Replacing stock brake pads

[danhuberty]

G-LOC R12 up front R10 rear and then you can swap the GS-1 Compound on for the street, low noise and low dust. We include the Extended bolts with our pads so swapping them is pretty easy. Available HERE

Why not an R18 compound up front? The R18 has the highest thermal rating of 2,100 degrees. Under repeated braking these pads get extremely hot in the GT350.

What's clear from the testing I've done at the track is that you don't want a pad that has a aggressive initial bite because it actually locks up the front wheel momentarily before the ABS can get it's brains sorted out as to why the wheel stopped or you modulate the brake pedal to release the wheel from lockup so the ABS can wake up. From testing at Road America and Brained International on the long course it is clear is the GT350 does not like pads with an aggressive initial bite when they get really hot because of the increased friction it causes lockup on initial braking. My experience says the GT350 needs a strong initial bite for the first 30% of the braking cycle than tails off slightly. There is a lot of car to stop here at 145 MPH going down hill in the brake zone in T5 at Road America.

To help the rotors out at the track I strongly suggest getting them cryo'ed. The rotors being cyro'ed helps dissipate heat better and provides longevity of the rotors. You can get cyro'ed rotors for the GT350 at Frozen Rotors www.frozenrotors.com. Yes, they certainly cost more money, but racing has taught me that they are worth every penny at the track and more...

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[danhuberty]

I'm going to disagree here, its impossible to make the stock pads fade on stock tires. Going with grippier tires increases cornering speed reducing the load on the brakes overall so... you are good to go.

Only reason to go for a race pad is if you need something hard enough to last an entire endurance race. But then you wouldn't be in a full weight GT350 anyway.

Should've clarified that I'm not running stock tires. I am running tires with treadware of a a 100 or less.Thanks for catching that. Agree with you on running stock tires that the stock pads should work fine over a 30 minute session on the track as long as they don't overheat from repetitive braking.

I can say this from years of experience, I would never go to any high speed course that requires heavy braking such as Road America, Road Atlanta, VIR, and a few others and run stock pads with stock tires on the GT350. I'll put it this way, would you rather spend $200.00 on better brake pads or thousands of dollars fixing your car because you had brake fade trying to stop a 3800 car at 130 MPH plus at end of a track session due to brake fade. Stock brake pads have a low heat rating. Do yourself a safety favor and buy a race pads with low initial bite with a higher heat rating an save yourself a potential wrecker ride and embarrassment at the end of track session due to brake fade. ;)

 

[Tomster]

Should've clarified that I'm not running stock tires. I am running tires with treadware of a a 100 or less.Thanks for catching that. Agree with you on running stock tires that the stock pads should work fine over a 30 minute session on the track as long as they don't overheat from repetitive braking.

I can say this from years of experience, I would never go to any high speed course that requires heavy braking such as Road America, Road Atlanta, VIR, and a few others and run stock pads with stock tires on the GT350. I'll put it this way, would you rather spend $200.00 on better brake pads or thousands of dollars fixing your car because you had brake fade trying to stop a 3800 car at 130 MPH plus at end of a track session due to brake fade. Stock brake pads have a low heat rating. Do yourself a safety favor and buy a race pads with low initial bite with a higher heat rating an save yourself a potential wrecker ride and embarrassment at the end of track session due to brake fade. ;)

There is a lot of truth to what you say. However most people in this car are running 30 minute sessions during HPDE events, and specific to the originator of the thread, only sees occasional track use. I ran 3 days at Daytona, 4 - 30 min sessions a day, running 160 to 170 on the front stretch, and 150-160 on the back stretch with aggressive braking entering the each respective turn and I never experienced brake fade on stock OEM pads. I was using R compound tires with a tread wear of 80, stock rotors, stock pads, and R sized wheels. Never had one issue.

The only complaint I had at the end of 3 days was that I needed new pads. Heck, it isn't even a complaint, it's more of a compliment. I never figured those oem pads would make it through the whole event under those conditions.

Have you used your oem pads that came with the car for your track days or did you immediately swap them out for race pads based upon previous experience? Just curious. The advice I would offer the OP is a good track prep to include SRF fluid. I think Ford did a damn good job designing the 350 to be a "right out of the box" track car (brake pads included).

YMMV, however based upon how well the oem pads did for me, I opted to replace them with the same exact pad after the event.

:cheers:

 

[danhuberty]

Have you used your oem pads that came with the car for your track days or did you immediately swap them out for race pads based upon previous experience? Just curious. The advice I would offer the OP is a good track prep to include SRF fluid. I think Ford did a damn good job designing the 350 to be a "right out of the box" track car (brake pads included).

Swapped them out immediately because race pads will last 2-3 times longer than a stock pad in like conditions. That means a race pad is less expensive over time and provides an increased level of safety against brake fade and ending a track weekend early. For a $300.00 difference I will always chuck out the stock pads. It always amazes me that people pay $65K or more for a car and than cheap out on the essentials that can increase their safety and increase their driving performance when at the track. :frusty:

And two for putting in high temp brake fluid. This is a must if you are tracking the car.

Having raced at Daytona you will never stress the brake pads there because they have plenty of time to cool due to the long straights before entering the inside course and the bus stop.

