"Entry Level" Performance 2020 Mustang Coming -- Mustang ST?

[Excel]

Ford is diluting the model like they do often
so now you have so many versions even the mustang
regulars cant keep up. Same as what they do with the F150

Sponsored

 

[Cobra Jet]

Doesn't matter what you call it,ANY Mustang with a 4 or 6 Banger in it is NOT a performance Mustang,just a wanna be,and when Ford makes one with batteries that will be even worse,maybe they can name it the MTS Mattel toy special !!

Either you’re very new to the Mustang Community and Ownership of one - or you’re blatantly oblivious as to the Mustang’s history and lineage...

Your beloved Mustang originated in 1962 and had a 4cyl that Dan Gurney tested at speeds of 120mph. The Mustang NEVER started out with a V8 (or a 6cyl).

Here’s an awesome design vid of Mustang 1 for those who never seen it:


Oh and the original SVO... so again, you’re totally oblivious to Mustang....

The SVO (84-86) brought the following FIRSTS to the modern day Mustang - BEFORE your beloved “GT” even had such production parts:

1) 5-lug hubs with all wheel ventilated disc brakes
A) The GT did not get 5-lugs until 1994
B) The GT did not get all wheel disc brakes until 1994

2) Dual exhaust was debuted with the 85 SVO
The GT followed with getting the same dual exhaust in 1985

3) 16” rims
The GT didn’t get any wheel larger than 15” until 1991

4) Fuel injection 1984
The SVO was the first Mustang to be fuel injected and had an advanced fuel injected engine management system. The GT didn’t get true EFI until 1986.

5) User Adjustable Fuel Trim (all 84-86 SVO)
The GT has never had this option at all. In fact no Mustang has had such a feature - UNTIL the 2015 Mustang debuted with the “mode” switches. The new mode switches are similar in design as when switching to Sport mode, the fuel trim and timing is adjusted based on the PCM mapping (same concept debuted in the 1984 SVO).

6) Aero headlamps
GT didn’t get aero headlamps until 1987

7) HURST shifter
This was a factory installed shifter into the SVO - the GT’s never came with anything other than “stock” parts until the more modern S197’s were being offered with different specialty “packages”.

8) KONI adjustable suspension (struts/shocks)
Name a modern FACTORY produced GT after 1984 that came with KONIs.

9) Leather wrapped steering wheel
GT first leather wrapped wheel - 1990

10) 3.45 and 3.73 factory equipped rear gearing
GT didn’t get any rear gearing close to the SVO, until the 3.55 offering in 2005.

11) “Competition Prep”
Only SVO had this option package. No other Mustang had such a package where the buyer could select a package that deleted items for sake of “racing in mind”. The only factory “delete” packages came later with the 1993 and 1995 Cobra R.

12) HP
The 1984 Mustang matched the HP of the 1984 GT with 4 less cylinders. Later years (85-86), the SVO was within 5 HP of the GT (that was on paper due to Govt regulations.


Fact 1:
The SVO had equivalent or better factory 1/4 mile times than the GT of the same time period (1984-1986).

Fact 2:
The SVO was not designed as a drag racer. It was designed to compete with equivalent Auto-X and Road Racing vehicles of the time period AND to give Buyers the looks/feel of Euro models of the time.

Fact 3:
The only reason the SVO did not outsell the same period GT was NOT because of HP or lack of a “V8”. It had poor sales due to the fact Ford poorly marketed the vehicle AND Dealership Sales people were not adequately trained on all of the SVO’s advancements, equipment and performance that met or exceeded the same found in a GT. This is facts, NOT internet BS, so take it as you want to twist it.

You can slam the 4-cyl Mustang or future E-Mustangs all you want - the facts are that many of the features found in today’s Mustangs were derived from the SVO platform.

Also so you and others know - I’m not SVO or EB biased - I’ve owned 20 Mustangs to date including my current 2018 EB and my 94 Cobra. Out of those other 18, only (2) were SVO’s, the others were all V8’s. I get the whole “V8” thug mentality, but when people come into a thread spewing nothing but a shit statement with no facts, they deserve to be schooled.

Peace fellas...

 

[shogun32]

Then you can hear that awesome startup time and again.

