Who will swap for the new 7.3 V8!

[Fatguy]

So you are saying that because of potential high gas prices the big block is the way to go?

“The fat lady is singing - even for this thread as a spike in gasoline would kill the idea of the swap. It is what it is...”


Whatever made you think that after my last statement?


A spike in oil prices would make big displacement engines undesirable just like in the mid-1970s. I’m so old I remember those times. Lineups at the pumps and women selling sex to the gas jockeys for gas and jumping the line. It can happen again. Lack of demand for the V8s would mean no interest in the aftermarket for new engines like the 7.3. So the cost of running the engine goes up – but this would be a weekend car. No aftermarket support – and that would kill it right there. So worry and uncertainty equals high gas prices and kills the consumer and aftermarket for these engines. It could all end just like that anytime now…


But circumstances beyond your control can also kill or save ideas that are totally relevant and popular. One look at Elon Musk and the potential death spiral of Tesla is another. Right now he is almost on a losing battle to keep ownership of Tesla as the money is drying up. He can make it till the end of the year and then what? Well if the price of oil goes sky high he will find more backers to keep that ship afloat. I might be in on a Tesla again as they would stick around for a while.


But both examples are circumstances out of our control.

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[Erik427]

GM and Mopar both use much larger displacement engines.
Both get around the same fe or better than the 5.0, please explain why?

 

[tokuzumi]

7.0L in the Camaro Z/28 gets 13/19. However the Z06 gets 15/24 with the same engine. Most likely the difference is gearing between the two cars. Camaro is obviously heavier, and has a higher drag co-efficient.

 

[Big Boss]

Fair enough but that’s two production lines. A destroked Godzilla could take the Coyote’s place if demand eventually dropped. It could keep the V8 alive especially in the F150. Can’t see anyone complaining there about a pushrod.

Possibly, but it wouldn't be a big block they would have to make it a small block and really overhaul almost everything about it. I know you don't like listening to what the head of gas engines at Ford says about the 7.3 but he laid it out that its perfect for heavy duty applications because it won't hit their CAFE ratings. Not that the engine isn't capable but as constructed it would kill Ford CAFE ratings. They would need to decrease the displacement and add some sort of cylinder deactivation.

As much as I wish you were correct......LS/S550 swaps are becoming common.
Drag racing
Drifting
These are the two venues where you see this happening the most.

But it's not. Last time I was at the track, not one single Ford vehicle there was powered by an LS. Everything was Ford powered. And my local track just opened their drift pad. No LS Mustangs there either.

Buddy of mine was at Bradenton all weekend. I asked him inbetween runs to check out the scene there. Not 1 LS powered Mustang. All powered by Ford.

I do believe IRS is coming to the F-150 very soon.
There is at least one very complex Coyote getting ready to be revealed.
The 7.3 or a variant is being talked about.

Ford being able to stream line down to one engine family is possible.
6.2 and the 5.0 could be on the chopping block as far as the F Series is concerned.

If the Coyote is no longer offered in the F-150, it's only a matter of time before
the Mustang gets the 7.3 and hopefully in alloy form.

No it won't. Maybe something somewhat based off of the 7.3 but the 7.3 will not become the standard V8 in the Mustang or F-150. It would simply kill their CAFE ratings. Not saying they wouldn't be capable or great fits if tailored to each application like the 3.5TT is but government regulations are going to stop this from happening.

Show us these fucking links to these common s550 LS swaps. You're getting on my fucking nerves with your stupid bullshit.

Agree. the S550 is still fairly new, you would see all sorts of documentation of people doing this if it was common. In all my years of going to tracks, I had seen some LS Fox bodies. But actually racing no LS new edges, S197s or S550s.

Go to the races.......instead of the internet.
Look for yourself.
While there, please enjoy the sport and the people.

Have been, saw 0.

Bmacil, you know as well as I do that the LS is the overwhelming choice among racers.
This is for every reason that can be imagined.

As the S550 ages, ls swaps will become common place.
I don't supply links as stated before.......
Just go to the races instead of being a key board commando.

But I'm pretty sure you know I'm correct.

Won't ya come over to Yellow Bullet so we can discuss.
You know, that place where you're not the protected elite.
......or stay in your safe place......

All of this because a few guys want a engine with bottom end torque.

LS goes into everything because you can find them in junk yards dirt cheap. you can buy a junker, throw some heads, cam and exhaust on it and have yourself a nice street motor. That is the reason why. Even getting away from LS engines, GM engines are just cheaper to build.

A good friend of my dad's has built some incredible cars. The last two that he built were a 32 Ford Coupe, and a 32 Ford roadster. This is a guy who spared no expense in building these cars, but they had GM engines because Gm engines are cheap. the coupe had a 427 in it and the roadster had a 385 Fastburn crate motor.

