Sponsored

Automobile Article - The Future of Camaro, Mustang & Challenger

Docscurlock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2018
Threads
17
Messages
1,472
Reaction score
780
Location
Florida
First Name
Doc
Vehicle(s)
2020 GT500, 2019 Roushcharged F150, 2016 GT350R, 2013 Boss 302LS, 2009 GT/CS, 2000 Cobra R, 1995 Cobra R
Vehicle Showcase
2
Those ecoboost conv mustangs are a blast as a rental car. I always reserve one when we go to Florida.
 

Bullitt0819

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2019
Threads
27
Messages
543
Reaction score
248
Location
Modesto, CA
First Name
Bob
Vehicle(s)
2019 Bullitt Mustang
I've said quite a few times that in ten years Mustang and the pony car segment will be dead. I did notice that the author is a camaro fanboi taking a jab at Mustang as being a rental car.
I'm a Mustang fanboi, and when I see a convertible Ecoboost Mustang the first thing I think is 'rental car' (esp. if there's a middle-aged couple in tourist in it). Also, the license plate holders and/or bumper stickers are a dead giveaway.
 
Last edited:

Bullitt0819

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2019
Threads
27
Messages
543
Reaction score
248
Location
Modesto, CA
First Name
Bob
Vehicle(s)
2019 Bullitt Mustang
LOL at any of these 3 cars competing with a C8.
Well, here's Automobile's Design Critic on the C8:

"I am deeply sorry to be severely disappointed by the styling of the C8. I hoped for something really new and exciting, not a boringly generic supercar, mostly indistinguishable from the many and varied unimaginative devices that show up regularly at the Geneva auto show. Its styling is confused. Downright messy, in fact. I count a dozen horizontal lines, not to mention four convoluted taillights, four nice rectangular exhaust tips, plus varied slots, vents, grilles, indented surfaces, and wing elements... just across the rear fascia. The front is no better, and the profile with its short, stumpy nose is equally surprising. Maybe it's all meant to look purposeful, but to me it seems just a careless, cluttered, graphic composition, not worthy of Corvette history and what we expect of this technically brilliant descendant of the elegant, Jaguar-inspired original C1 from 1953. I have no doubt this will be a very good car, with truly world-class performance coupled with American-style daily usefulness and (probably) easy servicing - dry-sump engines are not typical dealer shop fare. But I'd have liked to see some traces of the Astrovette or the four-rotor mid-engine concept from the Bill Mitchell era."

... via http://www.autoextremist.com/on-the-table1/
 

Twin Turbo

Super Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Aug 2, 2012
Threads
479
Messages
9,835
Reaction score
7,402
Location
England
First Name
Paul
Vehicle(s)
Mustang '05 GT
"A hybrid Mustang is expected next year as a 2021 model, and this car always was planned for the existing architecture. This suggests the Explorer/Aviator-based Mustang would come in time for perhaps the 2023 model year, with the hybrid powertrain carrying over.

Now it looks like the current Ford Mustang will roll on at least through the 2025 model year, if not later."



They need to make their mind up. Is the next gen Mustang a '23MY or a '25MY+?

Besides, this is just a rework of an article they did a few month back. In that, they stated:

https://www.automobilemag.com/news/next-ford-mustang-details-on-sale-info/

One source says the CD6 Mustang, which goes by the codename S650, appears to be delayed at least to the 2026 model year, while another source guesses 2028 or 2029, either of which makes it less of a product plan than a promise to keep building the icon. In the interim, the S550 Mustang will receive a major mid-cycle facelift to update its current D2C platform and reskin it with new sheetmetal from nose to tail, which will require some underbody work. It's the mid-cycle D2C update that will spawn a Mustang hybrid, although that car is said to be delayed slightly from the 2021 model year to early in calendar-year 2022.

Like the rest of us, they are just guessing!
 