Whatever happened to that old saw about "the worst thing you can do to an engine is start it".
And E-Mustang might be "interesting" but IMO do that s**t on the Fiesta/Focus and leave the 'stang to us unrepentant consumers of rotten dinosaur flesh.

Obviously it's heresy but maybe plop the current EB but with front-wheel drive and then use electric to drive the rears ? AWD keeps getting more common. though flipping that around and adding motors to the fronts and leaving the car rear-drive probably makes a lot more engineering sense. It wouldn't even need to be full-time electric, just on launch or to help with balance and stability or during all-out performance modes.

 

[TicTocTach]

Just as long as the engine turns off at every intersection. That’s the ticket.

Then you can hear that awesome startup time and again.

AND it would be partial zero emissions... PZEV!

 

[Dave TBG]

Doesn't matter what you call it,ANY Mustang with a 4 or 6 Banger in it is NOT a performance Mustang,just a wanna be,and when Ford makes one with batteries that will be even worse,maybe they can name it the MTS Mattel toy special !!

I'm not sure you've thought this through. One needs only to look at a car's performance to designate it as a performance car or whatever other category you might want to put it into. If the 4 and 6 cylinder Mustangs aren't performance cars, logically, any car that can't out-perform the 4 and 6 cylinder cars must not be performance cars. This would include almost every GT built in the first 4 generations.

 

[Dave TBG]

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/th...-2-3l-ecoboost-to-2020-mustang-lineup.117394/

Here's the new engine, I saw somewhere that this could be paired with the GT's PP2...

 

[Steeda23]

I suspect this just comes down to simple economics. If all things were equal and the cost of purchase and ownership was identical (price, insurance, maintenance, gas mileage, etc), how many people would really choose the 4 or 6 cylinder over a GT? If you are on this forum, my expectation is none of you. We do live in the real world though and things like purchase price, gas, insurance and maintenance do compund and add up so it is good that there are options for people either unable or unwilling to dedicate that much of their monthly income to a depreciating asset. Personally, it is worth the extra expense for the GT in exchange for the fun and enjoyment I get in return (plus the fact that V8s may not be around much longer in anything but super high dollar stuff) but 4 cylinder turbos have come a long way in the last decade. My wife has an Audi S3 and I really enjoy driving that as well since it seems to punch above its weight class and is fun to drive too. I have also rented V6 Mustangs on some business trips and it is a nice overall engine with ample power and smooth delivery so it is a shame that Ford doesnt offer the 3 options anymore.

 

[w3rkn]

I don't care.... give me a SVO.

 

[99Zeus99]

I don't get why anyone would buy a Mustang without a V8. There are many other cars with 4 cyl turbos, much lighter and smaller, AWD etc. If the demand is for something non Mustang like, make a new car with a new name. Let the Mustang die and start anew. Those who want a poser Mustang don't appreciate the history. Just make another car with another name.

 

[99Zeus99]

Either you’re very new to the Mustang Community and Ownership of one - or you’re blatantly oblivious as to the Mustang’s history and lineage...

Your beloved Mustang originated in 1962 and had a 4cyl that Dan Gurney tested at speeds of 120mph. The Mustang NEVER started out with a V8 (or a 6cyl).

Here’s an awesome design vid of Mustang 1 for those who never seen it:


Oh and the original SVO... so again, you’re totally oblivious to Mustang....

The SVO (84-86) brought the following FIRSTS to the modern day Mustang - BEFORE your beloved “GT” even had such production parts:

1) 5-lug hubs with all wheel ventilated disc brakes
A) The GT did not get 5-lugs until 1994
B) The GT did not get all wheel disc brakes until 1994

2) Dual exhaust was debuted with the 85 SVO
The GT followed with getting the same dual exhaust in 1985

3) 16” rims
The GT didn’t get any wheel larger than 15” until 1991

4) Fuel injection 1984
The SVO was the first Mustang to be fuel injected and had an advanced fuel injected engine management system. The GT didn’t get true EFI until 1986.

5) User Adjustable Fuel Trim (all 84-86 SVO)
The GT has never had this option at all. In fact no Mustang has had such a feature - UNTIL the 2015 Mustang debuted with the “mode” switches. The new mode switches are similar in design as when switching to Sport mode, the fuel trim and timing is adjusted based on the PCM mapping (same concept debuted in the 1984 SVO).

