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Strokerswild

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Saw the DHSC referred to as the Cringe Horse Superchaj on social media this morning while on the throne. I laughed.

That is all.
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IconicTNSnake

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I think there may be a bit of a misunderstanding on what I meant by “near its ceiling.” I wasn’t saying the Predator lacks mechanical potential — clearly it doesn’t. We’ve already seen how much headroom it has with different superchargers and supporting mods.

What I was referring to is the OEM horsepower ceiling Ford is willing to allow for this car, especially in the context of the lineup. There’s effectively a hard cap because the Dark Horse SC can never encroach on GTD territory in headline power numbers, regardless of what the engine could do in the aftermarket.

So from a factory standpoint, the big gains were never going to be about adding another 100–200 hp they had to come from cooling, chassis, aero, controls, and consistency instead. That’s why the SC changes make sense to me.

I completely agree the engine itself has far more potential; it’s just not something Ford can realize in this specific product without stepping on GTD.
That is true about what Ford will do. So the GTD is 815 hp and the GT 500 is 760 hp. That probably means the DHSC will most likely sit between 780-800 hp. Probably tuning and upgrades to the supercharger. My guess is a larger intercooler brick and manifold. Lessons learned from the aftermarket world. Still under the belief that the suspension upgrades will only be noticeable on the track and not the street. Braking on the 500 is incredible as is wonder just how much better the new brakes will be. Be interesting to see what a road test looks like on the DHSC. You know someone will eventually test it against the 2020 500. If I️ did not own a 500, I️ would probably buy one because I️ am A ford guy. What upsets me as a ford guy is all the Ford people keep saying they are “putting the European market on notice”. That is all well and good, but they are losing here in America to the Corvette! Come on Ford! Give us a Corvette killer! Had to mod the crap out of my 500 to do that.
 

Strokerswild

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What upsets me as a ford guy is all the Ford people keep saying they are “putting the European market on notice”.
But are they though?

The article that was on social media that I mentioned a comment about above was touting how the DHCS was going to blow BMW and Porsche out of the water. Performance perhaps? In terms of quality, the three late model Fords that I currently own aren't in the same universe as those two manufacturers.

Farley is delusional.
 

OX1

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I’ll try to compile a list off random automobile publications and interviews I’ve watched online basically available public data.

It’s definitely not just the brakes — those are simply the easiest upgrade to point at. Here’s a breakdown of what’s actually improved over a 2022 GT500:

Chassis & Suspension
• Next-gen MagneRide dampers (new hardware + new control software), not just a retune
• Revised spring rates, sway bars, knuckles, and front control arms
• Forged suspension components replacing steel in key areas (lighter + stiffer)
• Magnesium structural bracing for improved rigidity and reduced mass
• Wider track and reinforced components to support higher sustained track loads

Steering & Vehicle Dynamics
• Updated steering rack and tie rods for improved response
• Revised rear suspension geometry based on GTD development learnings
• New GTD-derived Variable Traction Control with multiple driver-selectable intervention levels (not available on GT500)

Aero & Cooling (major changes here)
• New front fascia designed specifically to improve brake and engine cooling
• New aluminum hood with much larger heat extractor
• Revised underbody aero and rear diffuser for axle cooling
• Track Pack adds a ducktail decklid that improves rear wing efficiency (~10%)
• Ford-stated ~620 lb of rear downforce at 180 mph

Track Pack Hardware (yes, including the brakes)
• Optional GTD-derived carbon-ceramic brakes (GT500 was never offered with CCBs)
• Michelin Cup 2 R tires (GT500 used Cup 2, not the R compound)
• Carbon-fiber wheels with SC-specific MagneRide calibration
• Significant unsprung weight reduction when fully optioned
Some of this is obvious (ducktail decklid), but it was not clear to me if some of the "upgrades" were over the last 500 or over the current Darkhorse?

IE, "Forged suspension components replacing steel in key areas (lighter + stiffer)". Did the 500 get those over the GT-PP of the same years? Did the DH not get that until now? (even though the 500 already had it). Same with "Updated steering rack and tie rods for improved response"
 

OX1

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And BTW. I don't like the look or the name. but I'm ecstatic they are building it.
It's cool to go to events/track days and see Fords.

Also means my 500 and especially the DCT, are not going to be 3 year orphans in the
long term parts situation. And more development in general aftermarket.

It's a huge win for us Shelby guys long term........
 

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wingnutt

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And BTW. I don't like the look or the name. but I'm ecstatic they are building it.
It's cool to go to events/track days and see Fords.

Also means my 500 and especially the DCT, are not going to be 3 year orphans in the
long term parts situation. And more development in general aftermarket.

It's a huge win for us Shelby guys long term........
well done…best “glass half full” explanation thus far 😬👍🏼
 

MAGS1

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The alternative is that Ford just gives up on Mustang altogether (I don’t think the Ford family would allow it, but you never know). Is it an all new platform that’s a total game changer like the S550 GT500 was? Not likely. But, they are giving us a high horsepower Mustang that should be relatively affordable (GT500 level buyers). They will not let it usurp the GTD, that’s a given but that also means the price shouldn’t be overly ridiculous either.

