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Have you blown an engine? If so, what rod (cylinder) failed?

What rod (cylinder) failed on your engine?


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Brian V

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TheLion

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#1 and #2 show the most knock count, #3 trails those cylinders slightly, and #4 never does get any knock count. Could be that fuel is fed starting at the rear cylinder. The center cylinders will get the most heat as there siamese to the rear and front cylinders, where as #1 and #4 should have better cooling with more water around the cylinder. I would assume that the two cylinders that would have issues would be #2 and #3. It all has to do with knock count, the cylinder that knocks the most is the one that's gonna have a problem, hence why #4 never has any issues. This is just my observation on my own car, other cars could be different. Always over octane people, and dont ask your tuner for to much low engine speed TQ.
When I cracked that Brisk RR14YS plug insulator it was on #4....could tuning strategy possibly be playing a role rather than mechanical design?
 
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TheLion

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I agree, I think its cooling issue, but also looking at were the knock sensors are located.
#1 between 1st and 2snd cylinders and #2 by 4th cylinder, so #3 doesn't have one right by it.
Not that you want to rely on knock sensor for timing retard as there always a delay (it has to knock first).
That's the only way to detect knock is with knock sensors....it's also where the greatest power and fuel efficiency is made. Most modern engines actually run in very mild knock (more commonly NA and low boost) or just on the very edge of it (high boost engines) even at light throttle (for maximal fuel economy).

Mild knock won't cause any harm even over the life of the engine. Even severe knock or detonation you can run a couple thousand until the piston either melts or fatigues (or the or the rod / wrist pins could eventually give out too).

There's no reason the tune shouldn't be able to detect knock and scale back timing / fueling / air before it becomes detonation / severe knock unless it's running so aggressively it goes into detonation or even pre-ignition which often leads to mega knock / super knock.

Also the knock sensors operate by detecting the resonance of the block due to the end gas ignition (aka knock). It doesn't matter which cylinder is knocking in terms of detecting it, the entire block resonates when knock occurs in any of the cylinders because of the energy transfer. Think of the block like a giant tuning fork.

The offending cylinder is known by the PCM because of the ignition timing, the PCM knows when it pulsed the plug and expected an ignition, since only one cylinder is firing at a time the PCM knows which cylinder is knock.

Our ecoboost engines have two knock sensors. One sensor is tuned to detect knock and the other is tuned to detect pre-ignition which results in multiple knocks (different frequency range). Pre-ignition leads to mega knock / super knock / LSPI and isn't always necessarily a death sentence if caught early enough.

To my knowledge Ford uses a windowing strategy to help predict mega knock / super knock (aka LSPI) by pre-ignition events. The more severe the pre-ignition the more aggressively timing is pulled and fuel is dumped into the offending cylinder. There are over 480 tables with the factory ECU, some of them can be changed to a degree with out negatively affecting others, but it's a very complex set of control software and that's why I think working for Ford Engineering when tuning is so critical for street car tuning (race cars is a different story, you only need to worry about how the car will run that day which can be done by tuning on a dyno).

Just to be clear there's a lot of different terms for one of two events.

- Knock which is end gas auto ignition which occurs after the bulk of the air / fuel mixture is burned up, can range from mild (not harmful) to severe (harmful over extended periods of time). Typically caused by heat on the piston surface as a secondary ignition. The compression wave from the primary ignition causes some separation or pockets if you will of air and fuel that have not been ignited.

- Detonation is a severe form of knock and is just another term used to describe a high intensity damaging knock, can result in cracked spark plug insulators and pitting of the top of the piston. It is only permanently harmful if it's not corrected and aloud to continue as it can over a few thousand miles of constant detonation crack pistons or damage rods etc. Modern engines are built to withstand multiple repeated detonation events without permanent damage.