6) Aero headlamps
GT didn’t get aero headlamps until 1987

7) HURST shifter
This was a factory installed shifter into the SVO - the GT’s never came with anything other than “stock” parts until the more modern S197’s were being offered with different specialty “packages”.

8) KONI adjustable suspension (struts/shocks)
Name a modern FACTORY produced GT after 1984 that came with KONIs.

9) Leather wrapped steering wheel
GT first leather wrapped wheel - 1990

10) 3.45 and 3.73 factory equipped rear gearing
GT didn’t get any rear gearing close to the SVO, until the 3.55 offering in 2005.

11) “Competition Prep”
Only SVO had this option package. No other Mustang had such a package where the buyer could select a package that deleted items for sake of “racing in mind”. The only factory “delete” packages came later with the 1993 and 1995 Cobra R.

12) HP
The 1984 Mustang matched the HP of the 1984 GT with 4 less cylinders. Later years (85-86), the SVO was within 5 HP of the GT (that was on paper due to Govt regulations.


Fact 1:
The SVO had equivalent or better factory 1/4 mile times than the GT of the same time period (1984-1986).

Fact 2:
The SVO was not designed as a drag racer. It was designed to compete with equivalent Auto-X and Road Racing vehicles of the time period AND to give Buyers the looks/feel of Euro models of the time.

Fact 3:
The only reason the SVO did not outsell the same period GT was NOT because of HP or lack of a “V8”. It had poor sales due to the fact Ford poorly marketed the vehicle AND Dealership Sales people were not adequately trained on all of the SVO’s advancements, equipment and performance that met or exceeded the same found in a GT. This is facts, NOT internet BS, so take it as you want to twist it.

You can slam the 4-cyl Mustang or future E-Mustangs all you want - the facts are that many of the features found in today’s Mustangs were derived from the SVO platform.

Also so you and others know - I’m not SVO or EB biased - I’ve owned 20 Mustangs to date including my current 2018 EB and my 94 Cobra. Out of those other 18, only (2) were SVO’s, the others were all V8’s. I get the whole “V8” thug mentality, but when people come into a thread spewing nothing but a shit statement with no facts, they deserve to be schooled.

Peace fellas...

Any douche can Google a bunch of stuff and paste it. The bottom line is, when anyone thinks "Mustang" they think of only a few cars and only one is missing a V8. (1965) When people think AR-15 they don't think .222 Remington or AR-10, they think Colt, Stoner, 5.56mm. Lots of variants and predecessors but citing all the shit nobody cares about doesn't impress anyone.

 

[Dave TBG]

I don't get why anyone would buy a Mustang without a V8. There are many other cars with 4 cyl turbos, much lighter and smaller, AWD etc. If the demand is for something non Mustang like, make a new car with a new name. Let the Mustang die and start anew. Those who want a poser Mustang don't appreciate the history. Just make another car with another name.

Maybe for the same reason that people still bought a 302 back in the late 60's, when they could have had a big block instead. In my case, 310/350 is plenty of hp/tq for my daily driver, and, as soon as I get a chance to install that big pile of parts in my living room I'll be able to out-perform a stock GT in the corners without thinking about it.
That, and my criteria was: ~300 hp, manual trans and rear wheel drive. Now if you'd asked why anyone would buy a Mustang with an automatic, I'd be stumped.

 

[EcoVert]

I don't get why anyone would buy a Mustang without a V8. There are many other cars with 4 cyl turbos, much lighter and smaller, AWD etc. If the demand is for something non Mustang like, make a new car with a new name. Let the Mustang die and start anew. Those who want a poser Mustang don't appreciate the history. Just make another car with another name.

The EcoBoost Mustang has more HP than any factory Mustang GT made before 2010 and only 5 less HP than the 2010 GT

 

[bluebeastsrt]

Either you’re very new to the Mustang Community and Ownership of one - or you’re blatantly oblivious as to the Mustang’s history and lineage...

Your beloved Mustang originated in 1962 and had a 4cyl that Dan Gurney tested at speeds of 120mph. The Mustang NEVER started out with a V8 (or a 6cyl).