Sponsored

Smokey613

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 23, 2019
Threads
15
Messages
333
Reaction score
330
Location
Redneck Riviera
Website
www.facebook.com
First Name
David
Vehicle(s)
2015 Mustang GT Premium Convertible Race Red
Vehicle Showcase
1
I am glad I bought my 2015 GT Conv as a keeper. If the platform either grows, or is deleted, I still have my Pony car. Honda and Toyota are some of the few manufacturers that are keeping "Cars" in their lineup.
I wish we could keep our 2015, but it’s just not in the cards. I will just enjoy it while we have it.
 

shogun32

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2019
Threads
89
Messages
14,607
Reaction score
12,097
Location
Northern VA
First Name
Matt
Vehicle(s)
'19 GT/PP, '23 GB Mach1, '12 Audi S5 (v8+6mt)
Vehicle Showcase
2
I reckon a 2022 update for the S550/GT350 were GT brakes become standard and carbon fiber panels become a factory option. The GT/PP2 package has the option for the Tremec or alternatively the DCT makes an appearance. This would change the floor pan a bit so maybe the MT82 just gets tossed and there are no manuals in the S550 save the 2.3l Eco. The 5.0 is probably gone in favor of the 3.5l EB mated to the DCT.

Hey, we can all speculate...
 

Laststandard

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2018
Threads
0
Messages
252
Reaction score
192
Location
Mpls, MN
First Name
Mike
Vehicle(s)
2018 Camaro 1SS 1LE
Vehicle Showcase
1
Well, here's Automobile's Design Critic on the C8:

"I am deeply sorry to be severely disappointed by the styling of the C8. I hoped for something really new and exciting, not a boringly generic supercar, mostly indistinguishable from the many and varied unimaginative devices that show up regularly at the Geneva auto show. Its styling is confused. Downright messy, in fact. I count a dozen horizontal lines, not to mention four convoluted taillights, four nice rectangular exhaust tips, plus varied slots, vents, grilles, indented surfaces, and wing elements... just across the rear fascia. The front is no better, and the profile with its short, stumpy nose is equally surprising. Maybe it's all meant to look purposeful, but to me it seems just a careless, cluttered, graphic composition, not worthy of Corvette history and what we expect of this technically brilliant descendant of the elegant, Jaguar-inspired original C1 from 1953. I have no doubt this will be a very good car, with truly world-class performance coupled with American-style daily usefulness and (probably) easy servicing - dry-sump engines are not typical dealer shop fare. But I'd have liked to see some traces of the Astrovette or the four-rotor mid-engine concept from the Bill Mitchell era."

... via http://www.autoextremist.com/on-the-table1/
I'll just comment on the dry-sump engine part.. Corvette's have had a dry sump option since at least the C6 ZO6. I think the majority of C7 models are dry sump. Not exactly rocket surgery to change the oil in the C7, and I doubt GM made it more difficult on the C8.
 

Docscurlock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2018
Threads
17
Messages
1,472
Reaction score
780
Location
Florida
First Name
Doc
Vehicle(s)
2020 GT500, 2019 Roushcharged F150, 2016 GT350R, 2013 Boss 302LS, 2009 GT/CS, 2000 Cobra R, 1995 Cobra R
Vehicle Showcase
2
I'm a Mustang fanboi, and when I see a convertible Ecoboost Mustang the first thing I think is 'rental car' (esp. if there's a middle-aged couple in tourist in it). Also, the license plate holders and/or bumper stickers are a dead giveaway.
Yeah, whats wrong with that? I said when I was on vacation, they are a blast to drive, I am middle aged. I wouldn't waste the money on one to own it but they are fun to drive on vaca.
 

Stangnut

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2013
Threads
43
Messages
1,464
Reaction score
355
Location
S.E. Alabama
First Name
Jason
Vehicle(s)
2019 Bullitt BHG
I never thought I'd see the Challenger's numbers get so close to the Mustang's.
Mustang: 75,482
Camaros: 50,963
Challenger: 66,716

IMO, it's because of the Mustang's lack of low end torque. If the Camaro wasn't so big, ugly, and hard to see out of and the Challenger just wasn't so big (great styling, IMO) they would both out sell the Mustang. The average car buyer just doesn't realize how much they would like a lot of low end torque.
 

