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SCT Must stop selling tuners after EPA...

Face

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For those who are interested: Derive Email Blasted this out to a lot of vendors this week...

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Today, Derive Systems announces reaching an agreement with EPA to establish and comply with automotive aftermarket regulations.

The EPA agreement is very positive for our business. With this agreement in place, Derive has established itself as the only federally-compliant player in the tuning industry. Every company in the aftermarket will be held to the same standard as Derive.

Under the agreement, we will make investments to demonstrate environmental leadership in the automotive aftermarket industry.These include: additional emissions tests of our preloaded calibrations on new and past model year applications, developing additional training and certification programs for our custom tuning dealers, continuing to make and sell emissions compliant devices, and further investing in our policy compliance initiatives.

Please take note that:

  • Every product we sell today is legal. We are permitted to, and will continue selling, our existing tuners and Advantage software.
  • There is no need for resellers or consumers to return or swap out anything on shelves today, nor is a recall required.
  • For users of our Advantage custom tuning software, we are forming our certification and training program now, and will share those details directly with you once we’re finished.
Derive Systems, SCT, and Bully Dog remain leaders in the automotive aftermarket and will continue to provide the most advanced technology to our enthusiast consumers, dealers, and resellers.

Read our press release here.

Q: Why did Derive settle?

A: Collaborating with EPA on a settlement allows us to provide market-leading tuners and creates certainty for our customers.

· Customers continue to expect innovation and results, but no customer wants to buy regulatory uncertainty or an EPA enforcement action.

· Unlike our competitors, we have a clear path forward for our products to enter and thrive in the market with EPA’s approval.

Q: Why is Derive paying a penalty?

A: Derive was formed only a few years ago from the purchases of two tuning companies, SCT and Bully Dog.

· Our new company’s management discovered legacy compliance issues with some Bully Dog products that were hidden during the transaction.

· We expect this settlement to wipe the slate clean with EPA on these legacy issues.

· We will continue to pursue the former owners of Bully Dog and others who committed fraud and other wrongdoing as part of our purchase.

Q: Did Derive sell defeat devices?

A: No, Derive did not sell defeat devices.

· Derive bought Bully Dog and SCT only a few years ago. After the transaction, we discovered legacy compliance issues, particularly on the Bully Dog side. We continue to pursue claims arising from that transaction.

· In the meantime, Derive entered into this agreement to provide a clear and certain path to continue selling tuners and custom software in partnership with EPA.

Q: How did EPA come up with the 363,000 figure for tuner sales?

A: That question is best put to EPA. Our focus is on the fact that the settlement provides a clear path to continue selling our tuner and custom tuning software products and to continue to introduce those products to market. No other company has this kind of partnership with EPA, which allows to continue providing market-leading performance tuners and custom software, while avoiding regulatory and enforcement uncertainty for our customers.

Q: The settlement states that the penalty is based on Derive’s financial condition [or a limited ability to pay]. Is the company in financial trouble?

A: No, the settlement reflects the fact that Derive is committing a substantial amount to building out its partnership with EPA in this settlement.

Q: Does the settlement require Derive to recall any tuners from its customers or stop selling any tuners?

A: No, it does not. Unlike past EPA tuning settlements, there are no recall terms in the settlement for our products in the market. We are required to test tuners going forward. If the testing reveals issues, we will deal with those issues in an appropriate manner, in consultation with EPA.

Q: Does the settlement require Derive to stop selling custom software?

A: No, it does not. Our settlement partnership with EPA requires us to provide customer training and certification that encourages the legitimate use of our custom tuning software.

Q: Will the settlement require Derive to change its marketing practices or reseller agreements for tuners?

A: From a customer perspective, there will be little change. Derive was not marketing any illegitimate uses of its products before the settlement. And we already have a vigorous compliance program to avoid customer abuse of our products. The settlement memorializes what are already industry best practices.

If you have any additional questions, please feel free to contact your Account Manager. For press inquiries, please contact [email protected]

Thank you for your continued support.


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4150 Church St. | Suite 1024 | Sanford, FL 33227
Contact us: 940-783-9914 or Visit us online: SCTFlash.com


© 2018 Derive Systems®. All rights reserved. GTX®, BDX®, X4®, LivewireTS®, Bully Dog GT®, powered by DERIVE™, SCT PERFORMANCE®, BULLY DOG® and the SCT ®and Bully Dog logo® are trademarks or registered trademarks of Derive Systems.

