Science is now cancelled? [USERS NOW BANNED FOR POLITICS]

[K4fxd]

So I have to do everything required to fly too

I quit flying shortly after 9 11. I have more titanium rods and screws than I can count.

Everytime I went through TSA I got molested. It's not worth it. I drive.

Sponsored

 

[rick81721]

Good move by FDA panel. Better to focus on getting more unvaxxed first:

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/17/fda...doses-rejecting-shots-for-general-public.html

 

[sk47]

Then why didn't you have that discussion with your provider? She obviously thought you needed the prescription. If you have a problem with the medical opinion, why didn't you seek a second? It is never wise to not take a medication or delay in taking it. Why did you even go to the doctor if you refuse to do what they recommend? Why did you fill a script you didn't intend to use?

There are known issues with infection too. You got lucky this time...

Hello; How arrogant of you to assume I did not discuss with the doctor. You are again mistaken. I did discuss the planed treatment and that the antibiotics would be used when and if needed. She had me check in from time to time as the healing progressed.
Your way is not the only way to do things.
I do not get lucky. I took precautions and worked out a plan. Broad spectrum antibiotics are not the answer all the time. I filled the script because the doctor wanted me to have it on hand. I am not going to take antibiotics if I can avoid them, but will if it comes down to it.
The too easy to use antibiotics over decades has put us in dire straits will resistant pathogens. But I would have thought you already knew this.

 

[sk47]

Good move by FDA panel. Better to focus on getting more unvaxxed first:

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/17/fda...doses-rejecting-shots-for-general-public.html

Hello; one of the interesting quotes is this.

"Pfizer’s stock was down more than 1% in intraday trading after the initial vote. Shares of BioNTech were down more than 4%."

 

[sk47]

C-19 Pandemia: Quo vadis, homo sapiens? (geertvandenbossche.org)

Hello; The above link showed up on another forum today. Pretty sure it has been on this thread some time in the past. It was dissed there here and it was dissed here in the past.

One fellow on the other forum pointed out the bit about the virus in animals as becoming reservoirs for the virus even if by some magic all people are protected.

 

[rick81721]

Hello; one of the interesting quotes is this.

"Pfizer’s stock was down more than 1% in intraday trading after the initial vote. Shares of BioNTech were down more than 4%."

Update - the panel did recommend boosters for 65+ and those at high risk (comorbidities).

 

[sk47]

Update - the panel did recommend boosters for 65+ and those at high risk (comorbidities).

Hello; That includes me at 74. I think I will pass on a booster any time soon. I was very ill for over 24 hours after the second shot and too tired to do anything for another day. No reason to expect any different from a third.

I also hope to investigate the mechanism behind the strong illness reaction to the second shot. I have had a number of vaccines over time, but never such a strong bad reaction before. My guess has been it was that the first shot alerted my immune system and a month later the second shot triggered the strong reaction. I want to understand what happened.

I did some looking yesterday and found the shots insert mRNA instructions directly into our body cells and override their normal function to force the production of virus protein spikes. Best as I can know so far the second moderna shot was the same as the first in terms of ingredients.
Information is coming out and we seem to be at a point at which some answers are to be had. We now have information what many suspected all along that natural immunity is not only good enough, but likely is robust.

One question still to be answered for me is do the shots trigger a normal immune response the same as an actual infection would or the same as the old style vaccines did? If the mRNA shots do that then I do not need a booster. If they do not trigger that sort of immune reaction, then I need to find some more information.

The first two shots invaded a bunch of my body cells and forced them to make copies of partial virus spike protein. Those partial spike proteins then triggered my body to make antibodies. Is that all that was done in my immune system?

A third shot will likely result in more antibodies in the same manner. But if my immune system had a full immune response from the shots it should be already set up to make antibodies as needed. I need some more information and unfortunately have enough education and background to not be willing to just take some spurt's word for things. I may not have the background to follow every bit of it, but will keep trying.

 

[MaskedRacerX]

Hello; one of the interesting quotes is this.

"Pfizer’s stock was down more than 1% in intraday trading after the initial vote. Shares of BioNTech were down more than 4%."

There's nothing atypical about that sort of market movement given the industry, product and recent news cycle.

 

[rick81721]

Hello; That includes me at 74. I think I will pass on a booster any time soon. I was very ill for over 24 hours after the second shot and too tired to do anything for another day. No reason to expect any different from a third.

I also hope to investigate the mechanism behind the strong illness reaction to the second shot. I have had a number of vaccines over time, but never such a strong bad reaction before. My guess has been it was that the first shot alerted my immune system and a month later the second shot triggered the strong reaction. I want to understand what happened.

I did some looking yesterday and found the shots insert mRNA instructions directly into our body cells and override their normal function to force the production of virus protein spikes. Best as I can know so far the second moderna shot was the same as the first in terms of ingredients.
Information is coming out and we seem to be at a point at which some answers are to be had. We now have information what many suspected all along that natural immunity is not only good enough, but likely is robust.

One question still to be answered for me is do the shots trigger a normal immune response the same as an actual infection would or the same as the old style vaccines did? If the mRNA shots do that then I do not need a booster. If they do not trigger that sort of immune reaction, then I need to find some more information.

The first two shots invaded a bunch of my body cells and forced them to make copies of partial virus spike protein. Those partial spike proteins then triggered my body to make antibodies. Is that all that was done in my immune system?

