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Stereo Information (Wiring, Upgrades, etc...)

trkpny

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Ford uses sound design (engine enhancement) for both the ecoboost and the Gt350. These are suplementary frequencies that are intended to blend with the audible exhast tone to create the desired sound signature. The tunes are obviously different for each.
you can disable this with a forescan change.

The base audio carries audio plus sound design through its amplified output to the speakers so forescan is the only option to eliminate the sound design.
the premium audios carry the sound design separe from the audio, so those sound design leads can be ignored whe nusing a replacement amp and taking the signal from the head unit. They are blended after the factory amp if a loc is used on the factory amp output.

the micorphone (in the case of the ecoboost) is used in a separate scenario for active noise cancellation. this is on top of sound design. this is needed as the 4 cyinder has frequencies that resonate the cabin at low rpm. when a sub is added, it amplifies both the sound design and anc signals, they are no longer calibrated properly (ecoboost).
anc signal is then larger than the noise it is trying to cancel and you then hear the result. ANC can also be eliminated in the ecoboost with forescan.

when either is amplified due to an aftermarket amp or sub, you are hearing those suplemental frequencies amplified above the noise floor (exhaust tone from engine) and it sounds fake because they are no longer blending as designed into the total signature.

There should not be a mic in the Gt350 for ANC as this does not have anc (to my knowledge). sound design should be feed forward and not require a mic for any feedback in the GT350.

Ramb
Thanks, Ramb. This is very helpful. It leads me to two questions:
1. Can anyone use Forscan? As long as they have the correct tool? Or does it need to be a Ford dealer?
2. Does the base system have an amplifier? Or does it just use the head unit?
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rambunctious

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there are many people on the board that have bought the forescan tool (various interfaces available to plug into OBDII) and software.
there is a large string on Forescan for Gt350 for example and many examples of features to change, disable, or enable.

base audio has an internal amplifier in the headunit for each channel output. so aftermarket amp use would require a processor or LOC to bring the level down for proper tuning and levels. some amps can however recieve high level input. There is a forescan code to change the base radio to look like a premium radio and have a line level (low level) flat output. this would be best for an audio upgrade. but if one did not want to be digging in this deep they could use a high level input capable amplifier.

Ramb
 

trkpny

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there are many people on the board that have bought the forescan tool (various interfaces available to plug into OBDII) and software.
there is a large string on Forescan for Gt350 for example and many examples of features to change, disable, or enable.

base audio has an internal amplifier in the headunit for each channel output. so aftermarket amp use would require a processor or LOC to bring the level down for proper tuning and levels. some amps can however recieve high level input. There is a forescan code to change the base radio to look like a premium radio and have a line level (low level) flat output. this would be best for an audio upgrade. but if one did not want to be digging in this deep they could use a high level input capable amplifier.

Ramb
Thank you, Ramb, I appreciate it. That gives me enough to decide how to go forward. :thumbsup:
 

rambunctious

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Thank you, Ramb, I appreciate it. That gives me enough to decide how to go forward. :thumbsup:
just dont forget, without a change to disable the sound design in the base amp of a GT350, this will be amplified.
 

trkpny

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just dont forget, without a change to disable the sound design in the base amp of a GT350, this will be amplified.
Okay. My next step is to use Forscan and change the codes to change/disable the sound design settings. That alone may solve my problems. If I understand you correctly, I can leave it set to the base system configuration or change it to the premium system settings and that would give me a clean set of pre-outs. I would just need to wire in an RCA jack in that case.
 

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rambunctious

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got it!

and there are harnesses out there like Parrot and Hexall (frequent poster on this site) that make the harnesses with RCA's
I was considering offering them but just got too busy with other things.........
 

CrashOverride

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Trkpny, I think you are going for a higher end setup than what I went with, but I think I can help you out a bit. Feel free to ignore though. You can turn the ACM into anything you want with Forscan. You can have it output speaker level or line level. You can also turn off the equalization that Ford put in. This is not to be confused with the sound cancellation garbage, but you can fix that as well.

So what I would do is code your ACM using forscan to a line level, no factory eq, no sound cancellation garbage. Then take the factory speaker outs and connect them to your amp, no LOC needed. No need to work against Ford's equalization because ForScan turned it off. If you don't want to cut your factory harness, you could buy some JST terminals, a crimper, and pull the terminals out of the factory ACM, insert your new line out wire with the JST terminals (Which you would run to your amp). Then, on the return trip (Speaker level from amp, back into dash) you could connect it back to the factory speaker cables you disconnected. What you would need to do this would be a male JST terminal, and two housings that can fit together. I'll be honest, after spending hours on Mouser and looking through JST catalogs, I couldn't find anything I could get to work, so I bought a Male/Female connector kit from Amazon, cut off the factory terminals, crimped my own, and now I have an OEM-like setup.

I used Shielded 9-wire 14-awg wire in both directions to/from amp. Got the cable on Ebay...It's for CNC motors. Very nice stuff. There is a drain wire for the shield, so if you put a ground on them (Only one side!) then it makes interference basically go away.

