the rear is one area in which I would definitely like to improve. Headed to the GT350 Track Attack program in a couple of weeks, so we'll see how much confidence that will give.
-T
Last edited:
TexasRebel
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Ignore the Brakes!! Clutch only!
The brakes on these cars are capable of producing more horsepower than the engine.
The brakes on these cars are capable of producing more horsepower than the engine.
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rangerjoe33
Member
Lol... yes, so so touchy. I know this is an old thread but a good read for me. I just sold my '07 GT, I knew that car extremely well. I knew how much throttle it would handle without losing the rear end, and I was not afraid to get very aggressive with it. I just got a '15 GTPP, I've had it for 3-4 weeks now. I am not nearly as comfortable yet with it. I leave TC on, it's my DD and I commute mostly hwy 75mi round trip. I have a few miles of fun roads. I've only stomped on it a few times, the tires broke loose maybe twice. I just cannot tell as quickly with my 15 as I could with the 07 when the rear end is starting to break loose. Im hoping it's just gonna take more time to get used to it. In the 07 I knew when to come off the throttle to control the rear end, I'm just not there yet with the 15 so I drive it more conservatively, especially cornering.
Norm Peterson
corner barstool sitter
You had to work quite a bit harder in your '07 to get it loose, so you're going to have to think "smoother" and "more gradual" with your new car's throttle. What passed for pro-active before (knowing when to get out of the throttle) is now reactive because the car's desire to go loose got ahead of you.
Autocross would be a good way to find out how much throttle you can use, but at least work on forgetting the stomp & steer sort of driving that usually accompanies a muscle car or drag-racing outlook.
Norm
Autocross would be a good way to find out how much throttle you can use, but at least work on forgetting the stomp & steer sort of driving that usually accompanies a muscle car or drag-racing outlook.
Norm
rangerjoe33
Member
Honestly I didn't, that's what spooks me a little about the 15, I'm expecting it to come out from under me but it holds its line, I can't tell if the tires are spinning or not. However this thread has engrained in me that I need to spend a lot of time getting to know the limits and getting comfortable driving as aggressive as I did in the 07. I could control/ recover from an accidental drift in the 07, especially in and coming out of left turns.
Norm Peterson
corner barstool sitter
That means it could be differences between the ways Torsen and Traction-lok differentials operate.
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The S550s have much better suspension. But you will notice that there's still a wiggle to the back end, although it happens for different mechanical reasons than the S197s with their live-axle suspension does, and much less.
At some point up-grading the suspension of your car is highly recommended, most definitely the IRS/cradle stuff.
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