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I want to deprogram my rear speakers' EQ

Quackfoo

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Don't know if this helps, this is an unmodified acm from a 9 speaker shaker (no amp)

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Well, made the changes and no dice. Bass still falls off a cliff when you unlatch the top. Went back in and verified that the change took and the value is still 00 for 727-01-02 in the first two positions. It was 727-01-02 0700 38. I changed it to 727-01-02 0000 38.

I was using the F-150 spreadsheet, is there a Mustang specific one? Any other ideas?
Alright. I did some searching, found two otherwise identically configured cars - EcoBoost Premium Perf Pack Automatics without Nav or Rear Park Assist. Only difference is color of paint and one is a fastback, the other a vert. Grabbed their window stickers to verify, and downloaded their as-built and loaded them into As-Built Compare. This is how you figure this stuff out if you want to do it on your own.

Specifically in the ACM (727) here are the differences I found.

  • 727-01-01 xxxx Xxxx xxxx - D for the vert, F for the coupe. F150 spreadsheet says this is the difference between mast antenna and active antenna. I've never been around a vert, but I'm guessing you guys have an old school mast antenna? There's no visible antenna on the hardtop cars. I'd leave this alone to preserve radio functionality.
  • 727-01-01 xxxx xxxx Xxxx - 6 for vert, 4 for coupe. F150 spreadsheet says 6 means "CC check for open & AAM present & Convertible & Chimes disabled" whereas 4 means "4=CC check for open & AAM present & non-Convertible & Chimes disabled" This is probably the one you want to change.
  • 727-01-02 xXxx xx - 7 for vert, 2 for coupe. This is the EQ profile, I believe you already changed this to 0 for no EQ.
  • 727-03-01 XXxx - 28 for vert, 4E for coupe. No data on this in the F150 spreadsheet. I would try the 9th character of 727-01-01 above, and only if that does nothing, try changing these two characters to match the hardtop.

And for what it's worth, I also loaded up a non-PP, non-nav EB Premium Fastback and it matched the PP car as far as ACM config goes.

ETA: one more thing, make sure the car is *completely* shut off and turned back on when you make these changes. It's tricky making ACM and APIM (Sync 3) changes, because when you turn the car off they stay powered on to run chimes, and show the shutdown splash screen. You need to shut the car off after making changes with FORScan, open the door, close it, and wait for the screen to go completely black for several seconds.
 
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Spart

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One more tidbit for those of you with EcoBoosts or GT350's - 727-01-01 xxxx xXxx xxx will control your engine noise enhancement (or cancellation if you prefer.) The default value for an EcoBoost/GT350 here will be A, you want to change that to an 8 to turn it off. GT's are already set to 8 here.

ETA: Also change 727-01-02 xxXX xx from 88 to 00, which controls the mixing for the noise enhancement/cancellation/whatever.
 
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  • 727-01-02 xXxx xx - 7 for vert, 2 for coupe. This is the EQ profile, I believe you already changed this to 0 for no EQ.

[MENTION=25607]Spart[/MENTION] will this deprogram the EQ for the rear speakers only?

I want to keep the EQ intact for the door speakers.
 

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[MENTION=25607]Spart[/MENTION] will this deprogram the EQ for the rear speakers only?

I want to keep the EQ intact for the door speakers.
I don't believe there's a way to do this. Try turning it off, you might like it better. You might also be better served by getting some nicer speakers for the front - part of the EQing Ford does is to attempt to make up for deficiencies in the factory equipment.
 

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I am an ex-professional loudspeaker designer. You might think that I would tear out everything and put in an expensive system. But no, I just want something "good enough". The rear shelf speakers are atrocious, so replacing them is going after the low hanging fruit, IMO.

I already replaced them with some quality 7" woofers I had in inventory. But they play very quiet, and as we know, there is no bass. These woofers could handle full-range signal without damage for normal playback loudness.

So yes, I know about EQ as a convenient way to overcome speaker units' deficiencies. But the door speakers are "good enough" for now, and so I just want to stick with improving the rear speakers.

I suppose I will just have to tap into the amp inputs, and then measure the Voltage Transfer Function to see if the fronts are flat, and what shape is the signal going to the rears.
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I am an ex-professional loudspeaker designer. You might think that I would tear out everything and put in an expensive system. But no, I just want something "good enough". The rear shelf speakers are atrocious, so replacing them is going after the low hanging fruit, IMO.

I already replaced them with some quality 7" woofers I had in inventory. But they play very quiet, and as we know, there is no bass. These woofers could handle full-range signal without damage for normal playback loudness.

So yes, I know about EQ as a convenient way to overcome speaker units' deficiencies. But the door speakers are "good enough" for now, and so I just want to stick with improving the rear speakers.

I suppose I will just have to tap into the amp inputs, and then measure the Voltage Transfer Function to see if the fronts are flat, and what shape is the signal going to the rears.
Honestly, what you need to be doing is getting one of those small 4ch digital amps and going with variable line level output on the ACM.

I have my speakers faded all the way to the front, my eventual plan is to fiberglass an 8" sub enclosure for the trunk, replace the fronts and run them all off a 4 ch amp with the 8" running off two channels bridged.
 
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Thanks, but honestly, I just want a flat signal sent to the rear. Hence why I started this thread.

If the signal from the ACM is not flat, then "un-EQ-ing the EQ" (via new digital amp) is not really the proper way to go about it.

Ideally, if I could first get the signal flat, then I can stay with the factory amp, and possibly insert a miniDSP filter between it and the ACM at some future time.
 