SCT Performance 4150 CHURCH ST. Suite 1024 SANFORD Florida 32771 United States

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The_Phantom

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You realize you can just pay someone off to inspect your car right? How do you think people with illegal tint get by?

I'm not saying I do this, but some people do. Probably against the forum rules to talk about cheating emissions too.
You realize that is, quite literally, IMPOSSIBLE to do anymore, don't you?

Let me tell you how it works now:

In Texas, the car is plugged into an inspection station via OBDII. That station reads the car and reports the data straight to the DMV. There is NO TECHNICIAN INPUT whatsoever in the process. The technician can not falsify the data.

This was changed a couple of years back due to those under-the-table inspection dealings. You can not buy your way around it anymore, and there is no bypass. Period.

Illegal tint would be detected on the visual inspection, which is still done. BUT the emissions systems check is 100% automated and can not be falsified. It is tied to the VIN number of the car being inspected. I set up this system for a list of GM dealerships about 4 years ago and it is totally fail proof.

So, like I said, you WILL fail emissions testing with the rear 02's turned off.

Some additional info:

https://www.dps.texas.gov/rsd/vi/Misc/faq/faq_obdii.htm#SystemsChecked
 

Ebm

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Q: Why is Derive paying a penalty?

A: Derive was formed only a few years ago from the purchases of two tuning companies, SCT and Bully Dog.

· Our new company’s management discovered legacy compliance issues with some Bully Dog products that were hidden during the transaction.

· We expect this settlement to wipe the slate clean with EPA on these legacy issues.

· We will continue to pursue the former owners of Bully Dog and others who committed fraud and other wrongdoing as part of our purchase.

Q: Did Derive sell defeat devices?

A: No, Derive did not sell defeat devices.

· Derive bought Bully Dog and SCT only a few years ago. After the transaction, we discovered legacy compliance issues, particularly on the Bully Dog side. We continue to pursue claims arising from that transaction.

· In the meantime, Derive entered into this agreement to provide a clear and certain path to continue selling tuners and custom software in partnership with EPA.

People with Bully Dog tuners, aka asshats that blow black smoke everywhere in their lifted trucks





You realize that is, quite literally, IMPOSSIBLE to do anymore, don't you?

Let me tell you how it works now:

In Texas, the car is plugged into an inspection station. That station reads the car and reports the data straight to the DMV. There is NO TECHNICIAN INPUT whatsoever in the process. The technician can not falsify the data.

This was changed a couple of years back due to those under-the-table inspection dealings. You can not buy your way around it anymore, and there is no bypass. Period.

Illegal tint would be detected on the visual inspection, which is still done. BUT the emissions systems check is 100% automated and can not be falsified. It is tied to the VIN number of the car being inspected. I set up this system for a list of GM dealerships about 4 years ago and it is totally fail proof.

So, like I said, you WILL fail emissions testing with the rear 02's turned off.
You are technically correct. You WILL fail emissions testing with the rear 02s turned off. But passing emissions isn't hard. Tuners can hard code certain emissions requirements to pass emissions testing. How do you think cars with no cats pass emissions? Trust me, I work with computers all day. They aren't that hard to fool.
 

The_Phantom

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You are technically correct. You WILL fail emissions testing with the rear 02s turned off. But passing emissions isn't hard. Tuners can hard code certain emissions requirements to pass emissions testing. How do you think cars with no cats pass emissions? Trust me, I work with computers all day. They aren't that hard to fool.
I have a Masters Degree in Computer Science and Information Systems and held a top-level position for General Motors. I know exactly how these systems work. If you think you're going to slap some code on a tuner and bypass it, you're dead wrong. It does not work that way.

Computers are not hard to fool. However, this is different. BUT...don't take my word for it.

You're allowed 1 system to be set to "Not Ready". If you have no cats, then you want your Catalyst system to be that system. However, that means your 02's, and likely your 02 heaters and possibly your Evap, are going to fail.

I love how guys act like it's so easy to get past emissions tests. Then you see their thread "Can't pass inspection - HELP!!!!" when the time comes.
 