I ran an Alpine KT445U and put it where the factory amp is (For premium cars...I have a base system, so I had to buy a factory amp just to get the mount). The alpine is a very small amp both in chassis size, and it is "only" 45wx4 (True RMS, the CEA 2006 stuff). I don't think you would get even a "small" conventional amp to fit there though. Other than a little pop/static when the amp turns on/off, I'm really happy with my setup. Still running stock speakers but I think it's not too bad. My base factory speakers were 4 ohms, but it wouldn't matter because my KT445U is 2-ohm stable.

My overview of what I did: https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/sync-3-swap-its-all-in-here.82973/page-71#post-2384757

BTW, the JST terminals I was talking about are in there as well. The factory ACM uses the JST connectors, not the Tyco ones that are used for the Sync3 conversion.

Also, if you need a Amp turnon wire, remember that the factory ACM only puts out 6V...So if you need 12v like I did, you have a few options. There are some switched fuses in the passenger kick panel, but Spart gave me a great idea to tap off the cigarette lighter...It is on all the time by default, but you can use Forscan to turn it off as soon as you open the door.
 

trkpny

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Trkpny, I think you are going for a higher end setup than what I went with, but I think I can help you out a bit. Feel free to ignore though. You can turn the ACM into anything you want with Forscan. You can have it output speaker level or line level. You can also turn off the equalization that Ford put in. This is not to be confused with the sound cancellation garbage, but you can fix that as well.

So what I would do is code your ACM using forscan to a line level, no factory eq, no sound cancellation garbage. Then take the factory speaker outs and connect them to your amp, no LOC needed. No need to work against Ford's equalization because ForScan turned it off. If you don't want to cut your factory harness, you could buy some JST terminals, a crimper, and pull the terminals out of the factory ACM, insert your new line out wire with the JST terminals (Which you would run to your amp). Then, on the return trip (Speaker level from amp, back into dash) you could connect it back to the factory speaker cables you disconnected. What you would need to do this would be a male JST terminal, and two housings that can fit together. I'll be honest, after spending hours on Mouser and looking through JST catalogs, I couldn't find anything I could get to work, so I bought a Male/Female connector kit from Amazon, cut off the factory terminals, crimped my own, and now I have an OEM-like setup.

I used Shielded 9-wire 14-awg wire in both directions to/from amp. Got the cable on Ebay...It's for CNC motors. Very nice stuff. There is a drain wire for the shield, so if you put a ground on them (Only one side!) then it makes interference basically go away.

I ran an Alpine KT445U and put it where the factory amp is (For premium cars...I have a base system, so I had to buy a factory amp just to get the mount). The alpine is a very small amp both in chassis size, and it is "only" 45wx4 (True RMS, the CEA 2006 stuff). I don't think you would get even a "small" conventional amp to fit there though. Other than a little pop/static when the amp turns on/off, I'm really happy with my setup. Still running stock speakers but I think it's not too bad. My base factory speakers were 4 ohms, but it wouldn't matter because my KT445U is 2-ohm stable.

My overview of what I did: https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/sync-3-swap-its-all-in-here.82973/page-71#post-2384757

BTW, the JST terminals I was talking about are in there as well. The factory ACM uses the JST connectors, not the Tyco ones that are used for the Sync3 conversion.

Also, if you need a Amp turnon wire, remember that the factory ACM only puts out 6V...So if you need 12v like I did, you have a few options. There are some switched fuses in the passenger kick panel, but Spart gave me a great idea to tap off the cigarette lighter...It is on all the time by default, but you can use Forscan to turn it off as soon as you open the door.
CrashOverride, thanks, awesome reply.

I'm still working through some of the issues, but all of your suggestions are helpful. I am going to use Forscan to shut off all the extra junk. Since I already have the wiring in place, iI am going to leave in the loc for now. If it works, great, if not, I will go with the JST terminals so that I can use the factory speaker wires.

I wish I had known about the 9-wire you mentioned. i am using Streetwires 9-wire, but it is only 18 awg and it's not shielded.

I built an amp rack and I'm running a Pioneer GM-D9605 out of the spare tire well. It's rated at 75x4 RMS (which is fine with the JL Audio C2s I am running front and rear). It has 350 watts rms for the two JL Audio 10s I have in a Zenclosure box.

I struggled with the need for an amp turn on. I tried using a piggy back fuse tap with a switched circuit in the fuse panel, but with that configuration my amps were always on when the car was running and I got the amplified throttle noise all the time. Since the Fix82 has a signal sensing turn on and a remote out, I am using that, daisy-chained, to turn on the dsp and the amp.