Remember, S650 is basically the same chassis as S550, so I’m not sure why some folks expected some groundbreaking design for the high horsepower S650 Mustang. Similar to the other S650 trims, its tweaks and more detailed improvements (hopefully) over the prior gen. Maybe the 8th generation Mustang is the one that gets the total overhaul? I’m more hopeful for that now that they’ve taken their lumps with the Lightning (and other EV programs) and can move on from that.

Anyway, I’m glad to see Ford continue to churn these cars out. Even if some feel they’re being “lazy”, it’s still better than the alternative. And I do agree with some of those “lazy” comments, there’s no competition to the Mustang from Chevy and Dodge (no, the Vette is not a competitor IMO, totally different car). IF Chevy brings the Camaro back (again), look for Ford to innovate more again.
 

Joe Gonsalves

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I know I've been very vocal about the ugly truckling, but I am very happy that ford is still in the game. They could have walked away with Dodge and Chevy when they bailed but they didn't. I've been a Ford man all my life. I lusted for the GT350 when it cam out, same can be said for the GT500. I tried real hard to find a Mach 1 in my area, since I had a 69 Mach 1, but I couldn't find it. What's the common denominator here, all 3 of those cars had enormous eye appeal. There is no doubt that the DHSC will peg you in your seat. And I'm sure it will be loads of fun on the track. My issue has always been about it's looks, I just don't lust for it at all.
 

KBR Stang

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Ford doesn't want to step on the toes of the GTD....that's why the GTD should not exist. Mustang was always a working man's muscle car not a car to compete with Corvette and the exotics. Ford should have instead made a Corvette fighter and had many higher performing trims over the base. They painted themselves into a corner with a $325,000 "Mustang".
 

9secondko

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I’m saying it isn’t true for the one that I ran the one here in front of me. (Other then the ones you’ve mention that are on display ) There is no EPA data on the sticker and the sticker also says that it isn’t for sale but everything else is accurate and non-prototype information. I don’t understand why the window sticker and what it contains is so important to you lol. I was just trying to help people figure out the weight without violating my confidentiality agreement.
just put the shovel down already.
 

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9secondko

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I know I've been very vocal about the ugly truckling, but I am very happy that ford is still in the game. They could have walked away with Dodge and Chevy when they bailed but they didn't. I've been a Ford man all my life. I lusted for the GT350 when it cam out, same can be said for the GT500. I tried real hard to find a Mach 1 in my area, since I had a 69 Mach 1, but I couldn't find it. What's the common denominator here, all 3 of those cars had enormous eye appeal. There is no doubt that the DHSC will peg you in your seat. And I'm sure it will be loads of fun on the track. My issue has always been about its looks, I just don't lust for it at all.
"Ugly Truckling" LOL good one. You should be in marketing.

We are all happy Ford is still in the game and doesn't go around killing of our Mustang whenever it underperforms in the market. We are also glad they didn't go "full ret***" and EV everything to death right away. So there is well deserved praise for that.

However, there were better solutions than overpricing the GT500 successor (GTD) into the stratosphere, killing off beloved nameplates, giving us mid cars when history has taught us to literally expect much more - also without jacking the price up into outer space.

The Mustang Dark Horse should have been the GT. The GTD should have been the Cobra and the DHSC should have been the Boss, all priced within spitting distance of the previous gen (basically the same gen actually) models. That simple shift in strategy would have made literally everyone happy, sold way more cars, and moved the only true icon in the Ford lineup forward in the public mindshare as well as in actual performance.

So you have to wonder why on earth the Ford boardroom would go in this direction. They had to have anticipated the fandom reaction. And Farley's recent dumpster fire interview was another drop in that bucket.

But hopefully... HOPEFULLY that ends with the s650 generation. Not as bad as the Mustang 2 generation, but not as hopeful and exciting as the last 20+ years have been.

Unfortunately, if it were not for GM and Dodge reinvesting in new generations of performance vehicles and V8s in particular, Ford may well have gone down a very sad road. Instead, we got the DHSC. It's not great, but it's something, even if it is basically a 2020 GT500 gussied up and improved enough to sell in 2026.

We all knew the s650 generation was just an s550+ generation. ford spent the least it could in making a car that could still sell (barely, apparently). This was likely a wise move as the industry was becoming a big mess in light of the EV push by the previous powers that be. We understood and we were OK with that. But then Ford got a bit weird and started calling it all-new, killing off the identities we loved, replacing them with identities we didn't (though we would have if the previous nameplates were still around) and pricing the danged things like they were some all-new investment. And then they tried to tell us in was indeed "all-new." That's a bit crazy and it clearly hasn't worked. In Ford's defense, they locked in on this direction when everyone was asking big moves in the wrong direction and most were destroying their companies in doing so. So it's not just them.

