2018 GT vs 2016 Camaro - Track Times Compared w/Video

[millhouse]

You call that a pro record.:lol::headbonk:

Man, it's awesome we have someone such as yourself that is able to look at a drivers credentials and (despite common knowledge) make an alternative basis on his skill-set. :clap2:

Remind me, what are your credentials?

Good read.

http://news.carjunky.com/how_stuff_works/what-is-a-supercar-cde917.shtml

"The Chevrolet Corvette Z06 for example, is considered a supercar by many some of its acceleration, handling and speed to weight ratio."

My favorite line. Well written of course!

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[02gtnh]

Man, it's awesome we have someone such as yourself that is able to look at a drivers credentials and (despite common knowledge) make an alternative basis on his skill-set. :clap2:

Remind me, what are your credentials?



"The Chevrolet Corvette Z06 for example, is considered a supercar by many some of its acceleration, handling and speed to weight ratio."

My favorite line. Well written of course!

The funny part is you think Mero is just as fast as Billy Johnson. That shows real wisdom. How many races and championships has Mero won? Mero is a very good racer, but he is no pro racer like Johnson.

As far as supercar goes, the article I showed is better then your blog you showed.

 

[jake_zx2]

No disagreement there. But I thought we are on a thread about "Track Times Compared", not an "elegance" thread.
Sure, but if you want to take that approach, then we're in a thread about mustangs and camaros, so why are you bringing up corvettes?
You may find it hard to believe, but a number of people (increasing every year) buy sports cars intending to take them to the track regularly (road course), since that is the ONLY way the performance of these cars can safely and legally be explored.
Sure, but they're still the minority
Who cares what the performance and handling of a GT, GT350, PP2 or whatever is if you are not going to track it. It is like having a gorgeous girlfriend and never having sex with her. Looks ridiculous.

Because a lot of people buying cars like this are the ones who like to sit in a parking lot bragging about what a magazine was able to do with their car while saying "Yeah, I might take it to a track sometime, but I'm more of a canyon carver". Most of the guys I've talked to who actually race their cars prefer to buy a base model and mod from there, because they know there aren't many cars out there that can handle serious track duty without some serious work

 

[millhouse]

The funny part is you think Mero is just as fast as Billy Johnson. That shows real wisdom. How many races and championships has Mero won? Mero is a very good racer, but he is no pro racer like Johnson.

As far as supercar goes, the article I showed is better then your blog you showed.

Wow, you really are dense. You don't realize that Mero, the corvette suspension engineer...the guy that GM trust to set lap records at the ring, vir and countless other tracks is not capable of turning lap times similar to what Bill would run after being in the car for a lap session. You don't understand that the Z06 can be a handful at the limits...and someone as intimate as Mero is with the suspension is likely the most qualified to set single lap records.

And the article you posted sucks for an argument. It says the Z06 is a super-car because "many some" people believe it to be?

 

[4V Mayhem]

Supercar performance…sure. Supercar, sorry…not happening. Maybe when the corvette goes mid-engine we can start talking. In the end, the entire world just sees another corvette with a big engine. A Z06 or ZR1 just don’t have that “Wow” factor that goes along with a supercar. Supercars do not have models that look nearly identical that can be had for $60k new. I’m sorry this hurts your feelings.

A good read...

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/w6rd4pb/

Sorry if any of this shatters your world but...
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/bu.../08/chevrolet-corvette-beats-elites/71865642/

Supercar.
http://www.businessinsider.com/youl...gain-after-your-drive-the-z06-supercar-2017-7

C4 and C6 ZR1 both listed as supercars.
https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/features/100-greatest-supercars-of-all-time.html

 

[4V Mayhem]

Supercar.
https://blog.dupontregistry.com/vid...5lt-vs-ferrari-488-gtb-vs-lamborgini-huracan/

Yet again...
https://www.tomsguide.com/us/corvette-z06,review-3592.html

And again...
http://fortune.com/2015/02/20/chevrolet-corvette-z06/

Edmunds really loves the Vette. "Supercar-grade"...
https://www.edmunds.com/chevrolet/corvette/2017/st-401657409/review/

...
https://www.azureazure.com/luxury-toys/z06-2015-the-best-corvette-ever

 

[02gtnh]

Wow, you really are dense. You don't realize that Mero, the corvette suspension engineer...the guy that GM trust to set lap records at the ring, vir and countless other tracks is not capable of turning lap times similar to what Bill would run after being in the car for a lap session. You don't understand that the Z06 can be a handful at the limits...and someone as intimate as Mero is with the suspension is likely the most qualified to set single lap records.

