2019 GT500 Mustang New Spy Video, Pics, Info

Hack · Dec 18, 2017

falcongtho3 said:
Besides, most people probably don't even know what the KR stands for or the story behind it.

Maybe true of non-car, non-Ford people, but most Mustang and Shelby fans are going to know.

jake_zx2 said:
Just like the GT350 guys will be pissed when they hear that the PP2 outruns them

It's expected when you buy a car that future vehicles will out perform it. However, I'd be surprised if the Mustang PP2 with significantly less power will outrun the GT350. I do expect the day will come soon though. In a couple years when the next Mustang design comes out they will probably improve the performance again. I really hope the car gets a little smaller and lighter.

For me the bottom line is I usually attribute performance at the road course to the driver. I think my GT350 will hold its own against a PP2 in a straight line, and if the PP2 out turns me I will attribute it to the other driver being better.

BmacIL · Dec 18, 2017

Hack said:
Maybe true of non-car, non-Ford people, but most Mustang and Shelby fans are going to know.

It's expected when you buy a car that future vehicles will out perform it. However, I'd be surprised if the Mustang PP2 with significantly less power will outrun the GT350. I do expect the day will come soon though. In a couple years when the next Mustang design comes out they will probably improve the performance again. I really hope the car gets a little smaller and lighter.

For me the bottom line is I usually attribute performance at the road course to the driver. I think my GT350 will hold its own against a PP2 in a straight line, and if the PP2 out turns me I will attribute it to the other driver being better.

The PP2 will have Sport Cup 2s on 10.5"/11" rims, so I'd be surprised if equal driven GT350 on PSS could keep it behind on anything besides a fast track. On equal tires, I'd agree the GT350 should have no problem.

UAmach1 · Dec 18, 2017

stanglife said:
+1 to back on track. What indication do we have that they might reveal something next month?

2019 production starts in like 6 months, so if anything is shown it will likely be an early 2019 model. No one's seen a "finished" car around yet and I don't think one's been seeing at all on the road in almost 6 months at this point. Mostly just spotted at I think parked at ROUSH and on papers.

I think it may be shown off, but no mention on sale date.

UAmach1 · Dec 18, 2017

Hack said:
Maybe true of non-car, non-Ford people, but most Mustang and Shelby fans are going to know.

It's expected when you buy a car that future vehicles will out perform it. However, I'd be surprised if the Mustang PP2 with significantly less power will outrun the GT350. I do expect the day will come soon though. In a couple years when the next Mustang design comes out they will probably improve the performance again. I really hope the car gets a little smaller and lighter.

For me the bottom line is I usually attribute performance at the road course to the driver. I think my GT350 will hold its own against a PP2 in a straight line, and if the PP2 out turns me I will attribute it to the other driver being better.

I don't think one will be "out running" the other. In the curves I think the PP2 will hang on the butt of the Shelby, maybe pull due to the extra TQ, and in the straights I think the Shelby will put some distance on, but not a ton depending on how long they are. I know that a great driver can do like a 11.8 in the GT350, not sure what people are pulling with the GT PP1 yet, I'm expecting maybe a 12.3. So I'm thinking maybe a 12.1 for PP2 mostly due to tires, suspension tweaks, still giving the straight line edge to the GT350.

Hack · Dec 18, 2017

BmacIL said:
The PP2 will have Sport Cup 2s on 10.5"/11" rims, so I'd be surprised if equal driven GT350 on PSS could keep it behind on anything besides a fast track. On equal tires, I'd agree the GT350 should have no problem.

Good point on the Cup 2s. I hope I run up against one at the road course to see what it and the driver do.

DrumReaper · Dec 18, 2017

UAmach1 said:
I don't think one will be "out running" the other. In the curves I think the PP2 will hang on the butt of the Shelby, maybe pull due to the extra TQ, and in the straights I think the Shelby will put some distance on, but not a ton depending on how long they are. I know that a great driver can do like a 11.8 in the GT350, not sure what people are pulling with the GT PP1 yet, I'm expecting maybe a 12.3. So I'm thinking maybe a 12.1 for PP2 mostly due to tires, suspension tweaks, still giving the straight line edge to the GT350.

It looks like you drive a Nissan.

Not knocking you but it doesn’t look like you drive either a PP or a 350. Trust me... what BmacIL said is spot on. Same tires, the 350 wins.

If you wish to put an R out there now...:eyebulge:

UAmach1 · Dec 18, 2017

DrumReaper said:
It looks like you drive a Nissan.

Not knocking you but it doesn’t look like you drive either a PP or a 350. Trust me... what BmacIL said is spot on. Same tires, the 350 wins.

If you wish to put an R out there now...:eyebulge:

I wasn't aware you had to drive a car to know anything about it. Apparently ALL your automotive knowledge is limited ONLY to the 2 cars in your profile. The PP2 isn't even out so NO ONE knows how it handles on a track.

DrumReaper · Dec 18, 2017

UAmach1 said:
I wasn't aware you had to drive a car to know anything about it. Apparently ALL your automotive knowledge is limited ONLY to the 2 cars in your profile. The PP2 isn't even out so NO ONE knows how it handles on a track.

You’re right... I know absolutely nothing about your Nissan.

Twin Turbo · Dec 18, 2017

Keep it civil please, gents

jake_zx2 · Dec 18, 2017

Hack said:
It's expected when you buy a car that future vehicles will out perform it. However, I'd be surprised if the Mustang PP2 with significantly less power will outrun the GT350. I do expect the day will come soon though. In a couple years when the next Mustang design comes out they will probably improve the performance again. I really hope the car gets a little smaller and lighter.

