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Tuned EB Brief Misfires

dgc333

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Alright - I see that.

So - is there a baffled plate on the engine from the factory? It never occurred to me to examine it that closely! And if the answer is "Yes"...how is the aftermarket baffled plate better? (Or is it mostly a gimmick IYO)?

Thanks, Dave.
Yes there is, it's on the side of the block where the PCV valve is loctated.

Every manufactured product is designed with compromises. Typically factory parts the compromise leans more towards cost where as the aftermarket can make their compromise leans more toward performance. Also with the aftermarket there is a portion of marketing hype mixed in.
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5.0yote

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Your head gasket could be bad. If you are getting misfires, rough idling/driving for the first few minutes after startup, it could be a result of coolant leaking into one or more of your cylinders. The engine runs rough on startup because of the coolant in the cylinders then after the coolant has been burnt/expelled, it will run fine.

Go to a shop and have them do a head gasket check which takes only a few minutes.
This generally results in an abnormal amount of white smoke\steam out your tail pipes and it should be especially large in volume if you are getting enough in your cylinders to produce misfires, and would produce hard startups on sitting overnight.
 
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ronemca

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Well - I am learning alot! And I am grateful. And that sounds like a closing statement - but it's not meant to be. AFAIC my issue has disappeared (thank goodness) and my CV is on the way. And I will be happier when that has been installed, because...

Although I now believe my CC is working as intended -- and NOT causing any problems -- it sounds like the additional back-flow prevention delivered by a strong/dependable CV is cheap insurance.

And to be sure - this conversation remains useful to me, and also perhaps to the dozens & dozens & dozens of my eager followers...who are undoubtedly keen to read my next instalment! :D

(Okay - maybe one person. A really bored person. Who lives alone. In a shack. Far away from civilization. Accessible only by water. Swamp water.)
 

DUNDEM

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Well - I am learning alot! And I am grateful. And that sounds like a closing statement - but it's not meant to be. AFAIC my issue has disappeared (thank goodness) and my CV is on the way. And I will be happier when that has been installed, because...

Although I now believe my CC is working as intended -- and NOT causing any problems -- it sounds like the additional back-flow prevention delivered by a strong/dependable CV is cheap insurance.

And to be sure - this conversation remains useful to me, and also perhaps to the dozens & dozens & dozens of my eager followers...who are undoubtedly keen to read my next instalment! :D

(Okay - maybe one person. A really bored person. Who lives alone. In a shack. Far away from civilization. Accessible only by water. Swamp water.)
What’s your handle? I’d follow you if you blog/vlog the car.
 
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ronemca

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Update...

There may be more to this than meets the eye. Concurrent with the rough-idle-and-stumbling-when-cold-started issue (but not mentioned in this thread so far) there's a second issue:

After a couple of hours of steady driving (or a couple of weeks of short trips) the car will suddenly lose power and start a bizarre roaring sound. It sounds exactly like engine braking on a decelerating tractor trailer. I originally assumed it was a bad Accel coil causing one of the cylinders to quit firing, but it happened again yesterday after 2 hours driving. Horrible - lost power - super-rough running - stalling - hard to start - can't get past walking speed.

On an impulse, I poked my finger into the fuel filler flapper - and it burped like a beer can - after which the car started & ran like a top for several miles!

WTF?! :shrug:

A good friend wondered about the vapor purge valve - and I ordered one (not yet installed) - but I'm trying to avoid random parts replacements on my dime. (Still under warranty, but modded - therefore prefer to steer clear of stealership)

Pending the offering of advice here, my next move is to remove the CC...since it is the only thing that's changed in a long time (and coincides almost exactly with the onset of my two issues)
 

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You changed your down pipe and exhaust .. you will need to look into the gutting your PCV ... research the threads .. this has been discussed thoroughly ..

Lisandra hinted upon it with the suggestion of installing an aftermarket baffle plate ..
 
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ronemca

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I see. But...