 

[Tomster]

I will always chuck out the stock pads.

Can I have them?

 

[Iceman19BC]

Have you all also installed the cool tech brake cooler brackets as well?

 

[Dig-It]

Have you all also installed the cool tech brake cooler brackets as well?

Has anyone done any testing to prove that these actually make a difference (in other than one's wallet)?

 

[Iceman19BC]

Has anyone done any testing to prove that these actually make a difference (in other than one's wallet)?

Well, they are only 60 bucks, so its not exactly a deep wallet dip. I ordered them myself. I'll know this spring I guess.

 

[Optimum Performance]

Why not an R18 compound up front? The R18 has the highest thermal rating of 2,100 degrees. Under repeated braking these pads get extremely hot in the GT350.

What's clear from the testing I've done at the track is that you don't want a pad that has a aggressive initial bite because it actually locks up the front wheel momentarily before the ABS can get it's brains sorted out as to why the wheel stopped or you modulate the brake pedal to release the wheel from lockup so the ABS can wake up. From testing at Road America and Brained International on the long course it is clear is the GT350 does not like pads with an aggressive initial bite when they get really hot because of the increased friction it causes lockup on initial braking. My experience says the GT350 needs a strong initial bite for the first 30% of the braking cycle than tails off slightly. There is a lot of car to stop here at 145 MPH going down hill in the brake zone in T5 at Road America.

To help the rotors out at the track I strongly suggest getting them cryo'ed. The rotors being cyro'ed helps dissipate heat better and provides longevity of the rotors. You can get cyro'ed rotors for the GT350 at Frozen Rotors www.frozenrotors.com. Yes, they certainly cost more money, but racing has taught me that they are worth every penny at the track and more...

R18's are good for R-Compounds/Slicks R12's for People doing actual Track Days, driving to the track and home. We are not racing, it is a track day.

I do not fully understand your comments about bite and lock up. Threshold braking with strong initial bite allows you to get all your braking done early allowing you to modulate them to rotate the car and keep the chassis loaded.

 

[Norm Peterson]

What's clear from the testing I've done at the track is that you don't want a pad that has a aggressive initial bite because it actually locks up the front wheel momentarily before the ABS can get it's brains sorted out as to why the wheel stopped or you modulate the brake pedal to release the wheel from lockup so the ABS can wake up.

That's maybe something that should be expected on a cool-ish track day, where the pads get up to "better initial bite temperature" sooner than the tires get up toward their better temperatures.

Been there (R12's, MPSS, 38° - 40°F ambient and pavement temperatures, about halfway around an intentionally easy out lap), and I assume that similar conditions could exist in MN.

I'd certainly expect more serious tires to behave similarly at somewhat warmer temperatures on the first couple of laps, and that it's possible to mismatch pad compounds and tires badly enough to encounter it.


Norm

 

[danhuberty]

R18's are good for R-Compounds/Slicks R12's for People doing actual Track Days, driving to the track and home. We are not racing, it is a track day.

I do not fully understand your comments about bite and lock up. Threshold braking with strong initial bite allows you to get all your braking done early allowing you to modulate them to rotate the car and keep the chassis loaded.

I'm running R-Compounds/Slicks and trailer my GT350 to the track. Therefore you answered my question that R18's are the right compound from G-Loc than. Given my racing background and when at a track day I am simply trying to extract the most performance out of my car thereby making the day enjoyable for me. If I where to be driving my car to and from the track than I would use a less aggressive pad as you indicated.

Agree that a strong initial bite (which I strongly prefer) to get all your braking done early so you can modulate the brakes to keep the front suspension loaded through initial turn in (threshold braking) heading to the apex is the absolute ideal braking scenario. But my experience with the GT350 using Raybestos pads, which I didn't like, is a strong initial bite under heavy braking causes the front wheel to lock up momentarily until you either modulate off the brake or the ABS wakes up, thereby causing you to extend your brake zone while under heavy braking, which causes a loss of laptime. I am looking for a pad that can take the heat with a strong initial bite for the GT350. When racing we use Performance Friction (PF) pads in 01 compound. Problem is that PF doesn't yet make a pad for the GT350. It sound's like the R18 is that equal pad to the PF 01 pad.

 

[Optimum Performance]

R18 is more 3,5,7 PFC. 01PFC is more like R16, but strongly urge you to use the R18.

 

[danhuberty]

R18 is more 3,5,7 PFC. 01PFC is more like R16, but strongly urge you to use the R18.

Awesome! I'll order some up than and give them a try. Would you do R18's front and rear, or would you do R18 up front and R16 in the rear to change up the brake bias some? Appreciate the input.

 

[Optimum Performance]

Awesome! I'll order some up than and give them a try. Would you do R18's front and rear, or would you do R18 up front and R16 in the rear to change up the brake bias some? Appreciate the input.

R12s out back. I have them on the shelf.

 

[nastang87xx]

I can say this from years of experience, I would never go to any high speed course that requires heavy braking such as Road America, Road Atlanta, VIR, and a few others and run stock pads with stock tires on the GT350.

I was fine on RA. I was braking at the 200 zone consistently on 200 tread wear tires. I had a pro driver go out in my car too and he said they started to fade a touch but nothing earth shattering and this only after 20 minutes of abuse.

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