- pre-ignition is the auto ignition of the air / fuel mixture prior to spark ignition. Again this is not necessarily a death sentence, pre-ignition could occur just a few degrees before spark ignition and acts like slightly advanced timing, it often results in knock or even detonation that ranges from mild to severe depending on how advanced the auto ignition occurs. Caused by hot spots or more commonly from heated deposits of sufficient mass to retain enough heat to ignite the air / fuel mixture during the ensuing compression stroke. Those deposits can come from fuel / oil mixing, thus lowering the flash point of the fuel or from solid deposits that detach from the rings / lands / grooves of the piston, valves, plug or injector etc.

They become heated during the power stroke from the primary ignition and because all of the oxygen and fuel is used up their thermo-chemical reactions are suspended until air and fuel is present on the next compression stroke in which they resume.

- after pre-ignition it was found that most commonly large quantities of deposits are dislodged from the rings, grooves and lands which then retain heat (you can see them glowing in images taken from bore scope cameras), these will often lead to LSPI / Mega Knock / Super Knock (all terms for the dreaded rod breaker event) if the PCM doesn't dump fuel / cut air and retard timing on the next compression stroke to "douse" or "choke out" the ignition sources. The windowing strategy for predicting LSPI is part of how Ford does that.

That's why I think anti-LPSI Oil formulations are so critical to highly tuned cars. While it's not a 100% gaurantee (it doesn't protect against defective or sub-par rods aka metalurgical defects, bad tuning, really bad fuel, improper modifications etc.), oil has been found in every study I've seen to be the primary offender.

Why? Because it dilutes the octane rating of the fuel or stated otherwise it lowers the octane rating of the fuel = bad. Now you have fuel that you thought was 93 and the PCM was programmed to expect 93 but is really 91 or even lower.

Some one mentioned an octane buffer and I think that combined with an oil cooler and more importantly a Dexos 1 Gen 2 rated oil. Gen 2 specification specifically tests the oil for LSPI inducing properties, aka does it highly affect the octane rating when mixed with fuel and cause pre-ignition in their test engine.

Eventually the GF6 spec will come out which is a more universal standard that's industry wide instead of just GM, but GM's Gen 2 spec is pretty decent and far more stringent than GF5 which does not even address LSPI related issues.

So oil can significantly contribute to normal knock as well as pre-ignition and LSPI.

Obviously it's not always the cause, but I think there's a fair bed that it is a significant factor in some of these failed engines. It's entirely possible that some of them are experiencing multiple pre-ignition events that lead to a mega knock event which fractures or bends the rod. In the testing I've seen, the second ring is usually the one that breaks off from LSPI, not the top, so you could fail a piston and run for a while until that chunk of piston starts wreaking havok in the crank case and the rest of the piston eventually gives way (this last part is only my speculation).

Here is the source of my information regarding LSPI, pre-ignition and knock, your welcome to disagree with 82+ automotive engines from some of the most respected engine and engine component designers in the world which contributed to the information therein including BMW, Mercedes, MAHLE, Toyoda, Honda etc.: https://www.iav.com/sites/default/files/veranstaltung/25/publications/34242_iav_ottomotorisches_klopfen_ans.pdf
 

8borerifle

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I had the FP tune installed on my 2015 Premium PP auto in April and will be off their warranty in December of this year. I have a Premium Ford service contract 7 year 60,000 miles. With the Ecoboosts having problems, I might have to rethink keeping the car. I just turned in a claim for heavy wear on the left bolster of my leather seat on the drivers side and was turned down by Ford! The tune is the only modification to the car and I am retired and drive the car pretty easy. Can't afford to replace a $7,000.00 motor! The car has 31,500 miles. I was surprised to see a FP car go boom!
Thanks Lion for all of your posts, great info!
 

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TheLion

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Here's the list guys trimmed down by only those with Mileage posted. There's only 1 car that made it past 36k, that was a Livernois tuned car that let go at 65,000 and WAS covered under warranty. I'm wondering if that was an LSPI event due to deposits slowly building up rather than a factory defect? Or possible periodic detonation over tens of thousands of miles? I suppose it could be related to piston fatigue or a slight metallurgical defect.

