I "think" Ford secretly allows Ceratec.

[3rdRGR]

I was thinking voiding the warranty for that specific problem - in that case it is saying the same thing. Nobody said void the whole warranty, I never saw those words.

Although, I have read here that some guys reported that Ford did void their whole warranty because they had too many mods and a tune on the PCM.

Here's the actual statements out of the Owner's Manual.

They are "unnecessary," as long as you are fine with an engine with 7,200 miles on it sounding like a 70's typewriter at idle.... As to "Karma" another poster mentioned... don't really buy into it, but if I did, I'd say it leans toward the working class schmuck trying to quiet his engine with a proven product that does so, over a multi-billion dollar car company that won't engineer piston slap out of their product. Just sayin... little bitter... and I can overlook a lot because I really love my car.

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[GT Pony]

They are "unnecessary," as long as you are fine with an engine with 7,200 miles on it sounding like a 70's typewriter at idle.... As to "Karma" another poster mentioned... don't really buy into it, but if I did, I'd say it leans toward the working class schmuck trying to quiet his engine with a proven product that does so, over a multi-billion dollar car company that won't engineer piston slap out of their product. Just sayin... little bitter... and I can overlook a lot because I really love my car.

Ceratec isn't going o blow-up the motor, and yes it does make the BBQ tick go away for most guys. Ceratec doesn't work so much for the 2K~2.3K rattle or piston slap.

 

[accel]

If you think you are having an 8,000 dollar engine failure and have used Ceratec, perhaps it might be worth it to do a 40 dollar oil change prior to taking it in. I'm on the fence right now. I didn't have the tick, then did an oil change, now I have it and the rattle just started yesterday... 7,200 miles. Wifey isn't happy and when I floated the "they probably won't do anything about it and are calling it normal" she gave the proverbial "Oh heeeeell no! It wasn't happening before!" Guess it costs more than just money to be cool....

I myself got familiar with the tick back when ford was addressing the issue. First short block replacement- tick came back exactly at oil change point. Second block - I started my preventative ceratec usage.

I do not know whether my engine does not tick just by itself, or, because I keep ising ceratec. And I do not want to know why.

Also, ceratec does make engine operate smooth. I do like it with ceratec more.

After a couple of full 1 bottle per oil change cycles I went to 150ml per oil change and so far so good.

I'm bipolar.... One part of me thinks maybe I'm just lucky and my second block just does not tick, another part thinks that if I discontinue ceratec I realize it just ticks, or will start after the oil change... So complicated....

 

[Condor1970]

I only know of ceratec and xl17 that fix the tick. Care to share other options?

All the guys at my dealership say they use Krex. Which is a graphite based additive akin to XL-17.

https://www.amazon.com/Krex-Graphit...e&qid=1598670572&sprefix=krex+,aps,206&sr=8-5

 

[3rdRGR]

All the guys at my dealership say they use Krex. Which is a graphite based additive akin to XL-17.

https://www.amazon.com/Krex-Graphite-Engine-Lubricant-Fl/dp/B002Y2OY2C/ref=sr_1_5?crid=1QKYVNZYDE44D&dchild=1&keywords=krex+additive&qid=1598670572&sprefix=krex+,aps,206&sr=8-5

Do not use additives as they are unnecessary... unless we use it because we deem that it is necessary to stop a problem that we say is normal because a lot of cars get the problem. That about right?

 

[3rdRGR]

Ceratec isn't going o blow-up the motor, and yes it does make the BBQ tick go away for most guys. Ceratec doesn't work so much for the 2K~2.3K rattle or piston slap.

I thought the tick was piston slap? Just getting up to speed on this, so forgive my ignorance. I've just got both the tick and the rattle post oil change, and trying to decide what to do. I've got hard shifts, (A10) mainly in sport mode, so I'm probably going to take it in for that to see if they'll do a re-flash. If they give me the "it's normal" with the tick and rattle, I'm probably going with an additive. Leaning toward Ceratec at the moment, but I don't want to do that prior to a trip to the dealership to see how they are. Haven't been there at all yet, so we'll see.

 

[accel]

I thought the tick was piston slap? Just getting up to speed on this, so forgive my ignorance. I've just got both the tick and the rattle post oil change, and trying to decide what to do. I've got hard shifts, (A10) mainly in sport mode, so I'm probably going to take it in for that to see if they'll do a re-flash. If they give me the "it's normal" with the tick and rattle, I'm probably going with an additive. Leaning toward Ceratec at the moment, but I don't want to do that prior to a trip to the dealership to see how they are. Haven't been there at all yet, so we'll see.

No official info on what tick is. No reliable guess on what this is eirher. Versions from piston slap to rod knock or even oil cavitation.

This is definitely "something hits something" kind as far as I think of it. Additives containing particles quiet it immediately by providing a cushion.

As it develops after a short period of time during oil change - my guess some part of engine is not lubricated/protected well with no oil pressure.

oil viscosity affects the tick but does not fix it from my experience. For example switching to 5w30 changed rpm range of the tick and made it more prominent.

I guess additives like ceratec or mos2 should protect engine from getting the damage during oil change process as they build a protective film over time that will be very handy during lubrication starvation.