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Thanks, but honestly, I just want a flat signal sent to the rear. Hence why I started this thread.

If the signal from the ACM is not flat, then "un-EQ-ing the EQ" (via new digital amp) is not really the proper way to go about it.

Ideally, if I could first get the signal flat, then I can stay with the factory amp, and possibly insert a miniDSP filter between it and the ACM at some future time.
I think you misinterpreted what I was saying, if you were going with an aftermarket amp of course you'd want to try and get rid of all DSP from the ACM.

I honestly can't imagine why you want to keep the factory EQ. New front speakers aren't terribly expensive and just removing as much of the factory DSP as Ford will allow and upgrading the fronts (but still powered by the ACM) would probably be a nice improvement.
 
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Ford cheaped out on the rear speakers, and then had to limit the bass to them because they have such low max excursion. Ford probably cheaped out on the center speaker, too. If and when I get to the wiring below the dash, I will likely disconnect the center speaker there, and then reconnect it should I sell the car.

As for the door speakers, they aren't that bad. But replacing them implies having to completely cook up a whole new crossover alignment. Given my (high) skills and experience, that is a LOT of work. Such a speaker system should be developed outside of the car on likely a finite baffle mockup at least.

Again, I am trying to get the best improvement in sound for the least amount of work and expense. For me, that just means replacing the rear speakers, and allowing bass to reach them. I don't see how step #1 can be anything other than getting the signal going back there to be flat.

Oh, I also want to visit a dealer to look at the underside of the rear speakers in a non-vert 401a car. Are they the same cheap speakers? If not, then maybe that system allows bass to be fed to them.
 

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So sorry for going somewhat off track here but it does concern the EQ. My question is concerning the base 6 speaker system but I am also interested in the upgraded systems.

Has any one actually done any measurements on our systems to see what the roll off is as different frequencies or volumes? I remember OEM's video demonstrating with a o-scope that the clipping or loss of a good sign wave until approx. 2/3 volume. I don't know what his ref frequency was...
 
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I hope others chime in, but I have tried to measure in-cabin of the door speakers, the rear speakers, and the overall sound at the driver's head, and in the center of the cabin. Such measurements are chaos compared to the controlled conditions of developing home or pro speakers. I don't know how the OEM engineers do it, unless they A) develop the system outside of the car to then take a known-good system in, or B) use a pre-filtered stimulus such as pink noise to get a decent overall balance. I suspect that they may do both, i.e. part A and then part B for final tuning of broad EQ. That is what one automotive speaker engineer once told me.

Now you can see why I am so reluctant to change the front speakers. It means that to do it right, I would have to make test enclosures, and test baffle, develop active or passive crossovers, etc. - all outside of the car. Not to mention making sure the new speakers fit the doors.

This is why I prefer to go after the weak rear speakers. Even what I have in there now is not ideal, bc there are no tweeters. If I could just get full-range to them, then I could try them either as "full-range" or just as "subwoofers" only, i.e. to enhance the weak bass of the OEM system overall.

In the photo, you can see the mic placed on the center armrest.
20170102_111925.jpg
 
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So sorry for going somewhat off track here but it does concern the EQ. My question is concerning the base 6 speaker system but I am also interested in the upgraded systems.

Has any one actually done any measurements on our systems to see what the roll off is as different frequencies or volumes? I remember OEM's video demonstrating with a o-scope that the clipping or loss of a good sign wave until approx. 2/3 volume. I don't know what his ref frequency was...
To answer your specific question, I can (and have) measure near-field of a woofer (e.g. mic right up to the backside of a woofer cone from within the trunk).

Or, I could measure the voltage signal coming out of the amp (at the speaker terminals). This is very difficult since my 2016 does not have the 3mm analog audio input jack in the center console.

Which drives me to the input connections of the amplifier. I have yet to perform that measurement. That is where I want the signal to be flat going to the rear.
 

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GTP, What brand/model are your new rears? Are they direct to the factory system with no other mods? Results on a scale of 1 -10 vs. stock?

I do have an amp in the trunk pushing a 10" in my spare tire well with fair results. I have also replace the front stage also amped and I am just not satisfied.... flat sounding in a bad way...lifeless. Running speaker level direct to an amp...
 
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Well, I started by measuring the hole, and then finding what I had on the shelf that would fit it. Seems the hole is optimized for 8" frame, but with the adapter rings I made, I could use the 7" that I already had on hand. Required gaskets on both sides of the ring, but then also notice all the pink foam rubber that I used to plug the various cutouts in the metal panel. What are all those used for? :shrug:

I put 8ohm Wavecor woofers there. These are kind of a Chinese brand of Scan-speak, so they are very high quality. I use the 6" version in my high-end speakers. I also tried tweeters above the carpet, and pre-developed passive crossovers. Couldn't get decent looking measurements or sound, so I ran the woofers full range, firing through the thick carpet. It measured surprisingly flat, and sound pretty good!

So yes, they are high-fidelity, but none of it comes through because of the bass-less signal, and low power sent to them. :(

Honestly, another approach is to install a subwoofer in the trunk (I personally don't want to give up any trunk volume, which is what is required, and so I might consider a small sub that does not reach as deep or go as loud, which is fine with me. And in that case, I may as well make the rear shelf speakers to be subs, and I may still try that.) But if one were to do that, he may as well leave the shelf speaker holes empty. Why make powerful bass that just bounces rear shelf wimpy cones around? But if you did that, you can expect a little higher road noise, too.

It's all a hassle. But it all begins with getting a flat signal to the rears!!
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