[MENTION=19559]JSCOTT0812[/MENTION] Mine blew up with the Vargas Stage 2 turbo installed. Tuned by Adam. Late 2014 motor at 15,000 Miles. [MENTION=7058]Mustang[/MENTION] 2.3 12,000 Miles -Build 10/14, Manual - stock, not tuned. Warranty covered [MENTION=8379]marjen[/MENTION] 27,000 Miles,-Build date 10/14 - Auto [MENTION=17801]Mattrix[/MENTION] 4,018 Miles - Build Date 10/31/14 - Auto [MENTION=10766]DanFish[/MENTION] 16,000 Miles-Build date 10/24 - Auto [MENTION=7895]navair133[/MENTION] Livernois tune. 65,000 Miles. Number one piston cracked wide open - Warranty covered. [MENTION=17341]derpington[/MENTION]: 1,500 Miles,
@millennial Mohammad: 17,000 Miles, Cylinder #2, Ford Performance Calibration + FMIC [MENTION=7058]Mustang[/MENTION] Evo (grabber12): 5,000 Miles, Cylinder #?, Cobb Stage (2 or 3 likely) Tune, FMIC, Waste Gate and now Water + Meth

Of those failed engines who let go and posted their mileage it generally happened early on...that's where the FP Calibration comes into play, IF something happens you WILL be covered by warranty replacement even out to 60k. But I think it shows that there's a good chance if it's gonna let go, it's gonna happen early on in the big majority of cases. Again none of our theories are a 100% guarantee, it's a game of numbers, but you can stack the odds more or less in your favor by being cautious and using the odds to your favor.

Maybe being overly cautious is the best one can do? Run 93 octane on a 91 tune, use an oil cooler, inter cooler, well vetted and tested tune and a Dexos 1 Gen 2 rated oil and a paper or synthetic dry filter with 99% particulate filtration. Be VERY careful with plugs, for stock tune, Livernois or FP run the OE plugs. Too cold of plugs can have an adverse effect on LSPI because of poor ignition which leads to increased fouling / deposits = not good for pre-ignition. Proper heat range is always best, colder is NOT always better (depends on your mods, hot tunes may require colder plugs, just be careful to properly test the heat range so you know they aren't too cold). Ford used a non-standard heat range, it's a semi-projected tip, right in between common projected types and non-projected types, so to me that would suggest these engines are very sensitive to plug location.

I know they are very sensitive to injector location as well. Side type injectors were by far the worst LSPI offenders in all the R&D testing I've seen.

My personal conclusions:
1. Engines will fail even stock due to factory defects NA or FI alike, you can find quite a few posts of failed engines in the following configurations that were BONE STOCK: 5.0 V8 (Mustang GT), 6.2 V8 (F-150 Raptor), 3.7L EB (SHO and F-150), 2.0L EB (Focus ST), 1.6L EB (Fiesta ST). There are examples of Ecoboosts with Livernois 93 tunes that are abused daily with over 100k now on them still running fine, but then there are even bone stock engines that fail in just 10k to 20k miles.
2. Factory defects in the rods or pistons TYPICALLY manifest early on, most commonly well before 36,000 miles
3. Because we are pushing such high BMEP (my FP tuned Ecoboost 2.3L is pushing 29+ BMEP), fouling or deposit control is critical to prevent detonation, pre-ignition and ultimately the dreaded LSPI / Mega Knock
4. Be conservative with the stock block, if you want more power than what the FP tune, Cobb Stage 1 or Livernois 91 tunes can offer, you should probably consider a built bottom end sooner rather than later. Heck, if you can afford it it's a good idea even with those, it would be nearly bullet proof then.

If all else fails, the stock tune is still not the end of the world as long as you have an inter cooler. No it doesn't feel like a performance car, but as a daily driver it's at least consistent and still quite a bit faster than your 1.8L Toyoda Corolla...
 
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Maggneto

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@TheLion if you are correct about the Oil contributing to the event, isn't it also possible that a bad batch of gas would have the same impact if not worst when combined with the Oil factor? Bad gas could also lower the octane rating = bad. I am not sure if you are aware that the last 3 failures had filled up just prior to the event. 2 just filled up and one within 40 miles. I am not saying bad gas is the only factor but a catalyst.