I'll be finishing up the amp wiring and flashing the acm tomorrow morning. I'm hoping that everything works because I am ready to be done.
 

ts03691

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This may have already been posted and if so I apologize. I am starting on a stereo upgrade in small steps since in the two months I have had my Mustang I have bought everything in the upgrade catalog on suspension upgrades. But I wanted a little more base so I simply upgraded the stock sub using the Pioneer TS-AQ2002D2 and some polyfill. The one thing that was a pleasant surprise with the Pioneer was the mounting holes aligned with the stock sub enclosure which allows you to use the stock sub cover. After the install it looks stock. Sub is better and hits a little harder than stock. Will probably add an amp to drive it that I can then use later if I want to add a different sub like the JL Audio.

Thanks to everyone on this forum. Great information to learn about the Mustang and gave me a lot of information and options.
 

ChiTownStang26

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I have water damage on one of my door speakers and just going to replace it with cheap 80w alpines. I have a base model but I don't know the difference between coaxial vs component speakers. Can someone help me with which one fits? Thanks
 

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trkpny

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I have water damage on one of my door speakers and just going to replace it with cheap 80w alpines. I have a base model but I don't know the difference between coaxial vs component speakers. Can someone help me with which one fits? Thanks
I have the base stereo in my stang. It is a component system with the midrange 6.5" speakers in the doors and 1" tweeters in the A columns. So I would replace your door speaker with a component speaker. Then, you could choose to use the tweeter that comes with it and replace yours, or just leave it as-is.

Component speakers split the audio signal into highs (Tweeters) and midrange-bass (Woofers). Co-axial speakers include both elements in one speaker, If you were to use a co-axial speaker to replace your door speaker, you would essentially have two tweeters. That would mess up your imaging and probably wouldn't sound very good.
 

CrashOverride

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I would add to what Trkpny said (Which is completely correct) that the "woofer" and tweeter are a balanced set. Literally every model of woofer and tweeter have different outputs. The device that "decides" where the signal goes to is called a crossover.

Suppose for a minute that the woofer sounds decent up to about 5,000 hz. And the tweeter sounds good from 5,000 hz up to 20,000hz (The upper limit of most humans). I'm oversimplifying by a lot here, but basically the crossover will send anything less than 5000 to the woofer and anything over to the tweeter. Now, because the crossover is an electronic device, and because the speakers are as well, it gets more complicated. The inductance of the devices matter as well. A lot of factory systems have 2-ohm impedance drivers, whereas most aftermarket speakers have 4-ohm impedance.

So, putting all of this together, even if you replace just the woofer with another woofer (not coaxial), it will still probably sound bad. If your car has 2 ohm speakers, and you replace with a 4-ohm, then (Assuming the efficiencies are the same) the woofer will be quieter than the other speakers. Also if the woofer only sounds good to 3000hz, then it will sound lousy from 3000 to 5000hz because the crossover is hard-wired.

Components (And even the drivers in coaxials) have to be matched even based on sound (Some call it "voicing" others call it "timbre") and involve subtle variations that can't effectively be described in a spec.

I'll cut to the point of my long-winded post: If you are not going to replace all of the speakers (All meaning all front (woofers/tweeters) and the back speakers) then it won't sound right. Ford spent a lot of time and labor dollars figuring out the proper levels for the speakers. Are the speakers lousy? Well yes and no, they have neodymium magnets, which is nice, they are pretty efficient, which is nice, but the other materials are lousy.

At the end of the day, to make it sound best with the least amount of work, just buy a replacement OEM speaker. If you have a base car, there are tons of people who have swapped it out and you can get them pretty cheap.
 

Captdistraction

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Is there information anywhere on what stereo specifications there are for Tech Pack / nav equipped GT350s?

I know it has the 6.5 midbass drivers, the pillar tweeters, and likely the whizzer cone'd 6.5's in the back, but not sure the impedance, if the fronts are wired together or separately (and where the crossover is). Also I've not been able to confirm if there's the 3.5 in the dash (I certainly can't hear it as I did with another 12 speaker premium car).

I was also hoping to find out if the APIM can be programmed flat. I'm hearing a very strange dip in frequencies in the tweeter range (maybe due to missing the mid range) that should be playable by even the installed oem speakers.
 

myMUSICveins

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My 18 GT350 is 9 speakers. 2 in each door and 1 at the pillar, 1 in the dash, and two in the back deck which likely act as mid bass. Strange there is no cutout on the speaker deck in the back to “let sound through” to the cabin.

I actually found a harshness to the 2-3k range that my ears are very sensitive to. When using Spotify I was able to pull that back some using the EQ in the Spotify app although not perfect it sounds a lot better. I also added a JL steathbox to help with the lows and pull full range signal from the front door speakers preamp. I also pulled a tad of bass at 60hz just to try and balance the low end since it seems to be peaky at that frequency.

Overall sounds pretty decent now.
 

Silver550

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Hello,

I was going to install a speakers and sub a while ago but things kept coming up. I am now ready to do the install, I just have a couple of questions.
1. would it be ok to not run a dsp after deleting the stock dsp via ForScan?
2. what speakers should i run the sub signal from, (front/ rear)? would I get phone call voices from the subs if I were to get the signal from rear speakers pre amp?
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