Assuming that the PCV is not fully sealing against back-flow of boost pressure into the crankcase...would that result in the issue I am experiencing? I don't doubt for a minute that this is indeed occurring (and I don't yet have the check valve) but I would like to understand the mechanics.

Further...

Even if I re-install the factory PCV hose, the back-flow resistance of the PCV will still be suspect. So it seems like the optimal set-up will be the CC with a check valve.
 

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A vacuum leak can do all sorts of things, including what you describe. Problem is theres other things too. You have to eliminate possibilities
 
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ronemca

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Alrighty then! Since I don't yet have the CV...I will re-install the factory hose. That should fix the vac issue (since the car ran perfectly for months & months leading up to CC installation). Then - when the CV arrives - I'll re-connect the CC with the CV inline and go from there.
 
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ronemca

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Update:

Two weekends ago, my strange issue re-surfaced after about 2 hours of highway driving. (This is with factory coils, factory plugs, and CC installed minus check valve) I was only 5 minutes from my destination, so I limped & coughed my way there in first gear. I tried my previous trick of disconnecting & re-connecting all four coils, but it made no difference this time. So - on impulse - I poked my thumb into the fuel filler flapper. It made a beer can 'pfft' noise...after which the car ran perfectly for the next two days AND all the way back home on the highway.

As soon as I got home I removed the CC and re-installed the factory PCV hose. And the car continued to run fine for the next two weeks of driving here & there...until this morning.

For the first time, my issue reoccurred after only 10 minutes of non-highway driving. I pulled over right away (and the car stalled) I jumped out to poke the fuel door flapper...believing with certainty that my problem would disappear. It didn't go 'pffft', but I started up and pulled away confidently.

It was still not running right.

So over I go again. I shut down and grab my reader. P2196 as usual. I clear the code. Car still won't run properly. So I throw open the hood and disconnect/re-connect the low pressure sensor at the top rear of the engine. Start the car. Runs great. Strong, fast & willing.

I resume my journey to my buddy's place, where I visit for 20 minutes. I leave his place. 2 minutes away my issue comes back. I'm angry, so I just push it - feathering the accelerator and gradually gaining speed (not on the highway). After a minute or so like that it suddenly "heals itself" and pulls away strongly like nothing's wrong. And it carries on like that for almost an hour until I'm home.

:headbonk::shrug::shrug::headbonk:

So - as of two weekends ago - the car has been restored to the way it was for months & months & months of trouble-free driving. Yes - my mods are still installed, and I'm still running on a tune file - but everything's been the same through all last winter, and in fact for a good chunk of 2017.

I'm not stating with ironclad certainty that it's NOT my modding - but it certainly seems like something that the car was born with that has failed.

FWIW, I have noticed a very slight increase in popping (crackling?) on deceleration now & then. It has always been VERY VERY slight, and recently it has become maybe 5% more often than before. But it's subtle as hell. I suppose that could point toward a richened mixture, but I hesitate to guess at this point.

Each time this happens, I wonder if it is not simply the restarting of the car that is actually solving the issue. It should make no difference to the functioning of a coil to disconnect & reconnect it. Yeah okay - there's a 0.005% possibility that the connection was incomplete. I guess it's "possible". But the last two times I was sure it was the disconnect/re-connect of the coils that fixed it. But then it didn't. Then I was sure it was a vapor lock or some sort of vacuum issue in the fuel tank. Until it wasn't. Today it seems like it was the low pressure sensor connection. But next time that trick won't work either. So - what's left that I am inadvertently doing at the roadside that is fixing the problem?

* I'm connecting a code reader, and I'm clearing any code(s) that are present.
* I'm powering up the accessory power.
* I'm opening & closing my door.
* I'm opening & closing my hood and trunk.
* I'm cursing a fair bit

I cannot for the life of me believe that any of these actions could have any effect on the operation of the vehicle. And the only thing that's left that consistently occurs every single time the issue disappears is this one:

* I'm sitting (engine off) for some number of minutes.

