2021 MUSTANG (S650) - 7th Generation Mustang Confirmed

Yes, the heads had or have an indentation for the injectors... but Ford engineers gave a very weak explanation at the time why they didn't include it - and reality was that it was purely cost considerations.
I'm all for VVL... I have an Infiniti with VVL (and a supercharger) and it's a airflow monster. This would be a great way to get even more airflow thru the Coyote or Voodoo, along with improving low-end torque and high-end. And it's aftermarket tunable and compatible with superchargers et al. But I think the first thing that could appear is cylinder shut-off for fuel economy purposes. Jaguar just added it to Ford's old V-12, and it's a known technology. The GM guys have a kit that deactivates theirs for extreme users (but for the rest it can get their pigs over 30 MPG on the highway).

Hmm, I wonder how much more cost, and what effect there would have been on fuel economy and power, had they gone with direct injection?

Might have been something I'd've been willing to pay for, but I say that without knowing how much the cost would've increased.

Some double digit number, nothing more. Look at the Camaro 6.2 before and after that engine got it, and then look at the cost of the SS model. That's the only way to get any kind of approximation, although the SS price increase obviously included the new chassis and other standard features. Needless to say it's a negligible price.

I for one am hoping for a TT V6 option, I find the turbo cars more fun to drive, and they are certainly easier to get cheap gains out of the aftermarket.
I'm beginning to think I need to whipple my GT!

Variable Displacement for the 5.0L

Topnotch said:

Variable Displacement for the 5.0L

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Here come the misinformed masses complaining about AFM/DOD.

Ford engineers are playing around with this, as well as my own personal favorite - variable lift. The technology is not hard, but it's the financials that are.
Again, I gotta wonder about the 5 liter here, because the F-150 program pays the architecture bills for that engine. And that engine just isn't the major strategy for the trucks. The strategy is the EcoBoost 2.7 and 3.5 - and tremendous things are happening with each. The updated 3.5 is the big news at the moment; the base version was just announced (with a big increase in TQ that the V-8 can't match), we should see the uplevel Raptor specs soon, and of course another uplevel version yet is going into the GT and everybody is looking forward to seeing the final specs of that engine. Those two engine families are where all the big investment of dollars and technology is.
Another thought: much has been said about DOD or cylinder shutoff on the LT1/LT4 of the Corvette and Camaro (and trucks since it's all the same family engine). This is a terrific technology, you can literally cruise your 'vette at 30MPG. So is Ford's reply to this - if there has to be a reply - DOD on the Coyote? Consider this: the answer is no, it's the 3.5EB.

drabon74 said:

I for one am hoping for a TT V6 option, I find the turbo cars more fun to drive, and they are certainly easier to get cheap gains out of the aftermarket.
I'm beginning to think I need to whipple my GT!

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I'm with you on that one.

Drive a Supra TT mk4 sometime, with the very slight mods required to get to 400 or 500 or 600 or more. That's one heckuva fun drive, asymmetrical as it is, and the engine is built like a battleship. You'll never go back to naturally aspirated anything after that.

S550Boss said:

Another thought: much has been said about DOD or cylinder shutoff on the LT1/LT4 of the Corvette and Camaro (and trucks since it's all the same family engine). This is a terrific technology, you can literally cruise your 'vette at 30MPG. So is Ford's reply to this - if there has to be a reply - DOD on the Coyote? Consider this: the answer is no, it's the 3.5EB.

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I dunno, I feel like if people had to choose between one or the other, most would pick DOD over a 3.5EB, me included. I'm hoping Ford offers a DOD 5.0 along with the 3.5. Even if the 3.5EB were made to sound like a 1000HP GT-R, it still just wouldn't be the same without the V8 in the lineup.

So with DOD, you don't get any performance increase... you get a naturally aspired 4- or 6-cylinder engine when you are off the gas.
Drive a 5 liter F-150 some time, compare it against a 3.5EB F-150. There is no comparison. The majority of the market has swung over to the 3.5EB, and it is continuing to grow. With the 2nd gen this fall, 450 torque, and it's 10-speed auto, even more will buy the 3.5EB. Think about it: almost 70 lb-ft more than the Coyote.
An interesting event to attend was Ford's EcoBoost Challenge (not held this year). In it, you drove an EcoBoost 3.5 F-150 on an autocross track against the equivalent Chevy truck (but with a V-8). The difference in drivability, performance, and handling and braking was huge. Ford does have a better idea.
Certainly there will be a 5 liter engine in the next Mustang... but if there is a 3.5EB in the Mustang, there will be a swing in the Mustang market too.

mikeyjobu said:

To me, if there's no V8, there's no Mustang. Keep a RWD sports coupe around put a turbo 6 or 4 in it, and call it something else -- I'm game -- but let's keep our Mustangs proper Mustangs, please.

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I get what you're saying, and yes I do think a V8 should be offered as long as it's viable. Even if only in the top level Mustang. Where I differ is this idea of a "proper" Mustang. V6's and 4 cylinders have been in these cars since the beginning. They proven over the decades to outsell the V8 in total sales by a wide margin. If it wasn't for these lesser engines, Mustang most likely wouldn't be a nameplate still around anymore. We all love the V8, but if the GT goes to a TT V6 or someday all electric or Hydrogen powered, well I'm okay with that too. Mustang isn't just an engine, it's the whole package. The styling, handling and performance overall. It's also about the idea. A great car that's affordable, giving high style and performance for the masses without breaking the bank. So Mustang will always be a proper Mustang as long as it has all the things that made it great, which is far more than the V8. :ford::ford::ford:

Stam616 said:

I get what you're saying, and yes I do think a V8 should be offered as long as it's viable. Even if only in the top level Mustang. Where I differ is this idea of a "proper" Mustang. V6's and 4 cylinders have been in these cars since the beginning. They proven over the decades to outsell the V8 in total sales by a wide margin. If it wasn't for these lesser engines, Mustang most likely wouldn't be a nameplate still around anymore. We all love the V8, but if the GT goes to a TT V6 or someday all electric or Hydrogen powered, well I'm okay with that too. Mustang isn't just an engine, it's the whole package. The styling, handling and performance overall. It's also about the idea. A great car that's affordable, giving high style and performance for the masses without breaking the bank. So Mustang will always be a proper Mustang as long as it has all the things that made it great, which is far more than the V8. :ford::ford::ford:

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I don't say that Mustang's that don't have V8's aren't Mustangs - merely that without a V8 offering, it's not a Mustang. If the Mustang is offered without a V8, it will be solely due to economies of scale, hence no V8, no Mustang.

I'm saying if the V8 is to die, let the nameplate die with it, and offer a spiritual successor. Heck -- I like the idea of having a hybrid V8 a la some supercars, but with a manual transmission like the Honda CRZ (now dying -- shoulda put some power into it -- but i digress...)

So these new ecoboost V6's are crushing it on torque. Fusion sport's 2.7 will have what 380 ft/lbs. The MKZ's new 3.0 will have 400 ft/lbs?

Then I see this engine comparison of a Coyote vs LS: http://www.enginelabs.com/engine-te...coyote-budget-shootout-results-the-winner-is/

The 5.0 had a nice high HP #, but the torque was bout stock. I'm guessing boost of course would fix that...but it would be nice to see some displacement increase.