And the article you posted sucks for an argument. It says the Z06 is a super-car because "many some" people believe it to be?

Mero does know the Vette well, but to think no one can go faster, especially a Pro is silly. Probst has done quite fine in the Z06. And to say Johnson only had one lap in the GT to get his time is also silly as he races the GT professionally for Ford.

The article I put down give a definition of what a supercar is, all you gave was a opinion on what one is. Your just mad that people put the $500,000 GT in the supercar topic along side a $80,000 Vette.:cheers:

Also notice I can carry a conversation without name calling.

 

[Baron95]

Most of the guys I've talked to who actually race their cars prefer to buy a base model and mod from there, because they know there aren't many cars out there that can handle serious track duty without some serious work

Race? Who the heck is talking about racing? None of those cars we are discussing are legal to be road raced on any series (even amateur ones like NASA and SCCA).

We are talking about the ONLY place where you can legally enjoy the handling and performance of these cars "as sold" - on a track day. Not race. Not illegal street driving. But a safe organized track day.

And every year more and more people take their showroom stock cars to the track to have fun, learn, get faster.

The fact that you talk about "racing" means you have no idea what we are talking about here. Race cars are race cars - different topic, different planet. High performance cars suitable for driving on track is the topic.

A SS1LE, Corvette Grand Sport, Porsche Cayman or 911, BMW M2/M3/M4, etc can all be driven safely and enjoyably on track for season after season after season. Many people do that, and I instruct many of them. Some go on to acquire a race car or rent one, if they want to race.

The fact that there is no Mustang GT in existence or planned, with the proper cooling package to allow it to be driven on track without overheating is a shame. A real shame that Ford is choosing not to have a proper option.

 

[Baron95]

Mero does know the Vette well, but to think no one can go faster, especially a Pro is silly. Probst has done quite fine in the Z06. And to say Johnson only had one lap in the GT to get his time is also silly as he races the GT professionally for Ford.

Agreed. What a circular discussion. Mero is faster than the C&D editors. But the C7 Racing team drivers are also faster (much faster actually) than Mero.

That is why the MT tests are such a critical piece of data. They run a consistent driver (Probst) with a consistent protocol, on a set of tracks (Willows, Laguna Seca) that have a somewhat stable weather environment (little rain, rarely getting too cold, etc)

The Ford GT is a gorgeous and awesome car. But it is 0.4sec faster (same editors, same track) that the Mercedes AMG GT R a front engine, rear transaxle car with roughly the same performance of a Z06.

The ZR1 with 70% more downforce and +100HP will most likely be faster than the Ford GT my a comfortable margin. It is just how it is. Ford, even with a $453K/vehicle price point just can't keep up with GM's $120K price point.

 

[ALUSA]

Isn’t any 200 mph and plus stock factory car considered a supercar? Does it also have to pull minimum 1g in the corners with factory rubber and stop from 60 mph in less than 100 ft at ambient dry conditions like 70 deg F?

 

[millhouse]

Sorry if any of this shatters your world but...
http://www.detroitnews.com/story/bu.../08/chevrolet-corvette-beats-elites/71865642/

Supercar.
http://www.businessinsider.com/youl...gain-after-your-drive-the-z06-supercar-2017-7

C4 and C6 ZR1 both listed as supercars.
https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/features/100-greatest-supercars-of-all-time.html

Chevy has done a marvelous job in marketing the "supercar" name, but pull any corvette next to a Ferrari, Lamborghini or even a dodge viper and it will get completely ignored. It doesn't have the "it" factor. Hell, a z06 is damn near the same price as a GT350R. Supercar performance? I'll go with that, but it's not even in the same league as a viper...what does that tell you?

Hell, visit the corvette forums and even they argue weather or not it's a supercar.

Mero does know the Vette well, but to think no one can go faster, especially a Pro is silly. Probst has done quite fine in the Z06. And to say Johnson only had one lap in the GT to get his time is also silly as he races the GT professionally for Ford.

The article I put down give a definition of what a supercar is, all you gave was a opinion on what one is. Your just mad that people put the $500,000 GT in the supercar topic along side a $80,000 Vette.:cheers:

Also notice I can carry a conversation without name calling.

In the end, the GT spanks the Z06 regardless of driver.

Agreed. What a circular discussion. Mero is faster than the C&D editors. But the C7 Racing team drivers are also faster (much faster actually) than Mero.