 

[Condor1970]

I thought the tick was piston slap? Just getting up to speed on this, so forgive my ignorance. I've just got both the tick and the rattle post oil change, and trying to decide what to do. I've got hard shifts, (A10) mainly in sport mode, so I'm probably going to take it in for that to see if they'll do a re-flash. If they give me the "it's normal" with the tick and rattle, I'm probably going with an additive. Leaning toward Ceratec at the moment, but I don't want to do that prior to a trip to the dealership to see how they are. Haven't been there at all yet, so we'll see.

Best guess so far is oil cavitation similar to what is heard on most diesel engines. Most diesels aren't very audible because they are so loud. However, with the newer diesels out being so quiet, many Ford and Chevy owners have this exact same typewriter tick. Chevy put out a tsb message saying it was some sort of oil flashing or cavitation in the main bearings, and is normal for high compression engines. It tends to make sense, since previous Coyote gens were 11:1 compression ratio, and had a lot less reports of ticking, yet still a few. It got much more noticeable in this 3rd gen, which is is 12:1 approaching diesel territory.

 

[GT Pony]

Best guess so far is oil cavitation similar to what is heard on most diesel engines. Most diesels aren't very audible because they are so loud. However, with the newer diesels out being so quiet, many Ford and Chevy owners have this exact same typewriter tick. Chevy put out a tsb message saying it was some sort of oil flashing or cavitation in the main bearings, and is normal for high compression engines. It tends to make sense, since previous Coyote gens were 11:1 compression ratio, and had a lot less reports of ticking, yet still a few. It got much more noticeable in this 3rd gen, which is is 12:1 approaching diesel territory.

If it's oil cavitation there has to also be some kind of physical difference factor between motors because many Coyotes don't have any BBQ tick whatsoever. Besides, how could 150 ml of Ceratec added to 10 qts of oil (only 1.5% concentration) make the tick go away almost instantly. And when and oil change is done, the friction level between parts is also changed and that's when the ticking can show up. The ticking goes away slowly sometimes on some engines as the oil is ran, which IMO is from the friction level changing as miles get put on the oil. Still think it's a friction level mechanical noise issue, not oil cavitation.

 

[Condor1970]

If it's oil cavitation there has to also be some kind of physical difference factor between motors because many Coyotes don't have any BBQ tick whatsoever. Besides, how could 150 ml of Ceratec added to 10 qts of oil (only 1.5% concentration) make the tick go away almost instantly. And when and oil change is done, the friction level between parts is also changed and that's when the ticking can show up. The ticking goes away slowly sometimes on some engines as the oil is ran, which IMO is from the friction level changing as miles get put on the oil. Still think it's a friction level mechanical noise issue, not oil cavitation.

Then why does the exact same noise in Diesel engines have an explanation given as "oil flashing" (ie cavitation) by the manufacturer?

Are they lying to us?

I bet the Ford people watch threads like this on the Coyote engines, and just snicker in the background as we argue over this.

 

[michail71]

A little OT but the dealer service department wanted to upsell service that contained an oil additive. I just remember it was expensive.


My last change I did 300 ml of the Cera Tec to match the recommended amount. Not a single tick since. It sounds like a finely engineered engine. On using one bottle I would get an occasional tick.

Liqui Moly makes a full synthetic 5w-20 that has a ford spec on it, but I'm not sure if it's the proper spec. If it does I may give it a try over the PUP on the next change and see how it does on it's own.

 

[Elp_jc]

Hey, a big favor: Can you please tell us when the oil starts looking like Frappuccino? It supposedly takes 2 to 3K miles, but want to hear from somebody actually using it . Thx.

 

[accel]

Hey, a big favor: Can you please tell us when the oil starts looking like Frappuccino? It supposedly takes 2 to 3K miles, but want to hear from somebody actually using it . Thx.

Once you add ceratec to oil (I only can say about new oil, or nearly new), it will transform oil into a caramel/Frappuccino/whatever look right away. It will be very catchy if someone drains oil soon after. It will not be visible at the oil dipstick though.

If you want to prototype it - add ceratec to a jug of new oil and then shake it really well. You'll see what I mean. This is how I add ceratec to oil during oil change by the way. I want ceratec to be pre-mixed and start circulation right away.

When ceratec/oil mix gets old and I can say of mileage like 5k miles - it would look just like normal used oil - dark/black/not transparent.

 

[accel]

It sounds like a finely engineered engine.

Yes, I have to admit that ceratec does make engine sound very smooth. I would never add one if it was just for that purpose though

 

[GT Pony]

Then why does the exact same noise in Diesel engines have an explanation given as "oil flashing" (ie cavitation) by the manufacturer?

Are they lying to us?

I bet the Ford people watch threads like this on the Coyote engines, and just snicker in the background as we argue over this.

A diesel engine and a Coyote are apples to oranges. If journal bearing oil cavitation was so common, why don't the majority of engines tick from bearing cavitation? All IC engines have crankshaft and rod journal bearings at are basically close in design and clearances.

And if it was oil cavitation, why didn't Ford simply just say that in their SSM 7718? Would it really hurt to just say what's actually causing it if Ford claims it's not damaging or detrimental?

BTW, oil cavitation in journal bearings isn't exactly something you want going on as it can cause surface damage to the bearing over time if it's excessive.

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