Speculation on how many years the GT500 (S550) will be produced?

[loubif]

It is a estimate/assumption.

On another note,

Think about 2021. The GT350 will be gone, Right now the premium GT start at under $40,000. The GT500 is going to start at $75,000 to $80,000.

What Mustang will fill that gap of $35 to $40K difference in price??

I hope there is a dedicated drag...ish version ie a street version of the Cobra Jet, base Mustang GT with a FI 5.0 A10 with street/strip suspension...and yes I know you can replicate this with a base 5.0 but a factory offering with everything ready to take it to the dragstrip would be cool, IMHO...

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[obspsd]

I hope there is a dedicated drag...ish version ie a street version of the Cobra Jet, base Mustang GT with a FI 5.0 A10 with street/strip suspension...and yes I know you can replicate this with a base 5.0 but a factory offering with everything ready to take it to the dragstrip would be cool, IMHO...

Sounds good to me! Mustang GT 1320

 

[Epiphany]

Huh, I would have thought all the vibration dampers on the GT350 took additional time - were probably added due to failures during development and that Ford would have background knowledge about supercharged V8s from their work on previous GT500 engines. I also would have thought that the existing 5.2 would have helped reduce costs, though changes may have been needed. Also, the plasma bores are more vetted out now.

Everyone is doing supercharged V8s. They are common as dirt. You can buy a new Mustang GT with one no problem. But you say that this particular one is more difficult.

Or are you saying every development is difficult and the engineering development time is a small part of the costs?

Every engine has unique "vibrational" characteristics. They are identified and addressed. Note that the FPC 5.2L engine isn't the only one to receive exhaust dampers or weights added to the transmission crossmember. The regular 5.0 engine uses these as well as much as they are tuned for a different frequency.

The 5.2L block has been updated since the first GT350 was introduced and it will be re-engineered again for the GT500. The spray bore coating technology was already in use on aluminum GT500 blocks prior to the GT350. The plasma process was initially being done to the German produced GT500 blocks but Ford is now doing it at Windsor (Essex) with the production of the 5.0 and 5.2L engines.

The fact that "everyone is doing supercharged V8s" means zilch when it comes to development. Any new Mustang GT that you can buy with one isn't an OEM, factory Ford developed vehicle so you can disregard using it as a relevant example.

But you say that this particular one is more difficult.

I never said what you just "quoted" me as saying. What I said was...

The power level this FI engine achieves in an OEM, CARB/EPA emissions compliant vehicle, with warranty, assures this will require even more resources than previous. And costs in general have not decreased in any of the relevant domains.

Let me put it this way. Rest assured, costs have not gone down with respect to producing a GT500 today with that of the GT350 in 2015. The GT500 is being reported behind the scenes as being over budget. The individuals in charge of the program now are not the same as when it was initiated. You may think that there will be a large carryover but for the most part that won't be the case. The driveline is new. The suspension hardware has all been gone through for use on the GT500. The brake system has been increased in size and capacity. The exhaust system will be different from one end to the other. The wheels and tires will be something we haven't seen before. The hood and fenders will be SMC and highly engineered (but may just be heavier than their aluminum counterparts). The seats and interior won't be what you saw on the GT350. And regarding the engine, the entire assembly was engineered to meet a much higher power threshold while maintaining the same Factor of Safety. In other words - beefed up.

 

[Twin Turbo]

Maybe a new performance model. Standard GT bodywork, premium model, with upgraded suspension, wheels/tires - like a PP1/PP2 car plus __proper__ cooling. Then use the 5.2 CPC motor, GT350 intake (like the Bullet), with FI/DI, that's probably right around 500-510HP. If the GT500 does have a DCT, leave that exclusive to that model and offer the A10 and/or a reworked manual 6-speed. I guess I'm suggesting sort of re-creating the GT350 but without the 5.2 FPC and additional unique body panels. Price it around $52-53K ... Mach I
.

I've been wanting pretty much exactly this for the last 2 or 3 years!! Given the strong rumours suggest S650 will be a '23MY and given the Bullitt is (so Ford have said) a '19/'20MY car, that leaves an SE gap for '21/'22MY. However, given the state Ford seems to be in at the moment and the fact they were going to call the electric SUV Mach 1 (although that now appears to be more likely Mach E) I'm not going to hold my breath :(

 

[PP0001]

2 or 3 years. Probably 2 years.

They may end up being pretty rare cars.

If history repeats itself and if Flat Rock produces almost 20,000 GT500's during the first two production years as they did during the inaugural 2007 and 2008 model years these will not be rare cars by any means.

I don't disagree that production years are important but possibly more important will be the number of cars that FR will produce over whatever time period these cars end up being built.

With respect to the 2019 R model I would suggest that the MSRP price for a basic R model will be just short of $70,000 and not the $67,135 that you are suggesting. A loaded up R model will be ~$73,500.

Regarding 2020 being the last year for the GT350 as we know it you could be spot on but personally I would be surprised to see the GT350 go beyond the 2019MY and with production not even started for the 2019 GT350 I would also suggest that 2019 production numbers for the GT350/R's may be the lowest of the last 4 MY's.