However, the DHSC was Ford's opportunity to right the ship for the S650. And they HAD IT RIGHT at first. They really did. They were calling it "Boss." Perfect. This car wasn't going to be the generational leap over the previous GT500 that history has taught us to expect. But dang if it wasn't light years over the previous Boss/GT35/Mach1. That would have made us feel that Ford is really doing something special. "Hey, they UPGRADED the Boss! It's even higher performance than the last GT500!" But no... they went and named it."...SC" (That must have taken many long months to come up with /s). But then we would have thought a new GT500 or Cobra was coming. And Ford knew they had already put it out there, but overcharged for it by about 200+k and named it "GTD," figuring they'd sell a fraction of the GT500 number, but make up the difference in profit margin (Clearly not anticipating the Vette would make it look silly). so they couldn't go down the Boss road. So very unfortunate.

But it is what it is. Here we are.

So what? Do we just act like it's the greatest thing ever? No. We voice our displeasure like we have been doing. But we can also appreciate the car for what it is - a revised 2020 GT500. It's a bit ugly and it's a bit underwhelming, but it's still a pretty cool car that will go really fast in a straight line and on track and sound great doing it.

If that's the case, why even complain? It's Because we want Ford to know where they messed up and to know how they can easily avoid such mistakes in the future. the answer isn't thinking they know better than us. They don't. The answer is LISTENING to the base. If you're going to not listen to what people want, it better be because you're idea is so much better that everyone "sees the light" when it ifs revealed. Clearly that is not the case here. The smart thing would be to pivot and fix the mistakes ASAP. Don't just ride it out because your pride got stung. Pride goes before a fall. Just get humble, get to work, and make these icons the Mustangs we get crazy about. The future isn't about new nameplates. It's about design and capability. Currently we have taken backward steps on both in terms of what a new generation provides. Love to see that change sooner than later.

In essence, the passion leveled at this car isn't because the fans don't like ford or Mustang, etc. It's actually because we like Ford and LOVE the Mustang. We want to see it respected, invested in, see Ford itself enthusiastic about it, and have it be the affordable dream car in our garage/driveway, etc. that we can be proud of on the road, at the track, and at the strip - as well as on the poster.

Ah, broken record at this point. But Ford, this is for you - for perspective. don't misread the passion. It's not "fake hate" as some weirdo YouTuber put it. It's not. It's legit concern, disappointment, and hope that you'll listen and do better. Take the Mustang into the future with design, powertrain performance, chassis engineering, and tech. But connect it to the heritage with the nameplates we love. Don't relegate them to yesteryear. If Chevy can give us a new paradigm of performance into the future with a nameplate as old as Corvette and ZR1 (from 1970!), you can do even better with the Mustang. Thanks for your time.
 

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The GTD is a very cool car/project. Despite the fact that it loses to the cheaper Corvette on the track and is straight embarrassed on the drag strip.

But at that price it needs to not be based on a Mustang, be held by being a Mustang...it should have been something like a new Ford GT

Maybe they could have just updated the last Ford GT (kind of like they have reskinned the GT500 into the DHSC...)
Replace the EcoBoost with a turbo Coyote and there you go. 1000lbs lighter than the GTD and 1000hp...
 

Strokerswild

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Ford lost me from the start with S650 with the "styling", those fucking screens (already have a vehicle with the giant center screen controlling audio and HVAC and hate it), and the sudden stratospheric pricing (my income hasn't jumped to match Mustang pricing's leaps since Covid).

That's it. I'm not as bothered as some with the various names, although Dork Horse still makes me giggle. But I'll never be a buyer because of those three things above. All the great hardware in the world, present with the DHSC, can't compensate for the rest.

That Mustang needs to shrink to 7/8 scale and lose a bunch of weight is another topic beyond this thread.
 
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Joe Gonsalves

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I still maintain that Ford is stuck in quicksand. They invested heavy in the EV thing, and as reported lost $4.5B. I believe they shutdown the F150 Lighting line. I think the battery plant is now making batteries for solar. So I get why they cut corners, raided the parts bin, raised prices, and half-a$$ed the design. Ford, to me, is keeping its head above the sand. Trying to recoup losses. Now where was the guy or team who styled the GT350, GT500, and Mach 1? Why didn't they let that team design the S650, DH, and DHSC? Could have been a different story had they been involved. Also Ford could have saved some bucks letting the marketing team have the day off and just kept using the heritage nameplates.
 

MAGS1

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Now where was the guy or team who styled the GT350, GT500, and Mach 1?
Jamal left Ford a few years after the GT350 launched. He’s starting up his own company in Europe. Pericak was the chief engineer for S550 and just retired. I believe a fair amount of the higher level engineers and designers that worked on S550 have also since retired. So yeah, some of the most integral people associated with S550 have since moved on.
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