Dusten

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You make it sound like a tuner can tune out harmful emissions without catalytic converters on the car. I hope you know this is impossible. I'd hate for someone who didn't know better to mistake this information.

My truck, with zero cats, passed washington emissions.
Washington allows for 1 emissions system to show as not ready(rear o2's).
Washington emission standards for tailpipe emissions are identical to california.

Look, I've been playing the tuned vehicle game for almost 20 years. I know how this shit works.
 

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Ebm

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I have a Masters Degree in Computer Science and Information Systems and held a top-level position for General Motors. I know exactly how these systems work. If you think you're going to slap some code on a tuner and bypass it, you're dead wrong. It does not work that way.

Computers are not hard to fool. However, this is different. BUT...don't take my word for it.

You're allowed 1 system to be set to "Not Ready". If you have no cats, then you want your Catalyst system to be that system. However, that means your 02's, and likely your 02 heaters and possibly your Evap, are going to fail.

I love how guys act like it's so easy to get past emissions tests. Then you see their thread "Can't pass inspection - HELP!!!!" when the time comes.

This isn't a justification thread, no need to tout your qualifications lol. But I'm happy for you that you're so well educated. Thinking that you know more than someone because you held a high position at a company or because you have multiple degrees? Those are the guys I don't trust the most. But I digress, I know it's possible because I've seen cars pass with no cats and a tune. Not a problem. I can't legally say who owned those cars because it's against forum rules to partake in cheating emissions.
 

Dr. Norts

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As of April 2019 we don't have emission testing anymore up here in Ontario, Canada

Just move up here ;)
 

SiMuL

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My truck, with zero cats, passed washington emissions.
Washington allows for 1 emissions system to show as not ready(rear o2's).
Washington emission standards for tailpipe emissions are identical to california.

Look, I've been playing the tuned vehicle game for almost 20 years. I know how this shit works.
That's because your tuner disabled the rear o2, as should be done with no cats. It sounded like your original point was arguing that you didn't need to disable the rear o2's. If that wasn't what you meant, disregard my reply. I've been in this game a good while, myself! :)
 

Dusten

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That's because your tuner disabled the rear o2, as should be done with no cats. It sounded like your original point was arguing that you didn't need to disable the rear o2's. If that wasn't what you meant, disregard my reply. I've been in this game a good while, myself! :)

You said disabling them was lazy. I said in certain cases its the best option, as opposed to MIL's.
I then stated you can pass emissions with them off, and with no cats. If the tune is good. You can also have your tuner do an emissions tune that leans the vehicle out and run it just for testing. We do this a lot with diesels to get them to pass opacity tests.
 

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The_Phantom

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This isn't a justification thread, no need to tout your qualifications lol. But I'm happy for you that you're so well educated. Thinking that you know more than someone because you held a high position at a company or because you have multiple degrees? Those are the guys I don't trust the most. But I digress, I know it's possible because I've seen cars pass with no cats and a tune. Not a problem. I can't legally say who owned those cars because it's against forum rules to partake in cheating emissions.
No need to get butthurt bud. I don't need to justify anything to you or anyone else.

Just thought you might like FACTUAL information from someone involved in programming the software. But that's cool. You do you.

Not trusting people who are more educated on specific items than you and assuming you know everything should get you far.
 

Ebm

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No need to get butthurt bud. I don't need to justify anything to you or anyone else.

Just thought you might like FACTUAL information from someone involved in programming the software. But that's cool. You do you.

Not trusting people who are more educated on specific items than you and assuming you know everything should get you far.
Thank you for gracing me with your wisdom master. I'm just a mere mortal. What do I know...
 

The_Phantom

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Thank you for gracing me with your wisdom master. I'm just a mere mortal. What do I know...
Are you 16 or what?

Try to actually contribute something to the forum when you post.
 

Blue Moon

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People who think they know everything bug the crap out of those of us who do.
 

SiMuL

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You said disabling them was lazy. I said in certain cases its the best option, as opposed to MIL's.
I then stated you can pass emissions with them off, and with no cats. If the tune is good. You can also have your tuner do an emissions tune that leans the vehicle out and run it just for testing. We do this a lot with diesels to get them to pass opacity tests.
Honest mix-up, that wasn't me who said it was lazy. ;) I agree that disabling them is the best option. No point having a sensor for something that isn't there.
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