Sponsored

Why doesn't an oil catch-can come stock on our Mustangs??

Andy13186

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 19, 2018
Threads
106
Messages
2,453
Reaction score
1,444
Location
Florida
Vehicle(s)
2018 Mustang GT 10speed Aluminator Whippled
My Moroso catch can on my CTS-V (modded 630rwhp) caught like 15 oz of oil per 5k miles lol. I drove that car insanely hard though. Emptied it every 500 miles or so. Any boosted car needs one IMO.
 

bootlegger

Enginerd
Joined
Jul 12, 2017
Threads
9
Messages
1,765
Reaction score
593
Location
Mount Pleasant, SC
First Name
James
Vehicle(s)
Ex 2008 Mustang GT Owner
If you are running e85 (non boosted), is a catch can necessary?
No, it isn't a requirement. Whether it is a benefit is debatable. It won't hurt though.
 

bootlegger

Enginerd
Joined
Jul 12, 2017
Threads
9
Messages
1,765
Reaction score
593
Location
Mount Pleasant, SC
First Name
James
Vehicle(s)
Ex 2008 Mustang GT Owner
Because manufacturers don't care if you have dirty valves or not...they'd rather you destroy your stuff quickly so they can sell you new stuff.
I work for an OEM, and this just isn't true. When stuff breaks faster, our warranty claims increase, and it costs the company more money. We design systems to go 60k without a single issue. Ideally, we would like them to last beyond 100k miles. In the case of blow-by, we assume that the LAC fuel is able to do its job, and keep the valves clean. In most cases it will. However, it is normal for manufacturers to recommend a fuel supplier specifically. They will say BP, Shell, or Exxon on the cap, as those are Top Tier and will clean up the valves.

My Moroso catch can on my CTS-V (modded 630rwhp) caught like 15 oz of oil per 5k miles lol. I drove that car insanely hard though. Emptied it every 500 miles or so. Any boosted car needs one IMO.
The benefit is much greater in boosted applications for sure.
 

1MEAN18

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2019
Threads
44
Messages
620
Reaction score
320
Location
Where I stand
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
'18 GT
I work for an OEM, and this just isn't true. When stuff breaks faster, our warranty claims increase, and it costs the company more money. We design systems to go 60k without a single issue. Ideally, we would like them to last beyond 100k miles. In the case of blow-by, we assume that the LAC fuel is able to do its job, and keep the valves clean. In most cases it will. However, it is normal for manufacturers to recommend a fuel supplier specifically. They will say BP, Shell, or Exxon on the cap, as those are Top Tier and will clean up the valves.


The benefit is much greater in boosted applications for sure.
In a DI engine, fuel doesn't matter...the only way to keep intake valves clean is using a catch can because in a DI engine, no liquid flows over the intake valves to help keep them clean. SO sorry... I could give two shits what a manufacturer says when its not applicable to my engine in any physical way to begin with. And I stand by my original words that manufacturers could give two shits about the cleanliness of my engine. Add to that, they are too cheap to fix it with a simple catch can too. Hell, Ford is too cheap to replace the prop rod with hood struts like almost all other manufacturers do on 50k cars!!! So why expect them to care about the intake valves cleanliness also...what you said makes me laugh.
 

Sponsored

bootlegger

Enginerd
Joined
Jul 12, 2017
Threads
9
Messages
1,765
Reaction score
593
Location
Mount Pleasant, SC
First Name
James
Vehicle(s)
Ex 2008 Mustang GT Owner
In a DI engine, fuel doesn't matter...the only way to keep intake valves clean is using a catch can because in a DI engine, no liquid flows over the intake valves to help keep them clean. SO sorry... I could give two shits what a manufacturer says when its not applicable to my engine in any physical way to begin with.
There are no single fuel system DIG V8 mustangs in existence. You may want to research the fuel system in your car. Fuel most certainly does go on your intake valves.
 
Last edited:

1MEAN18

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2019
Threads
44
Messages
620
Reaction score
320
Location
Where I stand
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
'18 GT
There are no single fuel system DIG mustangs in existence. You may want to research the fuel system in your car. Fuel most certainly does go on your intake valves.
You sir are an idiot. Obviously you don't know how DI engines work.
 

bootlegger

Enginerd
Joined
Jul 12, 2017
Threads
9
Messages
1,765
Reaction score
593
Location
Mount Pleasant, SC
First Name
James
Vehicle(s)
Ex 2008 Mustang GT Owner
You sir are an idiot. Obviously you don't know how DI engines work.
You can't be serious...
I mean, I develop DI fuel systems for a living. I have been doing it for 7 years, and have 13 years of engineering experience working with DI engines. Pretty sure I understand a bit about it. Have you ever looked at your engine without the cover? Please do a bit of research before commenting on the subject. Start here: http://fordauthority.com/2018/05/th...ation-coyote-v8-gets-explored-in-depth-video/
"Granted, an even bigger deal than its spray-in cylinder liners is the latest Coyote’s new dual-fuel-injection system, which couples direct- and port-injection to leverage the best qualities of each. This, Jason says, is “great from a carbon-buildup standpoint, but it also allows for better fuel control at high-load, high-rpm scenarios.”"