Sponsored

EcoVert

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 28, 2016
Threads
94
Messages
3,454
Reaction score
1,874
Location
W.VA
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost convertible
Vehicle Showcase
4
I never thought I'd see the Challenger's numbers get so close to the Mustang's.
Mustang: 75,482
Camaros: 50,963
Challenger: 66,716

IMO, it's because of the Mustang's lack of low end torque. If the Camaro wasn't so big, ugly, and hard to see out of and the Challenger just wasn't so big (great styling, IMO) they would both out sell the Mustang. The average car buyer just doesn't realize how much they would like a lot of low end torque.
It's not because of lack of low end torque it's because FCA advertises the hell out of Challenger if Ford would even do just half of the advertising Mustang sales would a lot higher
 

Hack

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2014
Threads
83
Messages
12,283
Reaction score
7,444
Location
Minneapolis
Vehicle(s)
Mustang, Camaro
Well, here's Automobile's Design Critic on the C8:

"I am deeply sorry to be severely disappointed by the styling of the C8. I hoped for something really new and exciting, not a boringly generic supercar, mostly indistinguishable from the many and varied unimaginative devices that show up regularly at the Geneva auto show. Its styling is confused. Downright messy, in fact. I count a dozen horizontal lines, not to mention four convoluted taillights, four nice rectangular exhaust tips, plus varied slots, vents, grilles, indented surfaces, and wing elements... just across the rear fascia. The front is no better, and the profile with its short, stumpy nose is equally surprising. Maybe it's all meant to look purposeful, but to me it seems just a careless, cluttered, graphic composition, not worthy of Corvette history and what we expect of this technically brilliant descendant of the elegant, Jaguar-inspired original C1 from 1953. I have no doubt this will be a very good car, with truly world-class performance coupled with American-style daily usefulness and (probably) easy servicing - dry-sump engines are not typical dealer shop fare. But I'd have liked to see some traces of the Astrovette or the four-rotor mid-engine concept from the Bill Mitchell era."

... via http://www.autoextremist.com/on-the-table1/
It's interesting to read this critique of the C8. So the author seems to be saying that past Corvettes have great designs, and then points to the original. I think the 60s 'vettes had really good designs too. But have the last 4 iterations of the Corvette been great? Or have they been even worse than the C8? I think the C8 design is significantly better than the last few iterations.

I think the Corvette is a great American sports car and it's an underdog in the V8 sports car world. It's inexpensive in that world, and the styling and construction reflect it. Don't get me wrong, like I said it's great, but it's still not a Ferrari or Lambo. And there are a lot of exciting "devices" that show up at Geneva. Corvette is exciting, but not as exciting as the Superfast 812, etc.

I would say the writer of this piece phoned it in.
 

HoosierDaddy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Threads
232
Messages
3,373
Reaction score
7,131
Location
Winchestertonfieldville (ok, Scottsdale), AZ
First Name
Randy
Vehicle(s)
2016 GT Premium PP
It's interesting to read this critique of the C8. So the author seems to be saying that past Corvettes have great designs, and then points to the original. I think the 60s 'vettes had really good designs too. But have the last 4 iterations of the Corvette been great? Or have they been even worse than the C8? I think the C8 design is significantly better than the last few iterations.
While I don't think the C8 looks are anything to write home about, they are decent and definitely better than the C7 which is almost cartoonish looking.
 

Strokerswild

Shallow and Pedantic
Joined
Nov 7, 2014
Threads
74
Messages
6,612
Reaction score
5,396
Location
Southern MN
First Name
Dave
Vehicle(s)
Things With Wheels
Cumberford has been a cranky old fart for years and criticizes just about everything now. I've been a subscriber for years and chuckle at his rants every time.

The C8 is the first GM car to come out in a couple decades that I really want to own.....there are a few things (the rear end mostly) that could use a tweak, but meh.
 

shogun32

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2019
Threads
89
Messages
14,607
Reaction score
12,097
Location
Northern VA
First Name
Matt
Vehicle(s)
'19 GT/PP, '23 GB Mach1, '12 Audi S5 (v8+6mt)
Vehicle Showcase
2
Styling is in the eye of the beholder. pre-80's were smooth curve'ish. Nowadays everything is a sharp-edged facet of many shapes all jumbled together. To "go fast" certain rules come to the fore and hard to argue away - you end up with a lot of ducting and orifices. Curves are more expensive to mold/pattern and manufacture.
Sponsored

 
 




Top