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Need help to fix header exhaust gas leak

Jared_J

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Hi guys,
I just installed a set of BBK shorty headers over the weekend. After 17 f**king hours of work, many pieces of painful muscles, some ruined clothes, and a whole lot of curses, the car started. Even without an update on engine tune, I do feel the gain on low end torque, and the car does sound a bit like the 2018 Mustang V8 I rented 2 weeks before. Still, they are different sound and I like both of them.

However, I was unfortunate to find out an exhaust gas leak issue from the passenger side. I can clearly hear some chirp sound at 1500-3000rpm pull. For higher RPM range the leak sound is just annihilated by the glorious exhaust sound. Worst part is the cabin smell smoky after driving a while if the AC circulate from outside.

This afternoon I re-torqued all the bolts on engine side as tighten as I could, but didn't fix the issue. I even hooked the other wrench end with zip tie and pull with 90 degree for maximum torque. So I'm sure the bolts are really tight. I also took the advice from the forum and reused the stock gasket. What can I do to fix the leak?

I heard from some one I can apply some Permatex Ultra Copper over the gasket. Can I apply those without the header taken off? I mean I guess it wouldn't matter if it is applied quite messy, since it's the exhaust part of the engine and any excessive part would just burn off? It's a real pain to take off the passenger side as you all know.

To appreciate your constructive advice, I brought some donuts for everyone, please enjoy:
[ame="[MEDIA=youtube]LSVZu9xxJSM[/MEDIA]"]

And some burnouts by 2018 Mustang GT Convertible (stock car):
[ame="[MEDIA=youtube]gjOlACrgXmo[/MEDIA]"]
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Lbj

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I feel your pain with the installation of the headers. Now when I did my headers I started with the two middle bolts and work from left & right then top to bottom I also reuse the stock gaskets I do not have any issues plus I did not torqued them just tighten with a ratchet ... I hope this helps
 
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Jared_J

Jared_J

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I feel your pain with the installation of the headers. Now when I did my headers I started with the two middle bolts and work from left & right then top to bottom I also reuse the stock gaskets I do not have any issues plus I did not torqued them just tighten with a ratchet ... I hope this helps
Thanks for input! I didn't start from middle bolts because I found the stud of the mid up bolt would be very in the way of wrenching the lower right/front bolt.
I really don't understand why Ford made those studs so excessively long and turned the installation totally into a nightmare. If the studs were 1cm shorter, it would be such a breeze to install and not affect anything function wise.
Or I shall blame BBK being so lazy and cheap that they don't provide new studs & bolts custom for their very twisted & bulky headers.
 
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Jared_J

Jared_J

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Another thing I would blame both Ford and BBK, the Flange connection between header and x-pipe:

After only 36000 miles, the two bulky studs from the driver side header connecting through the flange to the X-pipe deformed (may because of the heat cycles). The two bolts were surprisingly hard to take off, especially compared to the passenger side. In the end I had to add a 2 feet extension to the wrench and apply my maximum force (I do go to gym and lift weight 5 times a week). Just imaging a 2 feet extension in between the suspension bars, I could turn barely 10 degree at a time, not even enough to make the ratchet proceed a click. I had to turn 10 degree, take off the socket, finish the ratchet turn of 1 click manually, hook up the socket again, and turn and repeat. In the end I spent 3 hours in total to just unscrew the 2 freaking bolts! And Yes I did apply PB blaster the night before.

With the two bolts off and the flange loose, I noticed I couldn't take the flange off the bolt and couldn't get the header out of the bay. After lots of desperate attempts, I calmed down and carefully inspected that thing: The two studs changed shape and there is an angle in between rather than being parallel. After another rounds of desperate pulls and shouting and very loud coursing, I calmed myself down again and installed the stock header back. I did this so that I could steadily place the header, and then using a flat screw driver and a rubber hummer to gradually knock the flange off the studs around the pipe.

So yes I spent 5 M******g hours in total just to get the flange off the header.