Very funny, but back to the topic at hand...


If, in the near future, we end up with the Coyote discontinued (like my V6 - life will go on) - could we destroke the 7.3 Godzilla engine to a lesser displacement and keep the V8 engine alive in the F150 truck at least - and less possibly the Mustang. Anyone know if this is possible and if this is one way to dodge CAFE requirements?


As a lifetime V8 sort of guy, I need to know...

Like I mentioned earlier it would have to be really destroked and probably reconfigured into a small block package. The 7.3 is perfect for its intended purpose in heavy vehicles because the regulations are a bit lax on those.

GM and Mopar both use much larger displacement engines.
Both get around the same fe or better than the 5.0, please explain why?

Cylinder deactivation.

7.0L in the Camaro Z/28 gets 13/19. However the Z06 gets 15/24 with the same engine. Most likely the difference is gearing between the two cars. Camaro is obviously heavier, and has a higher drag co-efficient.

Bingo. The Z06 is I believe around 400 pounds lighter and aerodynamic like an arrow. the Z/28 has the aerodynamics of a brick

 

[Fatguy]

Possibly, but it wouldn't be a big block they would have to make it a small block and really overhaul almost everything about it. I know you don't like listening to what the head of gas engines at Ford says about the 7.3 but he laid it out that its perfect for heavy duty applications because it won't hit their CAFE ratings. Not that the engine isn't capable but as constructed it would kill Ford CAFE ratings. They would need to decrease the displacement and add some sort of cylinder deactivation.







No it won't. Maybe something somewhat based off of the 7.3 but the 7.3 will not become the standard V8 in the Mustang or F-150. It would simply kill their CAFE ratings. Not saying they wouldn't be capable or great fits if tailored to each application like the 3.5TT is but government regulations are going to stop this from happening.








Like I mentioned earlier it would have to be really destroked and probably reconfigured into a small block package. The 7.3 is perfect for its intended purpose in heavy vehicles because the regulations are a bit lax on those.



Cylinder deactivation.

But here is the interesting part.



Hackett is killing almost all sedans and CAFE has two tiers, one for cars and one for trucks. Cars have higher standards the smaller you go. Not having small cars to deal with for CAFE would seem to put Ford in a better situation to keep a V8 in the fleet.

If by big block you mean under 400 cubic inches this could me met and not be affected by CAFE. I don’t see anything that would keep you from using the same heavy block with a shorter stroke. CAFE goes by the size of the truck and not the physical (outside dimensions) size of the motor - from what I have read.


Hackett would be in on the cheap destroke as it keeps the V8 option in the F150 with just a few parts changes on the same line. That at least keeps a new V8 for enthusiasts for the next few years at Ford. But what do I know- anyone know?




https://www2.greencarreports.com/ne...s-you-should-know-about-gas-mileage-standards

 

[Big Boss]

But here is the interesting part.



Hackett is killing almost all sedans and CAFE has two tiers, one for cars and one for trucks. Cars have higher standards the smaller you go. Not having small cars to deal with for CAFE would seem to put Ford in a better situation to keep a V8 in the fleet.

If by big block you mean under 400 cubic inches this could me met and not be affected by CAFE. I don’t see anything that would keep you from using the same heavy block with a shorter stroke. CAFE goes by the size of the truck and not the physical (outside dimensions) size of the motor - from what I have read.


Hackett would be in on the cheap destroke as it keeps the V8 option in the F150 with just a few parts changes on the same line. That at least keeps a new V8 for enthusiasts for the next few years at Ford. But what do I know- anyone know?




https://www2.greencarreports.com/ne...s-you-should-know-about-gas-mileage-standards

You are correct but it also goes by all the cars or trucks in the portfolio. So the Mustang will no longer have the Fiesta/Focus/Fusion to offset it. So that puts the Mustang under a bit tighter constraints even though it is a larger vehicle IIRC.

As far as the F-150 yes it doesn't go by the size of the block. What I was getting at, was that it if it was still a 7.3 it would hurt the cafe ratings, because it would not be as efficient as the current offerings. Ford themselves said this. they don't have to worry about that in the heavy duty vehicles.

It would be a bit more then just changing the bore and stroke. they would most likely need to add some sort of cylinder deactivation, as well as basically redesign the whole engine. As it is built now, it will be suited for 250/350/450 and motor homes where it could be subject to constantyl being under heavy payloads, heavy towing much more than the F-150 is capable off. So they would need to reassess the engine to make it fit the application of the F-150.

the F-150 is the cash cow at Ford. Even though V-8 demand is dropping, I can't see Ford not offering a V-8 in the F-150 because they would lose some of those buyers that have to have a V-8. So it is possible that maybe in the future they completely change up the 7.3 and use its base a new V-8 but the engine would need a lot of reworking to be a viable option in the F-150

 

[GT Pony]

It would be a bit more then just changing the bore and stroke. they would most likely need to add some sort of cylinder deactivation ...

