2018 Dyno discussion

Braski said:

A 35 HP bump is not gonna give you a 7 MPH increase in the 1\4 mile. I ran the numbers for a 4000lb car to go 112 mph and 119 mph on several different calculators. The most modest one calculated 436 hp for 112 mph and 491 hp for 119 mph. Math doesn't lie. When I run the 1\4 mile my et can vary a half second do to traction\launch but my mph will stay with in 1 mph range through out all the runs. Mph is the best way to measure hp. And yes weather affects your mph because you will make less or more hp because of it.

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No, but math can be wrong.

Hack said:

The car is accelerated by the HP that the engine is making at that particular moment in time. If your transmission shifts quickly and keeps the engine near peak HP for more time, the car will be quicker through the quarter mile.

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Quicker in the 1/4 is in reference to the ET, not the MPH. HP calculators are far from perfect but they are much more accurate than ET calculators because there are far fewer factors in the calculation such as tire grip and gearing for example.

Braski said:

A 35 HP bump is not gonna give you a 7 MPH increase in the 1\4 mile. I ran the numbers for a 4000lb car to go 112 mph and 119 mph on several different calculators. The most modest one calculated 436 hp for 112 mph and 491 hp for 119 mph. Math doesn't lie. When I run the 1\4 mile my et can vary a half second do to traction\launch but my mph will stay with in 1 mph range through out all the runs. Mph is the best way to measure hp. And yes weather affects your mph because you will make less or more hp because of it.

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The algorithms for those calculators don't account for differences seen in modern 10 speed transmissions. In other words, they are inaccurate to say the least.

Zeke.Malvo said:

Most of the hp calculators assume a normal shaped hp graph. The GEN III Coyote has an unusually flat and long hp curve at the top end, resulting in more hp area under the curve compared to other engines making the same peak rwhp.

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I think the real thing going on here is that the 10 speed is able to keep the coyote in the meat of the powerband for nearly the entire 1/4 mile.

Consider the MY15 GT with an auto. With a car shifting at 7000 RPM between second and third gears, the RPM drops to 4550 RPM for a difference of 2450 RPM.

Take a look at the new 10 speed shifting....

https://www.facebook.com/LundRacing/videos/1169208076542519/

There is less than a 1000RPM drop in between gears, meaning the car stays nearly at peak horsepower throughout the entire run!

GNN60GT500 said:

Because the 10 speed keeping the car in peak power band for the entire time coupled with the gen 3s flat power band at the top of the rpm curve could not have any effect on trap speed. Lol

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Ok, so it's a car that performs as if it has 500hp?:doh:

UAmach1 said:

No, but math can be wrong.

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I argued that point many times only to be proven wrong!

Ok guys, what gear is the A10 in when the car is doing 119 mph? What is going to be your argument when a stock 18 manual traps the same mph?

Braski said:

Ok guys, what gear is the A10 in when the car is doing 119 mph? What is going to be your argument IF a stock 18 manual traps the same mph?

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Fixed.

Braski said:

Ok guys, what gear is the A10 in when the car is doing 119 mph? What is going to be your argument when a stock 18 manual traps the same mph?

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Not going to happen. Do you not realize what it means when you are able to stay at or near peak horsepower during an entire 1/4 mile run?

millhouse said:

Not going to happen. Do you not realize what it means when you are able to stay at or near peak horsepower during an entire 1/4 mile run?

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It's pretty obvious he doesn't understand how gearing/power-band impact each other.

Grimace427 said:

Quicker in the 1/4 is in reference to the ET, not the MPH. HP calculators are far from perfect but they are much more accurate than ET calculators because there are far fewer factors in the calculation such as tire grip and gearing for example.

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Well said and you are 100% right.

ET comes with a better launch but mph is a derect result of HP as long as the driver is good . Take a look at a 2016 camaro 10 spd auto vs a 6 spd manual tested at the same place and time. These numbers are from GM authority for what it's worth. 10 spd auto ran 12.2@115mph and the 6spd ran 12.4@115mph. This is the same auto as in the 18 mustang other than slightly different ratios.

Braski said:

ET comes with a better launch but mph is a derect result of HP as long as the driver is good . Take a look at a 2016 camaro 10 spd auto vs a 6 spd manual tested at the same place and time. These numbers are from GM authority for what it's worth. 10 spd auto ran 12.2@115mph and the 6spd ran 12.4@115mph. This is the same auto as in the 18 mustang other than slightly different ratios.

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Apples to oranges. The coyote does not have the same power-band as the camaro, and the camaro (except ZL1) currently uses an 8 speed, not the more efficient 10 speed.

Look at the current leaderboards, the 6 speed autos consistently trap 2+mph faster than the 6 speed manuals. Now throw in 4 extra gears.

Did you not watch the video link I posted to see the significance of staying in the powerband?

Braski said:

ET comes with a better launch but mph is a derect result of HP as long as the driver is good . Take a look at a 2016 camaro 10 spd auto vs a 6 spd manual tested at the same place and time. These numbers are from GM authority for what it's worth. 10 spd auto ran 12.2@115mph and the 6spd ran 12.4@115mph. This is the same auto as in the 18 mustang other than slightly different ratios.

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The Camaro has an 8 speed auto, not 10.

Braski said:

A 35 HP bump is not gonna give you a 7 MPH increase in the 1\4 mile. I ran the numbers for a 4000lb car to go 112 mph and 119 mph on several different calculators. The most modest one calculated 436 hp for 112 mph and 491 hp for 119 mph. Math doesn't lie. When I run the 1\4 mile my et can vary a half second do to traction\launch but my mph will stay with in 1 mph range through out all the runs. Mph is the best way to measure hp. And yes weather affects your mph because you will make less or more hp because of it.

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You guys are forgetting about the drag mode, which doesn't have any torque limiting (or drastically reduced?). The 15-17 cars already have enough power to throw down some decent times, but the torque limiting is hindering performance.

Shaun at AED played around with this.

Stock the car went 13.3@108 DA 1677
Same car with a tune 12.1@116 DA 1346 (this was on a different day, same day as the stock run the car went 12.2@114 DA 1668 but it wasn't dialed in.)

Full weight car, wheels and tires only.

The car was dyno'd with and without the tune and made a whopping 9hp and 8tq more. He said the majority of the MPH came from getting the torque limiting ironed out and shifts right. This car only made 381whp.

These are 2 things that Ford did with the new engine/transmission.

There are more pieces to the puzzle than the engine output.

Or aliens. That's my theory.