Could it be that simple? Could it really be that -- while I'm fiddling around disconnecting & reconnecting something or other -- there is a completely hidden & silent process under way that is ACTUALLY the solution?? Maybe the next time I'll just pull over, shut down and sit there for 10 minutes instead of running around. It's frustrating just to contemplate it, but there's no other way to tell except to try it.

(But I'm still going to curse up a storm, just in case)
 
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Brian V

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Run some fuel injector cleaner like redline or comparable .
 
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ronemca

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It’s interesting you mention that - another member posted about a similar problem and he felt that a can of injector cleaner helped him. So I put one in just before setting out for my buddy’s place today. It hadn’t had a chance to do anything, but perhaps over the next couple of days I may notice an improvement.
 
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ronemca

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I added bottle #1 to a half tank on Sunday last, and - having had no further episodes - I added bottle #2 and filled the tank yesterday...half-way through a 150 mile drive on the highway.

I've been blasting around a fair bit - trying to keep the RPM's elevated somewhat, and experienced no further episodes until this evening on my way home from work. As always, it happened when I pulled out to pass a slower car, and it gave a mighty cough...but it only lasted for a few seconds (instead of several minutes like usual)

I am somewhat skeptical that I could have a dirty injector after only 22K km's...but I would NOT be surprised if I had a faulty injector.

I wouldn't expect overnight success from the cleaner, but what is a reasonable time span to conclude that the cleaner has done whatever it's going to do? 200 miles? 500? 7 days? 15? I'm just trying to get a rough idea.
 

5.0yote

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you should expect it to do what it does when your tank runs out, as its a per tank fill. As far as expected miles that depends on how dirty it is. Two tanks should be more than enough. You should have 0 seconds of "coughing" I guess we could call it.

curious to know if your timing is pulling back during these episodes, and if you are seeing knock count increases too?
 
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ronemca

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I haven't a COBB AP, which AFAIK is the only way to display/monitor a parameter such as knock (short of laptop + X4 data-logging)

As you can imagine, I've been thinking about this a very great deal. I've been re-living the experience in my mind and trying to correlate what might be happening, and I have a theory (yes - another one) :frusty:

Imagine if I installed a simple momentary push-to-open switch in the wire feeding one of the injectors...

And now imagine that I have an evil little sister in the car with me and she's holding the switch...

I am driving along the highway, and at the exact moment I punch the accel to pass someone...my sister depresses the switch because she wants me to be forced to pull over so she can pet a skunk she saw in the grass.

The car makes a strangled cough - the RPM's drop alarmingly - the CEL begins flashing yellow - and of course I abort the pass and initiate a pull over to the side of the road.

And as I'm nearing a stop, the engine dies.

* * After all the fiddling about I've done over the last few weeks -- which has proven itself to be NOT MAKING ANY DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER -- I now strongly suspect that if I simply sit there at the road side with the engine off for a few minutes it will "heal itself"...and I can drive off as if nothing happened. * *

So - in scenario #2...

If, when she depresses the switch I decide NOT to pull over -- and instead just keep going -- the car will still do its sky-is-falling thing, but she will realize her evil plan has failed and she will release the switch.

In both scenarios, the CEL will stop flashing once the issue has self-resolved.

And the car will resume normal operation like nothing happened.

I have experimented like this (minus the switch and the evil sister) a few times, and each time this is exactly how it unfolds. This seems to suggest a momentary shortage (or rush) of fuel to one of the cylinders. The trouble is...

I do not know whether it is in fact a sticking/dirty/faulty injector or a valve-related anomaly.

I have a new LPFS on hand as well as a new Purge Valve. And I can get a set of OE injectors for $140. But it seems silly to start randomly replacing things when I have no idea whether they will help. Not only is this not sound thinking, but it can get expensive! A $30 sensor is one thing, but C$184 + 13% tax is quite another. If I knew it would fix the problem I'd do it immediately, but geez.
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