"Because it dilutes the octane rating of the fuel or stated otherwise it lowers the octane rating of the fuel = bad. Now you have fuel that you thought was 93 and the PCM was programmed to expect 93 but is really 91 or even lower."

I would think that bad gasoline would be a bigger concern than oil.

https://www.knowyourparts.com/technical-resources/fuel-system/bad-fuel-fact-or-fiction/
 
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Edkiefer

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That's the only way to detect knock is with knock sensors....it's also where the greatest power and fuel efficiency is made. Most modern engines actually run in very mild knock (more commonly NA and low boost) or just on the very edge of it (high boost engines) even at light throttle (for maximal fuel economy).

Mild knock won't cause any harm even over the life of the engine. Even severe knock or detonation you can run a couple thousand until the piston either melts or fatigues (or the or the rod / wrist pins could eventually give out too).

There's no reason the tune shouldn't be able to detect knock and scale back timing / fueling / air before it becomes detonation / severe knock unless it's running so aggressively it goes into detonation or even pre-ignition which often leads to mega knock / super knock.

Also the knock sensors operate by detecting the resonance of the block due to the end gas ignition (aka knock). It doesn't matter which cylinder is knocking in terms of detecting it, the entire block resonates when knock occurs in any of the cylinders because of the energy transfer. Think of the block like a giant tuning fork.

The offending cylinder is known by the PCM because of the ignition timing, the PCM knows when it pulsed the plug and expected an ignition, since only one cylinder is firing at a time the PCM knows which cylinder is knock.

Our ecoboost engines have two knock sensors. One sensor is tuned to detect knock and the other is tuned to detect pre-ignition which results in multiple knocks (different frequency range). Pre-ignition leads to mega knock / super knock / LSPI and isn't always necessarily a death sentence if caught early enough.

To my knowledge Ford uses a windowing strategy to help predict mega knock / super knock (aka LSPI) by pre-ignition events. The more severe the pre-ignition the more aggressively timing is pulled and fuel is dumped into the offending cylinder. There are over 480 tables with the factory ECU, some of them can be changed to a degree with out negatively affecting others, but it's a very complex set of control software and that's why I think working for Ford Engineering when tuning is so critical for street car tuning (race cars is a different story, you only need to worry about how the car will run that day which can be done by tuning on a dyno).

Just to be clear there's a lot of different terms for one of two events.

- Knock which is end gas auto ignition which occurs after the bulk of the air / fuel mixture is burned up, can range from mild (not harmful) to severe (harmful over extended periods of time). Typically caused by heat on the piston surface as a secondary ignition. The compression wave from the primary ignition causes some separation or pockets if you will of air and fuel that have not been ignited.

- Detonation is a severe form of knock and is just another term used to describe a high intensity damaging knock, can result in cracked spark plug insulators and pitting of the top of the piston. It is only permanently harmful if it's not corrected and aloud to continue as it can over a few thousand miles of constant detonation crack pistons or damage rods etc. Modern engines are built to withstand multiple repeated detonation events without permanent damage.

- pre-ignition is the auto ignition of the air / fuel mixture prior to spark ignition. Again this is not necessarily a death sentence, pre-ignition could occur just a few degrees before spark ignition and acts like slightly advanced timing, it often results in knock or even detonation that ranges from mild to severe depending on how advanced the auto ignition occurs. Caused by hot spots or more commonly from heated deposits of sufficient mass to retain enough heat to ignite the air / fuel mixture during the ensuing compression stroke. Those deposits can come from fuel / oil mixing, thus lowering the flash point of the fuel or from solid deposits that detach from the rings / lands / grooves of the piston, valves, plug or injector etc.

They become heated during the power stroke from the primary ignition and because all of the oxygen and fuel is used up their thermo-chemical reactions are suspended until air and fuel is present on the next compression stroke in which they resume.

- after pre-ignition it was found that most commonly large quantities of deposits are dislodged from the rings, grooves and lands which then retain heat (you can see them glowing in images taken from bore scope cameras), these will often lead to LSPI / Mega Knock / Super Knock (all terms for the dreaded rod breaker event) if the PCM doesn't dump fuel / cut air and retard timing on the next compression stroke to "douse" or "choke out" the ignition sources. The windowing strategy for predicting LSPI is part of how Ford does that.