For me the bottom line is I usually attribute performance at the road course to the driver. I think my GT350 will hold its own against a PP2 in a straight line, and if the PP2 out turns me I will attribute it to the other driver being better.

Well, with Evan Smith behind the wheel, the GT350 ran 11.9, whereas the 18 ran an 11.8. Granted, the PP2 will only come in manual, but I also think that maybe the 10 speed had another tenth in it. So really, I'd say that the GT350 might edge out the PP2 in the straights, but only barely. Not to mention, in the review of the PP1 at VIR, he had noted that he did a little run against a GT350 on the back straight and it was door to door pretty much the whole way. I'd say they're near even in a straight line.

Speaking of the VIR test, a PP1 without magride was within 1 second of a GT350 with the same driver. Now, on Grattan raceway (about 1 mile shorter than VIR Full), Ford had said they shaved over 3 seconds off of the lap time of a PP1 (with magride) in their PP2. Now, I know there's all kinds of variables, but translate that to a course that's 1 mile longer, and you should see a significant difference. A PP2 with FAR superior tires, revised suspension, and more downforce than a PP1 and with better tires than a GT350, I'd say it'll probably be right between the GT350 and GT350R as far as lap times go. And to be honest, it's a bit of a failure on Ford's part if it's not, as the 1LE (The PP2's direct competition) is faster than a GT350 around most tracks.

There's a reason the GT350 was to end production for 2018 and the PP2 release date got pushed back to near the end of 2018 production, and I'd wager it's that they didn't have the GT500 finished in time to replace the GT350, and they didn't want to have the PP2 interfere with GT350 sales. Another potential hint to the GT500 release date

jake_zx2 · Dec 18, 2017

Additionally, Road & Track reports that the PP2 grip in a 200ft skidpad test is "squarely above 1G"... I'd assume they mean 1.1Gs, but I could be wrong. That being said, Car and Driver's tests of the GT350 and GT350R yielded 1.02 and 1.10Gs respectively for "maximum cornering capacity". Again, there are plenty of variables, but it's enough to show that the PP2 MIGHT be right between the GT350 and GT350R

millhouse · Dec 18, 2017

jake_zx2 said:
Well, with Evan Smith behind the wheel, the GT350 ran 11.9, whereas the 18 ran an 11.8. Granted, the PP2 will only come in manual, but I also think that maybe the 10 speed had another tenth in it. So really, I'd say that the GT350 might edge out the PP2 in the straights, but only barely. Not to mention, in the review of the PP1 at VIR, he had noted that he did a little run against a GT350 on the back straight and it was door to door pretty much the whole way. I'd say they're near even in a straight line.

Speaking of the VIR test, a PP1 without magride was within 1 second of a GT350 with the same driver. Now, on Grattan raceway (about 1 mile shorter than VIR Full), Ford had said they shaved over 3 seconds off of the lap time of a PP1 (with magride) in their PP2. Now, I know there's all kinds of variables, but translate that to a course that's 1 mile longer, and you should see a significant difference. A PP2 with FAR superior tires, revised suspension, and more downforce than a PP1 and with better tires than a GT350, I'd say it'll probably be right between the GT350 and GT350R as far as lap times go. And to be honest, it's a bit of a failure on Ford's part if it's not, as the 1LE (The PP2's direct competition) is faster than a GT350 around most tracks.

There's a reason the GT350 was to end production for 2018 and the PP2 release date got pushed back to near the end of 2018 production, and I'd wager it's that they didn't have the GT500 finished in time to replace the GT350, and they didn't want to have the PP2 interfere with GT350 sales. Another potential hint to the GT500 release date

I think you are grossly underestimating the acceleration advantage the 10 speed is going to have over the M6. Think 0.3-0.4 seconds in the 1/4 mile. The MY18 with the manual transmission is going to be a 12.5-12.6 car @ 115mph.

machsmith · Dec 18, 2017

The 350 was only the basis of good things to come from ford and the S550 platform.
For 19 the 350 may get a DCT and additional HP, then here we are again.
Then the S650 will come in an AWD hybrid that will edge it in the straights, then the next SE car will come and cream it, its an endless cycle.
This was a GT500 thread, so I will go ahead and guess that it will blow a PP2 to smithereens

Hack · Dec 18, 2017

jake_zx2 said:
Well, with Evan Smith behind the wheel, the GT350 ran 11.9, whereas the 18 ran an 11.8. Granted, the PP2 will only come in manual, but I also think that maybe the 10 speed had another tenth in it.

What road course are you talking about here? I'm a little confused.

jake_zx2 · Dec 18, 2017

millhouse said:
I think you are grossly underestimating the acceleration advantage the 10 speed is going to have over the M6. Think 0.3-0.4 seconds in the 1/4 mile. The MY18 with the manual transmission is going to be a 12.5-12.6 car @ 115mph.

0.3-0.4 would put it at about 12.0-12.2 with Evan Smith behind the wheel, and that sounds about right. Add in the sticky MPSC2 tires, and I'd again say it'll probably run damn close to, if not match, the GT350's time of 11.9

Hack said:
What road course are you talking about here? I'm a little confused.

Those are quarter mile times

2019 GT500 Mustang New Spy Video, Pics, Info

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