A third shot will likely result in more antibodies in the same manner. But if my immune system had a full immune response from the shots it should be already set up to make antibodies as needed. I need some more information and unfortunately have enough education and background to not be willing to just take some spurt's word for things. I may not have the background to follow every bit of it, but will keep trying.

There are many different types of vaccines - earlier ones used dead or attenuated viruses. See the link for more details. mRNA vaccines work similarly to subunit vaccines which inject a piece of the targeted microorganism - HPV, Hepatitus B, whooping cough, shingles, etc. With mRNA vaccines, your shoulder muscle cells produce the covid spike protein for a week or so (iirc) to elicit the immune response.

https://www.hhs.gov/immunization/basics/types/index.html

 

[sk47]

There's nothing atypical about that sort of market movement given the industry, product and recent news cycle.

Hello; Exactly.

 

[sk47]

There are many different types of vaccines - earlier ones used dead or attenuated viruses. See the link for more details. mRNA vaccines work similarly to subunit vaccines which inject a piece of the targeted microorganism - HPV, Hepatitus B, whooping cough, shingles, etc. With mRNA vaccines, your shoulder muscle cells produce the covid spike protein for a week or so (iirc) to elicit the immune response.

https://www.hhs.gov/immunization/basics/types/index.html

Understanding How COVID-19 Vaccines Work | CDC

• “mRNA vaccines contain material from the virus that causes COVID-19 that gives our cells instructions for how to make a harmless protein that is unique to the virus. After our cells make copies of the protein, they destroy the genetic material from the vaccine. Our bodies recognize that the protein should not be there and build T-lymphocytes and B-lymphocytes that will remember how to fight the virus that causes COVID-19 if we are infected in the future.”

Hello; I get that it is risky to try to read between the lines, but the statement above appears to indicate that the mRNA vaccines do trigger a normal immune response. That we will have T and B lymphocytes which remember and fight the virus in the future.

So why the need for a booster to someone like me who had two shots?

 

[sk47]

Understanding How COVID-19 Vaccines Work | CDC

• “mRNA vaccines contain material from the virus that causes COVID-19 that gives our cells instructions for how to make a harmless protein that is unique to the virus. After our cells make copies of the protein, they destroy the genetic material from the vaccine. Our bodies recognize that the protein should not be there and build T-lymphocytes and B-lymphocytes that will remember how to fight the virus that causes COVID-19 if we are infected in the future.”

Hello; I get that it is risky to try to read between the lines, but the statement above appears to indicate that the mRNA vaccines do trigger a normal immune response. That we will have T and B lymphocytes which remember and fight the virus in the future.

So why the need for a booster to someone like me who had two shots?

Hello; I got one of my questions answered I think. That being what happens to the mRNA vaccine instructions that invade out cells. From the above sentence it seems the cells do what they always do and discard the mRNA after it has done the job and await other mRNA from the DNA with instructions to make a different protein.

I still hope to find why I had such a strong side effect to the second shot. My first guess was my body had a very strong and robust immune response. If that guess is correct I will venture another guess. That being I have an immune system ready and strong to deal with at least the virus for which the protein spikes were made. As long as the variants of covid do not change their outer spikes too much, I will have some help with them. Of course at some point there very likely will be much mutated virus. Just WAG's at this point to be sure.

 

[K4fxd]

I get that it is risky to try to read between the lines, but the statement above appears to indicate that the mRNA vaccines do trigger a normal immune response. That we will have T and B lymphocytes which remember and fight the virus in the future.

This is pure speculation deriven from observing what is going on in the world.

The mRNA jab primes your system to recognize the virus. It does nothing other than that. When you catch the virus it causes your immune system to start making anti bodies sooner than if you had not been jabbed.



It would seem if the mRNA vaccine actually did trigger a normal immune response then the jabbed people would not become carriers and shedders of the virus. Correct?

I mean in the real world this is what is going on. Hence the new policies of making jabbed people wear masks ect...

So is a normal immune response or is it just a jump start to help the body have a normal response when infected with the real thing.

IE it only takes 2 days for a jabbed person to recognize the invader VS 5 for non jabbed and immediately for a recovered person.

 

[GT Pony]

So why the need for a booster to someone like me who had two shots?

1) Because the effectiveness of the vaccine wanes over time, and
2) To make your immune system even stronger because of the waning, and to also make it more resistant against the Delta variant.
3) And older people's natural immune system is typically weaker than younger people's (as are people's who have underlying medical issues), so that's why they now says a booster is recommended for people over 65 or with underlying medical conditions.

 

[rick81721]

Hello; I got one of my questions answered I think. That being what happens to the mRNA vaccine instructions that invade out cells. From the above sentence it seems the cells do what they always do and discard the mRNA after it has done the job and await other mRNA from the DNA with instructions to make a different protein.

I still hope to find why I had such a strong side effect to the second shot. My first guess was my body had a very strong and robust immune response. If that guess is correct I will venture another guess. That being I have an immune system ready and strong to deal with at least the virus for which the protein spikes were made. As long as the variants of covid do not change their outer spikes too much, I will have some help with them. Of course at some point there very likely will be much mutated virus. Just WAG's at this point to be sure.

Everyone has different responses but most have a stronger reaction after the 2nd dose. My shoulder got very sore within hrs after my 2nd (Pfizer) and I was really tired the next day.

Sponsored