That is why the MT tests are such a critical piece of data. They run a consistent driver (Probst) with a consistent protocol, on a set of tracks (Willows, Laguna Seca) that have a somewhat stable weather environment (little rain, rarely getting too cold, etc)

The Ford GT is a gorgeous and awesome car. But it is 0.4sec faster (same editors, same track) that the Mercedes AMG GT R a front engine, rear transaxle car with roughly the same performance of a Z06.

The ZR1 with 70% more downforce and +100HP will most likely be faster than the Ford GT my a comfortable margin. It is just how it is. Ford, even with a $453K/vehicle price point just can't keep up with GM's $120K price point.

What? Talk about circular reference. Any way you look at it, it spanks the Z06.

And with 755hp, the ZR1's HP to weight ratio is going to be right in line with the GT...except the GT still has a huge advantage of a mid-engine drive-train with a DCT.

 

[cosmo]

Chevy has done a marvelous job in marketing the "supercar" name, but pull any corvette next to a Ferrari, Lamborghini or even a dodge viper and it will get completely ignored. It doesn't have the "it" factor. Hell, a z06 is damn near the same price as a GT350R. Supercar performance? I'll go with that, but it's not even in the same league as a viper...what does that tell you?

Hell, visit the corvette forums and even they argue weather or not it's a supercar.



In the end, the GT spanks the Z06 regardless of driver.



What? Talk about circular reference. Any way you look at it, it spanks the Z06.

And with 755hp, the ZR1's HP to weight ratio is going to be right in line with the GT...except the GT still has a huge advantage of a mid-engine drive-train with a DCT.

Girlfriend's aunt thought my Vette was a Ferrari. Normal non-car people see a low slung sports coupe and think it's exotic. The same aunt thought my GT350 was a regular Mustang, I had to explain to her what a FPC was and why I spent so much "on a Mustang". Normal people are different than car people. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Car people definitely can tell the difference. In terms of status, the Vette is mid-life crisis status, not supercar. However anyone that denies the performance that a newer Z06/Z07 gives, they are fooling themselves and/or a blind fanboy.

I also don't think the GT will spank the ZR1, I think it will be closer than many here are comfortable with.

 

[4V Mayhem]

Chevy has done a marvelous job in marketing the "supercar" name, but pull any corvette next to a Ferrari, Lamborghini or even a dodge viper and it will get completely ignored. It doesn't have the "it" factor. Hell, a z06 is damn near the same price as a GT350R. Supercar performance? I'll go with that, but it's not even in the same league as a viper...what does that tell you?

Hell, visit the corvette forums and even they argue weather or not it's a supercar.

I just gave you multiple sources, all different, all calling the ZR1 and/or Z06 a Supercar. What more do you want? All the conspiracy theories aside, the ZR1 and Z06 are indeed included in the classification of Supercar. Whether it gets noticed next to a Ferrari or Lambo or Aston Martin or not has no impact on the classification. And YOUR definition or the fact that you choose not to consider it a Supercar likewise has no impact on the classification. It IS a Supercar whether you like it or want to admit it or not.

 

[4V Mayhem]

In the end, the GT spanks the Z06 regardless of driver.

What? Talk about circular reference. Any way you look at it, it spanks the Z06.

And with 755hp, the ZR1's HP to weight ratio is going to be right in line with the GT...except the GT still has a huge advantage of a mid-engine drive-train with a DCT.

You're the type of person who talks a big game and makes bold claims and underestimates the competition just to be proven wrong and end up angrier or talking more trash. People like yourself end up losing races and eating crow or having their foot in their mouth because of their incessant trash talk. You do not have to like the ZR1. Nobody is telling you to. But you have to admit that it will be formidable and nothing to scoff at. It has 755 hp and will likely handle better than the Z06. And we have seen what GM has done with the SS 1LE, ZL1, ZL1 1LE, and Z06. This car will have more power and torque than all of them and handle better. While I think the Ford GT has the advantage, I would not underestimate the ZR1 at all. That would be very foolish. Because if it does beat the Ford GT, you'll be crapping for hours after eating all the words you're shouting out.

 

[Trackaholic]

This GT vs Vette situation has played out before. Magazines and lap times favored the C6Z, but the rest of the world favored the GT. Current prices for each reflect that.

Maybe the ZR1 will be a little faster. It will definitely be a lot cheaper. It will also be an awesome car. But it is no Ford GT. And that’s fine, too.

-T

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