That's why I think anti-LPSI Oil formulations are so critical to highly tuned cars. While it's not a 100% gaurantee (it doesn't protect against defective or sub-par rods aka metalurgical defects, bad tuning, really bad fuel, improper modifications etc.), oil has been found in every study I've seen to be the primary offender.

Why? Because it dilutes the octane rating of the fuel or stated otherwise it lowers the octane rating of the fuel = bad. Now you have fuel that you thought was 93 and the PCM was programmed to expect 93 but is really 91 or even lower.

Some one mentioned an octane buffer and I think that combined with an oil cooler and more importantly a Dexos 1 Gen 2 rated oil. Gen 2 specification specifically tests the oil for LSPI inducing properties, aka does it highly affect the octane rating when mixed with fuel and cause pre-ignition in their test engine.

Eventually the GF6 spec will come out which is a more universal standard that's industry wide instead of just GM, but GM's Gen 2 spec is pretty decent and far more stringent than GF5 which does not even address LSPI related issues.

So oil can significantly contribute to normal knock as well as pre-ignition and LSPI.

Obviously it's not always the cause, but I think there's a fair bed that it is a significant factor in some of these failed engines. It's entirely possible that some of them are experiencing multiple pre-ignition events that lead to a mega knock event which fractures or bends the rod. In the testing I've seen, the second ring is usually the one that breaks off from LSPI, not the top, so you could fail a piston and run for a while until that chunk of piston starts wreaking havok in the crank case and the rest of the piston eventually gives way (this last part is only my speculation).

Here is the source of my information regarding LSPI, pre-ignition and knock, your welcome to disagree with 82+ automotive engines from some of the most respected engine and engine component designers in the world which contributed to the information therein including BMW, Mercedes, MAHLE, Toyoda, Honda etc.: https://www.iav.com/sites/default/f...ons/34242_iav_ottomotorisches_klopfen_ans.pdf
I agree with most of what you say here, my comment on not wanting to rely on knock sensor was at learning stage of ECU.
AFAIK, with modern ECU, if knock is persistent, ECU will learn and back off whole timing table.

I didn't know on two frequency types of knock sensors used now.
I know in past they are pretty crude sensors (on paper it sounds great but reality is not so).
The early systems were prone to false positive detecting knocks, in fact Ford tried different positions of mounting them on older 2.3 and it never really worked well, but those ECU were fixed, no flash, no adjustments, no datalog off it either.
On detonation though IMO damage can happen fast, I guess it depends on how bad it is detonating.I seen first hand many pistons crack, break top lands.
These were all cast original NA pistons, and no damage to rods shown up.

The problem with rods is they slowly can bend over time, user/driver would not even notice it, of course if really stressed they can bend to point were interference happens and break.
I think most of ecoboost are piston damage first, then rod is unsupported so goes through block.
It would be interesting if it was easy to measure piston deck height with motor intact, to see if piston tops are dropping over time.
Could maybe use sparkplug as access point to measure.
 

TheLion

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I had the FP tune installed on my 2015 Premium PP auto in April and will be off their warranty in December of this year. I have a Premium Ford service contract 7 year 60,000 miles. With the Ecoboosts having problems, I might have to rethink keeping the car. I just turned in a claim for heavy wear on the left bolster of my leather seat on the drivers side and was turned down by Ford! The tune is the only modification to the car and I am retired and drive the car pretty easy. Can't afford to replace a $7,000.00 motor! The car has 31,500 miles. I was surprised to see a FP car go boom!
Thanks Lion for all of your posts, great info!
Here's an example of some things to think about:

1. People generally go on the forums to tell about their bad experiences or to trouble shoot or learn how to prevent problems, most people don't go on here about their good experiences when their car now has 100k miles and has been tuned and drag raced for the bulk of it with no issues. They just enjoy the car! Case in point, when I lost my wife in a car accident, I wasn't on these forums for several months after, I just drove my car and enjoyed it not worrying about weather or not it was going to throw a rod (was FP tuned and still is)...there were more pressing things for me to deal with at the time.