Here’s an awesome design vid of Mustang 1 for those who never seen it:


Oh and the original SVO... so again, you’re totally oblivious to Mustang....

The SVO (84-86) brought the following FIRSTS to the modern day Mustang - BEFORE your beloved “GT” even had such production parts:

1) 5-lug hubs with all wheel ventilated disc brakes
A) The GT did not get 5-lugs until 1994
B) The GT did not get all wheel disc brakes until 1994

2) Dual exhaust was debuted with the 85 SVO
The GT followed with getting the same dual exhaust in 1985

3) 16” rims
The GT didn’t get any wheel larger than 15” until 1991

4) Fuel injection 1984
The SVO was the first Mustang to be fuel injected and had an advanced fuel injected engine management system. The GT didn’t get true EFI until 1986.

5) User Adjustable Fuel Trim (all 84-86 SVO)
The GT has never had this option at all. In fact no Mustang has had such a feature - UNTIL the 2015 Mustang debuted with the “mode” switches. The new mode switches are similar in design as when switching to Sport mode, the fuel trim and timing is adjusted based on the PCM mapping (same concept debuted in the 1984 SVO).

6) Aero headlamps
GT didn’t get aero headlamps until 1987

7) HURST shifter
This was a factory installed shifter into the SVO - the GT’s never came with anything other than “stock” parts until the more modern S197’s were being offered with different specialty “packages”.

8) KONI adjustable suspension (struts/shocks)
Name a modern FACTORY produced GT after 1984 that came with KONIs.

9) Leather wrapped steering wheel
GT first leather wrapped wheel - 1990

10) 3.45 and 3.73 factory equipped rear gearing
GT didn’t get any rear gearing close to the SVO, until the 3.55 offering in 2005.

11) “Competition Prep”
Only SVO had this option package. No other Mustang had such a package where the buyer could select a package that deleted items for sake of “racing in mind”. The only factory “delete” packages came later with the 1993 and 1995 Cobra R.

12) HP
The 1984 Mustang matched the HP of the 1984 GT with 4 less cylinders. Later years (85-86), the SVO was within 5 HP of the GT (that was on paper due to Govt regulations.


Fact 1:
The SVO had equivalent or better factory 1/4 mile times than the GT of the same time period (1984-1986).

Fact 2:
The SVO was not designed as a drag racer. It was designed to compete with equivalent Auto-X and Road Racing vehicles of the time period AND to give Buyers the looks/feel of Euro models of the time.

Fact 3:
The only reason the SVO did not outsell the same period GT was NOT because of HP or lack of a “V8”. It had poor sales due to the fact Ford poorly marketed the vehicle AND Dealership Sales people were not adequately trained on all of the SVO’s advancements, equipment and performance that met or exceeded the same found in a GT. This is facts, NOT internet BS, so take it as you want to twist it.

You can slam the 4-cyl Mustang or future E-Mustangs all you want - the facts are that many of the features found in today’s Mustangs were derived from the SVO platform.

Also so you and others know - I’m not SVO or EB biased - I’ve owned 20 Mustangs to date including my current 2018 EB and my 94 Cobra. Out of those other 18, only (2) were SVO’s, the others were all V8’s. I get the whole “V8” thug mentality, but when people come into a thread spewing nothing but a shit statement with no facts, they deserve to be schooled.

Peace fellas...

Cripps. Id rather read war and piece. Than this novel.

 

[Hinzel]

I don't get why anyone would buy a Mustang without a V8. There are many other cars with 4 cyl turbos, much lighter and smaller, AWD etc. If the demand is for something non Mustang like, make a new car with a new name. Let the Mustang die and start anew. Those who want a poser Mustang don't appreciate the history. Just make another car with another name.

for me it was cost. there are other comparable cars, performance wise, to the EB mustang. but with dealer discounts and stuff it was a good 3 - 5k cheaper than other cars (WRX, a4, 328i, etc, etc...). also, i've always wanted a stang and think the s550 is a great looking car

 

[NoVaGT]

....when people come into a thread spewing nothing but a shit statement with no facts, they deserve to be schooled....

SVO stands for Spock Vengeance Operations.

The engine wasn't a 2.3........it was a PINTO engine.

It had magnetorheological shocks too. Super hush-hush stuff, NASA was involved.

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