Now fire on BBK:

Screwing the two studs onto the header is not a pleasant job either. The threads inside the wholes are all rusted, even though I bought the so called ceramic coated one. With some PB blaster applied to flush off the rust, they still barely fit. I had to use a pillar to grab the stud and screw it into the header. This may damage the thread if you are not careful. Why can't you BBK guys make something like hexagonal head onto those studs, just like the way Ford did? You guys are just being cheap and lazy and selling overpriced stuff. This header has been around since last generation mustang and I'm sure not the first one to complain, but you guys made no update.

Some studs can be screwed in surprisingly easily, which bring out another issue: The studs wobbles inside the base, which you absolutely don't want to see. Then I was trying to improvise by applying the BBK supplied bolts onto the back end, which is the header side, and re-use the old rusted ford bolts on the other side, which is the x-pipe side. Then I met another issue: There are two bolts, one I can do such improvise to fix the wobbling stud. But for the other one, because there is an angle how the header tube connect to the flange base and everything is designed so fat, there is no space to apply a bolt on the back end. In the end I was like, whatever, the bolt on the pipe end would pull with torque applied and hopefully the rust later will make it fix. So BBK why can't you be consistent on quality and have some preciseness of your product and leave some margin when designing it?

Another thing: From BBK's instruction manual it says install time approximately 1 hour. Now, BBK guys show me how you can do this within 2 hours! I'm going to kick your ass really hard if you can't. Be honest and don't trick your customers into purchase.
 
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Jared_J

Jared_J

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*Bump*. Trying to work on it again this weekend. Any suggestions? Already bought the Permatex Ultra Copper.
To attract your attention, here is a Dodge Demon burnout made by Dodge SRT powertrain engineering department stuff at my workplace:
[ame="[MEDIA=youtube]JF_xPlB_-Jc[/MEDIA]"]
 

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Lbj

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I would order new OME gaskets just because your old ones are over 3 years old I might make a difference. .? I am not a fan of liquid gasket material . Just my opinion
 
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Jared_J

Jared_J

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I would order new OME gaskets just because your old ones are over 3 years old I might make a difference. .? I am not a fan of liquid gasket material . Just my opinion
Thank you. I intended to buy new OEM gaskets but seemed that levittown ford parts no longer offer them. The old ones on my car are still in good shape as they are just 2 pieces of thin metal staying together. I wiped the rust and then used them. Maybe because I wasn't careful enough to completely remove the rust and it resulted some gap.

Any reason why not using liquid gasket material? It says "Temperature range -75F to 700F intermittent".
 

Lbj

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I think is ok in some Applications but not on headers I am sure it will be more of a temporary fix . Then again that’s my opinion
 
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Jared_J

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Solved

Today I re-assembled the passenger side header and applied Permatex Ultra Copper onto the gasket. It's actually a very thick paste. Turned out that both the gasket and the flange were leaking. With everything tightened as much as I could, no leak so far.

It's 7 inches of snow in Columbus and it's very nasty to work underneath a car.

They said you can be anyone you want to be, so my car became a plow truck.

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soldier989

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Pretty impressed you didn't get stuck in all that. I went and did donuts in my Jeep (scaring my GF) and got stuck a couple times. Thankfully Its a 4x4.

You didn't happen to go to a home depot on west broad and have some fun in the parking lot, did you? A white mustang was in front of me and had some fun before parking.
 

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Jared_J

Jared_J

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Pretty impressed you didn't get stuck in all that. I went and did donuts in my Jeep (scaring my GF) and got stuck a couple times. Thankfully Its a 4x4.

You didn't happen to go to a home depot on west broad and have some fun in the parking lot, did you? A white mustang was in front of me and had some fun before parking.
I have snow tires and have some mats nearby so I'm not concerned. I still don't like those tires because they lack lateral support and I think they are tires for minivans.

I did make lots of donuts over the winter at random parking lots, but I don't recall going to home depot in the recent months.
 

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[MENTION=21370]Jared_J[/MENTION]
Dumb question but for the permatex application does that go on the outside around the header with it already bolted down or is that applied to the gasket itself? Thanks
 
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Jared_J

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[MENTION=21370]Jared_J[/MENTION]
Dumb question but for the permatex application does that go on the outside around the header with it already bolted down or is that applied to the gasket itself? Thanks
You will have to take the gasket off and apply them onto the gasket. You need to act quick as the instruction said it may dry out in 10 mins. I applied it onto the both sides of the gasket.
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