2. These failures represent a VERY SMALL percentage of the total cars out there, even modified ones, even of cars on this forum.

3. As an example, when I spoke to Livernois about LPSI when I was questioning their tuning they said they sell an average of 250 calibrators a WEEK (of all ecoboost types combined, ranging from SHO, F-150, ST, RS, Fiesta and Mustang). So lets be super conservative and say the total average over that 8 years is only 125 per week. They have been tuning these cars since 2009, so 8 years * 52 weeks * 125 = 52,000 ecoboost engines that are just Livernois tuned...over the past 8 years.

I've seen two legitimate failures that occured while their tuning was installed and BOTH were covered under warranty surprisingly (and F-150 with only 10k miles and the one above with 65k miles). There were only two other shady one liner posts of a friend of a friend who "supposedly had their tune", both were Focus ST's. SO that makes potentially 4 that I know of. 4 / 52,000 = 0.00000076 or 0.000076%....

Ford Performance, Cobb and other big names sell likely even MORE than Livernois. There are about 500,000 Ecoboost F-150's out on the road only a very small percentage of them have major problems that I'm aware of. Same with Escapes, ST's or any other flavor.

When one reads these forums one might get the impression your engine is on the verge of exploding because it's an ecoboost or because it's TDI...maybe it is, but I think the chances are pretty small so well as your careful and follow good maintenance habits. And with the Ford Performance tuning you have the warranty as backup just in case. That's why even NEW cars come with warranties, to cover the limitations of making things which isn't perfect. Defects happen, period. When modifying engines from the factory configuration there's always some risk, but how much depends on the modification.

I chose the Ford Performance Calibartion because my car is a daily and it allows me to be covered under warranty. I'll stick with it until the warranty is up at which point I will switch to Livernois 91 but with ALL of the safeties listed above such as only running 93 octane (octane buffer), oil cooler (already have), LSPI rated oil (switching to in the next change), OE plugs (still running), PP radiator, inter cooler (already have) and a 99% efficient synthetic media filter (already have from Ford Performance). Beyond that if something fails I don't think it's my doing, but just a limitation of my particular engine.

Livernois told me in their testing and development, they found these stock engines TYPICALLY fail around 330~350 whp and around 400~425 wtq. If that's the failure range on average, then you need to run at a lower power and with good maintenance to prevent failure. Running at the limit is usually not good for durability. So just be smart, hedge your bets and be prepared for the remote possibility of an engine replacement. No engine is immune, including V8's.
 
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TheLion

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I agree with most of what you say here, my comment on not wanting to rely on knock sensor was at learning stage of ECU.
AFAIK, with modern ECU, if knock is persistent, ECU will learn and back off whole timing table.

I didn't know on two frequency types of knock sensors used now.
I know in past they are pretty crude sensors (on paper it sounds great but reality is not so).
The early systems were prone to false positive detecting knocks, in fact Ford tried different positions of mounting them on older 2.3 and it never really worked well, but those ECU were fixed, no flash, no adjustments, no datalog off it either.
On detonation though IMO damage can happen fast, I guess it depends on how bad it is detonating.I seen first hand many pistons crack, break top lands.
These were all cast original NA pistons, and no damage to rods shown up.

The problem with rods is they slowly can bend over time, user/driver would not even notice it, of course if really stressed they can bend to point were interference happens and break.
I think most of ecoboost are piston damage first, then rod is unsupported so goes through block.
It would be interesting if it was easy to measure piston deck height with motor intact, to see if piston tops are dropping over time.
Could maybe use sparkplug as access point to measure.
I'm going to wager that modern knock sensors are pretty good. There's also TONS of processing power available as well in the ECU which wasn't just 10 years ago. But nothing is perfect and piston engines operate entirely off of historical data and prediction.

Predictive methods aren't perfect because they rely on averages or expectations which don't always pan out. When you play the odds, eventually you will loose. The real question is, can you play the odds long enough and in such a way that you won't loose within the engine's normal life span....