GM has been using cylinder deactivation on all their V8s for a while ... that's why they get a decent fuel mileage rating for their displacement.

 

[Erik427]

I'm betting the heads on the 7.3 are the best flowing two valve style from Ford ever.

 

[Erik427]

You are correct but it also goes by all the cars or trucks in the portfolio. So the Mustang will no longer have the Fiesta/Focus/Fusion to offset it. So that puts the Mustang under a bit tighter constraints even though it is a larger vehicle IIRC.

As far as the F-150 yes it doesn't go by the size of the block. What I was getting at, was that it if it was still a 7.3 it would hurt the cafe ratings, because it would not be as efficient as the current offerings. Ford themselves said this. they don't have to worry about that in the heavy duty vehicles.

It would be a bit more then just changing the bore and stroke. they would most likely need to add some sort of cylinder deactivation, as well as basically redesign the whole engine. As it is built now, it will be suited for 250/350/450 and motor homes where it could be subject to constantyl being under heavy payloads, heavy towing much more than the F-150 is capable off. So they would need to reassess the engine to make it fit the application of the F-150.

the F-150 is the cash cow at Ford. Even though V-8 demand is dropping, I can't see Ford not offering a V-8 in the F-150 because they would lose some of those buyers that have to have a V-8. So it is possible that maybe in the future they completely change up the 7.3 and use its base a new V-8 but the engine would need a lot of reworking to be a viable option in the F-150

7.3 has cylinder deactivation.

 

[Fatguy]

Hummm...


I thought this thread fell off page one. Certain death! Anyway, the Godzilla story is just beginning. This is an exciting motor that on the surface makes no sense. But sense it does!


Kudos for Ford engineering for making a motor by reasoning, without prejudice - and see how the tried and true mechanics came back to haunt the last V8 ever made by Ford. Great stuff and a great story!!!!!

 

[Erik427]

Hey, I'm betting the 7.3 will be a engine of great desire once the specs are fully known.

Don't really care about the hp/tq......very conservative 87 octane tune.

Waiting for the tuners to run it with a 93 octane tune or E-85.

I just lit Facebook up about this engine on several groups.

 

[Fatguy]

Hey, I'm betting the 7.3 will be a engine of great desire once the specs are fully known.

Don't really care about the hp/tq......very conservative 87 octane tune.

Waiting for the tuners to run it with a 93 octane tune or E-85.

I just lit Facebook up about this engine on several groups.

It’s just a solid old-fashioned engine built to last. Nothing wrong with that. Nice to see tried and true designs make it to the end of the V8 run. We shall see how it really is this fall. I’ll let this thread go where it wants now - It’s your thread now. I’m tired of all the personal bashing you have to take just for liking an old-fashioned engine. And I have other things to attend to. I wrote a paragraph that was below about the name calling, labeling and such that goes on in this thread. I’m a hard nose free speech guy, but some of you... But whatever... Goodnight and thanks for participating in this thread.

 

[GT Pony]

I highly doubt Ford is going to completely drop the V8 in the Mustang as long as the competition is still running V8s. The day Mustang is manufactured without a V8 is the day a lot of guys go buy different cars that still offer a V8.

 

[Big Boss]

7.3 has cylinder deactivation.

It does NOT have cylinder deactivation or at least won't have it initially

"There is a cam phaser on the single in-block cam. It's a simple fixed-overlap kind like those found on GM Small Block and FCA Hemi V-8s, not the Mechadyne DuoCam setup that provides for separate intake and exhaust timing variability like the one used on the DodgeViper. It can rotate the cam up to 60 degrees. Advancing overall timing improves low-end/light-load torque and fuel economy; retarding it at high speeds improves horsepower. Cylinder deactivation will not be available at launch but could be added "

https://www.motortrend.com/news/11-powertrain-points-2020-ford-f-series-super-duty/

 

[Erik427]

It does NOT have cylinder deactivation or at least won't have it initially

"There is a cam phaser on the single in-block cam. It's a simple fixed-overlap kind like those found on GM Small Block and FCA Hemi V-8s, not the Mechadyne DuoCam setup that provides for separate intake and exhaust timing variability like the one used on the DodgeViper. It can rotate the cam up to 60 degrees. Advancing overall timing improves low-end/light-load torque and fuel economy; retarding it at high speeds improves horsepower. Cylinder deactivation will not be available at launch but could be added "

https://www.motortrend.com/news/11-powertrain-points-2020-ford-f-series-super-duty/

I stand corrected.....some other media outlets have stated wrong.
Not a fan of cylinder deactivation......nothing but a headache.

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