Aside from all that, blow-by is only one source of valve deposits. EGR and combustion gasses that escape during transition also tend to cause buildup. All the catch cans in the world aren't going to stop some buildup without help from a port injector. BMW guys use catch cans and still tend to need a good walnut blasting of the valves over time. Their systems are true single system DIG, unlike the Mustang GT.
 

1MEAN18

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2019
Threads
44
Messages
620
Reaction score
320
Location
Where I stand
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
'18 GT
You can't be serious...
I mean, I develop DI fuel systems for a living. I have been doing it for 7 years, and have 13 years of engineering experience working with DI engines. Pretty sure I understand a bit about it. Have you ever looked at your engine without the cover? Please do a bit of research before commenting on the subject. Start here: http://fordauthority.com/2018/05/th...ation-coyote-v8-gets-explored-in-depth-video/
"Granted, an even bigger deal than its spray-in cylinder liners is the latest Coyote’s new dual-fuel-injection system, which couples direct- and port-injection to leverage the best qualities of each. This, Jason says, is “great from a carbon-buildup standpoint, but it also allows for better fuel control at high-load, high-rpm scenarios.”"



Aside from all that, blow-by is only one source of valve deposits. EGR and combustion gasses that escape during transition also tend to cause buildup. All the catch cans in the world aren't going to stop some buildup without help from a port injector. BMW guys use catch cans and still tend to need a good walnut blasting of the valves over time. Their systems are true single system DIG, unlike the Mustang GT.
I could make up a story about me being the king of some country too...doesn't make it true. What you said earlier, well it made me laugh because its just ignorant. Fuel DOES NOT FLOW OVER INTAKE VALVES ADDING A CLEANING EFFECT in my Gen 3 coyote. And if you are some type of engineer, then that adds to my disrespect of you sir, because mechanics routinely fix what engineers screw up from the start.
 

re-rx7

Ruck the night away
Joined
May 24, 2015
Threads
17
Messages
783
Reaction score
364
Location
Gainesville, Tx
First Name
Brandon
Vehicle(s)
19 5.0
I could make up a story about me being the king of some country too...doesn't make it true. What you said earlier, well it made me laugh because its just ignorant. Fuel DOES NOT FLOW OVER INTAKE VALVES ADDING A CLEANING EFFECT in my Gen 3 coyote. And if you are some type of engineer, then that adds to my disrespect of you sir, because mechanics routinely fix what engineers screw up from the start.
Actually it does? Thats one of the main reasons Ford retained port fuel on the Gen3. If you researched you would know this instead of talking about things you obviously know nothing about.
 

Sponsored

1MEAN18

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2019
Threads
44
Messages
620
Reaction score
320
Location
Where I stand
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
'18 GT
Actually it does? Thats one of the main reasons Ford retained port fuel on the Gen3. If you researched you would know this instead of talking about things you obviously know nothing about.
Dual fuel is for emissions and more power. Still isn't injecting anything across any intake valves in the engine, so no cleaning or cooling effect.
 

re-rx7

Ruck the night away
Joined
May 24, 2015
Threads
17
Messages
783
Reaction score
364
Location
Gainesville, Tx
First Name
Brandon
Vehicle(s)
19 5.0

1MEAN18

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2019
Threads
44
Messages
620
Reaction score
320
Location
Where I stand
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
'18 GT
So how does port fuel injection not flow by the valves? Ive got to hear this since that is literally the definition.

http://www.auto-go.net/blog/port-fu...-fuel-injection-seriously-why-do-i-care-p/92/
I just looked up a diagram of the area, looks like I was wrong, port side DOES flow past the intake valve. My bad. Must have had it in my head the port injector was like the DI one on the high pressure side. So is this why we get almost no oil in our catch cans? Does this make using a catch can not really necessary on an '18 up coyote? Mind = Blown. Hell, now I might as well sell my JLT one if that's the case.
 

re-rx7

Ruck the night away
Joined
May 24, 2015
Threads
17
Messages
783
Reaction score
364
Location
Gainesville, Tx
First Name
Brandon
Vehicle(s)
19 5.0
I just looked up a diagram of the area, looks like I was wrong, port side DOES flow past the intake valve. My bad. Must have had it in my head the port injector was like the DI one on the high pressure side. So is this why we get almost no oil in our catch cans? Does this make using a catch can not really necessary on an '18 up coyote? Mind = Blown. Hell, now I might as well sell my JLT one if that's the case.
I think a catch can isnt a bad idea just due to octane dilution. It keeps power consistent
 

1MEAN18

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 5, 2019
Threads
44
Messages
620
Reaction score
320
Location
Where I stand
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
'18 GT
I think a catch can isnt a bad idea just due to octane dilution. It keeps power consistent
last time I checked mine, it had maybe an ounce of oil in it, over 1 year use and roughly 2k miles. I cleaned it out, changed my oil and didn't really think much about it. Now, thinking about how much oil my Ecoboost caught, the Mustang really must not need one unless its a daily driver. I run E85 so I'm not really worried about octane dilution at all since my starting octane rating is likely over 100. Time to sell the JLT off my '18 it looks like.
Sponsored

 
 




Top