Piston failure makes sense though. They are not forged, just your standard hyper eutectic pistons, so nothing special material wise. I'm surprised they didn't have forged pistons, but it all has to do with cost savings. We all know you can build a bomb proof bottom end and run these street car tunes until the end of time without failure, but the cost from a factory engine like that would mean massive profit loss for the OE's and of course most of these engines run reliably for their life on the factory tuning so there's no incentive to do otherwise.
 

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TheLion

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@TheLion if you are correct about the Oil contributing to the event, isn't it also possible that a bad batch of gas would have the same impact if not worst when combined with the Oil factor? Bad gas could also lower the octane rating = bad. I am not sure if you are aware that the last 3 failures had filled up just prior to the event. 2 just filled up and one within 40 miles. I am not saying bad gas is the only factor but a catalyst.

"Because it dilutes the octane rating of the fuel or stated otherwise it lowers the octane rating of the fuel = bad. Now you have fuel that you thought was 93 and the PCM was programmed to expect 93 but is really 91 or even lower."

I would think that bad gasoline would be a bigger concern than oil.

https://www.knowyourparts.com/technical-resources/fuel-system/bad-fuel-fact-or-fiction/
Probably. I cracked that plug insulator on #4 the ONLY time I filled up on Shell V-power gas. I had never used it before (always ran BP or Speedways locally). Yes the plugs were running a bit on the hot side for the application unbeknownst to me, but I don't think it's coincidence that all the highly tuned cars see a lot of knock when using shell gas AND I just happened to have detonation crack a plug insulator after a fill-up on shell gas way back.

That was running Livernois 93 tune on 93 Shell V-power with RR14YS plugs. Too much heat and too high volatility. Additive packages in fuels also vary widly from station to station and some most certainly have an impact. So does quality.

That's why I'm thinking at this point for a street car the best protection is the following (nor particular order, all of them work together):
1. 91 tune on 93 octane
2. Dexos 1 Gen 2 certified oil of your choice
3. OE Plugs or OE equivalent
4. Inter Cooler of your choice
5. Oil Cooler of your choice
6. 99% efficient non-oiled type air filter (OE paper or dry synthetics)

160F thermostat for those running Livernois tunes as they highly recommend running their thermostat. Yes it will alter the average cylinder head temps IF you have excess radiator capacity. If you don't then no it won't help (base models). Upgraded PP radiator for us base model guys is highly recommended. Everyone else just run the stock 180F thermostats.

Things that don't seem to matter:
1. Manual or Automatic
2. Spain or Cleveland built
3. Area you live in (people from all across the US have failed engines)

Things to be weary of that we see trends in (not 100% conclusive):
1. Shell V-power gas
2. Care with tuning for temperature and altitude
3. Signs of deposit buildup in the engine (may be a byproduct of poor fuel quality in your area or highly dusty environments or mod choice issues causing fouling)
4. If you suspect any issues, look into them instead of just ignoring them, what's the harm in flashing back to stock for a while or back to a less aggressive tune?

My personal suggestion is to at least run the Ford Performance Calibration for the first 36k miles. Think of it as an engine break in tune. You can at least have a good level of confidence your particular engine is mechanically sound, but if it is NOT, then your covered by warranty. I think is a better path for those wanting more power than the OE tune, because your pushing the engine harder, but while still under warranty. For $600~$700 it's cheap insurance!

Anyone else have anything to add to the list? Obviously tuning plays a big role, but that varies from tuner to tuner, so if you trust them, those are the things I can personally think of that are inside of your direct control.

Note that the oil cooler isn't just for oil life / boil off. It's for PISTON COOLING. These pistons are directly oil cooled and when they get too hot they begin to loose structural integrity. An oil cooler will have a direct impact on piston head temps as your pulling heat from the oil which is used to cool the pistons.