 

[machsmith]

I'll guess 3 years and 6 or 7,000/year. so around 20,000 GT500s by the time the S650 rolls around.

 

[obspsd]

If history repeats itself and if Flat Rock produces almost 20,000 GT500's during the first two production years as they did during the inaugural 2007 and 2008 model years these will not be rare cars by any means.

I don't disagree that production years are important but possibly more important will be the number of cars that FR will produce over whatever time period these cars end up being built.

With respect to the 2019 R model I would suggest that the MSRP price for a basic R model will be just short of $70,000 and not the $67,135 that you are suggesting. A loaded up R model will be ~$73,500.

Regarding 2020 being the last year for the GT350 as we know it you could be spot on but personally I would be surprised to see the GT350 go beyond the 2019MY and with production not even started for the 2019 GT350 I would also suggest that 2019 production numbers for the GT350/R's may be the lowest of the last 4 MY's.

About the $67,135 price, I was talking about the current 2019 GT350R MSRP. Not the GT500. I think the 2020 GT500R will start around $75,000.

You may be right that the GT350 will end after 2019. Ford did say that the GT350 & GT500 will be available at the same time. I don't know if that means only in the end of 2019 or 2020 also.

 

[PP0001]

About the $67,135 price, I was talking about the current 2019 GT350R MSRP. Not the GT500. I think the 2020 GT500R will start around $75,000.

You may be right that the GT350 will end after 2019. Ford did say that the GT350 & GT500 will be available at the same time. I don't know if that means only in the end of 2019 or 2020 also.

The price of $67,135 for a 2019 R model does not include the gas guzzler tax or the destination and handling charges therefore the MSRP price will be almost $70,000 for a basic R model when all is said and done.

As far as a 2020 GT500R I did not know that one of those models even existed so obviously I must have missed some information along the way for a new GT500 R model.

 

[Darkane]

The price of $67,135 for a 2019 R model does not include the gas guzzler tax or the destination and handling charges therefore the MSRP price will be almost $70,000 for a basic R model when all is said and done.

As far as a 2020 GT500R I did not know that one of those models even existed so obviously I must have missed some information along the way for a new GT500 R model.

Yeah pricing will be higher for MY19. Heck, isn’t the interior CF option almost $1,000?

 

[cosmic charlie]

The thing is the new owners can really only turn and sell for a profit if there’s ADMs or buyers would buy new. I place the word “greedy” mostly on the dealers they sell cars that have built in profit for Ford and the dealer but selling at MSRP or I think in early demand 5k adm is reasonable, but 15-20k! Come on! I don’t see why a dealer deserve anything more, they don’t engineer, they don’t design, they sell. If I was going to pay 10k over id want it to go to Ford who built an awesome car not the dealership and it’s owner. I don’t know if in the Mustang world there’s high sales guys that only sell at MSRP or not, but I know a couple corvette sales guys literally only sell at MSRP and they have long list of people who’d rather wait and buy at MSRP from them.

The whole car world has gone to hell in a bucket. I hope they don't do the same thing with the GT500 that they did with the Focus RS!

Hype the hell out of it. Tell everyone there will only be a 2 year run in limited numbers. They had buyers lined up at Ford dealers the day they started taking orders and it was ridiculous. None of the dealers knew how many they were going to get. Had no idea what the price would be but they knew for sure there would be an ADM.

Most didn't even know what an RS was. I remember the first dealer I talked to about it. (after the ordering opened). Yes it's a Focus RS. It's made in Germany. It has all wheel drive, torque vectoring, 2.3 liter turbo, 350hp and it goes 165mph! I would like to order one now! People waited over a year for their cars to show up. The people that ordered first didn't gain anything from it. People were ordering cars 6 months in and getting them before the people that ordered on the first day.

Well the limited run turned out to be limited only by how many cars they could make. After the limited 2 year run they came out with a "limited edition run of 1000 in race red or nitrous blue with a black roof". Then after that they came out with the Heritage Edition which was the last 50 RS's produced in Orange for the UK market.

Meanwhile the whole head gasket fiasco had to be straightened out. Every owner ended up having to bring their car into the dealer to have their head gasket and head checked. (after numerous engines were failing). Mind you this is the car with the engine hand built in Spain and each one was listened to with a stethoscope before being sent to Germany to go into the car. Come to find out somehow they managed to use the Mustang head gaskets (instead of the correct ones) and that 's what was causing all the engine failures. So the fix was to bring it to the local dealer and let him rip apart your hand built engine to check the gasket and head. People ended up waiting months for parts to get to the dealer. This was an all around monumental screw up in every respect of the word.

Maybe before anyone goes slapping ADM's on cars they ought to make sure they run properly first!

 

[Wolvee]

They'll say it's limited, they'll say it's the last year, the Dealer markup will be stupid, It will only be cost limiting, they'll keep on making it and people will still pay for it.

..Yeah, I'm bitter. Ford has found new ways to make me pissed at them every year for the last decade. Hell, they are almost as bad as GM and they ruined my home town.

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