It think these cars should have come with an oil cooler from the factory. I think the RS and newer Focus ST's now do. I know the Lincoln variants using the 2.3T's come with a water to oil cooler. It's cheap insurance and directly related to knock, denotation, pre-ignition and LSPI. Oil has a very good thermal conductivity, so it's a great cooling transfer media, not just for lubrication. In fact most of the large transformers in sub-stations use convection based oil coolers as they are highly reliable, although they do have a tendency to burst into flames when something does actually go wrong...ok I'll stop posting now as I'm sure some is going to complain about me posting too much at some point ;-)
 
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Edkiefer

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I'm going to wager that modern knock sensors are pretty good. There's also TONS of processing power available as well in the ECU which wasn't just 10 years ago. But nothing is perfect and piston engines operate entirely off of historical data and prediction.

Predictive methods aren't perfect because they rely on averages or expectations which don't always pan out. When you play the odds, eventually you will loose. The real question is, can you play the odds long enough and in such a way that you won't loose within the engine's normal life span....

Piston failure makes sense though. They are not forged, just your standard hyper eutectic pistons, so nothing special material wise. I'm surprised they didn't have forged pistons, but it all has to do with cost savings. We all know you can build a bomb proof bottom end and run these street car tunes until the end of time without failure, but the cost from a factory engine like that would mean massive profit loss for the OE's and of course most of these engines run reliably for their life on the factory tuning so there's no incentive to do otherwise.
Forged is way to go on FI, as far as durability.

I think they stayed with cast this time for tight piston clearance (emissions/MPG etc), just like they use low tension piston rings.
I agree and think it combination of many factors, for daily driver best you can do is hedge your bets and help the % in your favor.
Run 91 tune on 93, run good oil with catch-can, intercooler, 0.028 plug gaps etc, anything that might help in small way.
The other problem, no matter its still 4 cylinder with one firing per rev so you have long load time on the piston/rod for given HP and rev, compared to V8, 300+HP/TQ is impressive even in stock form.
 
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TheLion

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Forged is way to go on FI, as far as durability.

I think they stayed with cast this time for tight piston clearance (emissions/MPG etc), just like they use low tension piston rings.
I agree and think it combination of many factors, for daily driver best you can do is hedge your bets and help the % in your favor.
Run 91 tune on 93, run good oil with catch-can, plug gaps etc, anything that might help in small way.
The other problem, no matter its still 4 cylinder with one firing per rev so you have long load time on the piston/rod for given HP and rev, compared to V8, 300+HP/TQ is impressive even in stock form.
Agreed, that's why I was suggesting running a less aggressive tune with higher octane. Fueling has a HUGE impact on safety margin as well. All engine timing strategies are predictive and "after the fact" based, the best hedge against damage is simply a large enough safety margin.

Even the "safer" tunes like FP have some level of risk as we have seen, but I think the above strategies combined with more mild tunes like the FP, Cobb Stage 1 or Livernois 91 are a good way to go for a street car with reasonably low level of risk, one of which is exceptionally low by the fact that it's still covered under warranty aka the FP calibration. Good quality oil though can have a significant impact on ring wear as well as the filter type at higher mileages. There's where maintenance becomes a big factor in maintaining power.
 

TheLion

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http://fordauthority.com/fmc/ford-motor-company-sales-numbers/ford-sales-numbers/ford-mustang-sales-numbers/

So far Ford has sold about 361,730 mustangs. I'll bet a good percentage of those are Ecoboost. That's a lot of mustangs...I would wager a decent amount of them are modified to some degree. Especially if Livernois claims on their "My Calibrator" sales are believable (about 250 a week on average they claim). What would be really interesting is to see how many Ford Performance tunes are sold and how many failure claims they get. Might be a good indication of how reliable these engines are with "street" suitable power levels.

I do recall an article from Ford Performance that after a simulated 60k mile test they did a tear down and found no abnormal signs of wear. Wear tolerances were not meaningfully different than a stock ecoboost, at least with their tuning. Certainly the further you push towards the limit the more wear you will incur.
 
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Mine had over 70k miles on the clock and the bearings in mine didn't show a bit of wear (much to our surprise). That's 70k miles of drag racing every weekend, big turbos with E85, high boost pressure, and seeing redline once a day or more. I took care of the engine and have done my due diligence as far as maintenance and it looked great inside.
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