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Stereo Information (Wiring, Upgrades, etc...)

KonaBlue

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Hello, I have a 2017 v6 Mustang with the 6 speaker set up, I'm planning to to change the four 6.5 speakers with better quality ones but will keep the standard head unit.

Anybody knows the power output and impedance of standard radio ?

Can I install coaxial speakers in the doors or does the the present setup works like a component system with the tweeters, cutting high frequency to the door speakers ?

I've been going in circles searching the internet trying to find answers to these simple questions with no luck, any help would be greatly appreciated, Thanks.
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So i took my door panel off and went on a measuring spree:

Front 6.5" Speaker
Mounting hole: 5.75" diameter
Spacer: 1" depth + .25" foam
Speaker with spacer: 2.75" depth
Stock Magnet: 2 7/8" width
Mounting Depth: 5.5"

Window rolled all the way down:
Depth partially reduced to 2.75"
Window protrusion in mounting hole: 1" of the 5.75" diameter

Front 3.5" Midrange
Mounting Hole: 3" diameter
Spacer: 1" depth + .25" foam
Mounting Depth: 1.25"
Stock Magnet: 1 1/8" width
.
DOes anyone know if...

Spacer: 1" depth + .25" foam
Speaker with spacer: 2.75" depth

this spacer the OP mentioned is the old speaker with the guts cut out?...If so...can i assume that with the remaining plastic ring the max speaker depth is 2.75"?

Thanks
 

Ninjak

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What a read...All 31 pages. So my 350 has the 9 speaker setup. I am not that great with audio setups..SO I want some more base. nothing crazy, just crisper sound would be nice. I have a Audiocontrol LC7i laying about and a RF 240.4 4 channel amp. Could I have these units installed and get better sound ? Perhaps get some better speakers along the way with these units ? I have no clue. just things from my old setup and the LC7i was picked up.

Thanks in advance.
 

acull2000

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[MENTION=16062]rambunctious[/MENTION] [MENTION=20499]mumbles[/MENTION] [MENTION=25138]Fenix[/MENTION]

Having unpinned the 6 "Noise cancellation" signals I can confirm the "Engine Sound Enhancement (ESE)" (fake noise) is now gone. Thanks to you guys for that.

It got me thinking - are the 3 pairs of cables (pins 9-14 on the amp below) really all used for Noise Cancellation (NC)? It seems weird that pins 9 and 10 are not shielded with pins 11-14?

Do any of you guys know the exact nature of the signal on these three pairs? I had thought they were front/rear/sub pairs, but that would seem overkill for noise cancellation. Is it possible that pins 11-14 are front/rear Noise Cancellation pairs, and cables 9 and 10 are related to the "Engine Sound Enhancement"?

I could test this myself, but although I have a way to test if ESE is active, I do not know how to test if the NC is active - any ideas?


I think you may have just helped me to identify exactly which pins to remove from the amp to disable the fake engine noises once and for all :)
S550Head2Amp.png
 

mumbles

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You could use both pieces, but if you are planning on driving subwoofers, 120wpc (2 channel bridged) will need some pretty efficient speakers to get very loud.
 

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mumbles

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@rambunctious @mumbles @Fenix

Having unpinned the 6 "Noise cancellation" signals I can confirm the "Engine Sound Enhancement (ESE)" (fake noise) is now gone. Thanks to you guys for that.

It got me thinking - are the 3 pairs of cables (pins 9-14 on the amp below) really all used for Noise Cancellation (NC)? It seems weird that pins 9 and 10 are not shielded with pins 11-14?

Do any of you guys know the exact nature of the signal on these three pairs? I had thought they were front/rear/sub pairs, but that would seem overkill for noise cancellation. Is it possible that pins 11-14 are front/rear Noise Cancellation pairs, and cables 9 and 10 are related to the "Engine Sound Enhancement"?

I could test this myself, but although I have a way to test if ESE is active, I do not know how to test if the NC is active - any ideas?
It is my understanding that sound enhancement is only present in the Ecoboost and can be defeated either by modifying data in the ASM via Forscan or by disconnecting the mic in the rear headliner (or near map lights in the vert).

As for the shielding, not sure if it's because they are on separate plugs or ?
 

acull2000

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Thanks for quick reply. Had forgotten most aren't fussed by this as sound enhancement is Ecoboost only. I guess V8s have the same 3 pairs (which could either indicate all 6 wires are needed for noise cancellation, or that Ford fitted the same harness to all vehicles for cost measures).

Unpinning the harness is the preferred way to remove ESE:
  • Modifying ACM parameter (727-01-01 XX*X-XXXX-XX) in Forscan only tricks the car into thinking it's a base model and sends speaker level outputs to the amp. This disables ESE (and probably ANC too), but obviously stereo quality is compromised.
  • Disconnecting the mic disables ANC (but not ESE!).

I fear disabling ANC also reduces bluetooth call quality, so am curious how to retain ANC whilst keeping ESE disabled. Any tests I can do to check whether ANC is enabled/disabled?
 

mumbles

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Thanks for quick reply. Had forgotten most aren't fussed by this as sound enhancement is Ecoboost only. I guess V8s have the same 3 pairs (which could either indicate all 6 wires are needed for noise cancellation, or that Ford fitted the same harness to all vehicles for cost measures).

Unpinning the harness is the preferred way to remove ESE:
  • Modifying ACM parameter (727-01-01 XX*X-XXXX-XX) in Forscan only tricks the car into thinking it's a base model and sends speaker level outputs to the amp. This disables ESE (and probably ANC too), but obviously stereo quality is compromised.

  • Disconnecting the mic disables ANC (but not ESE!).

I fear disabling ANC also reduces bluetooth call quality, so am curious how to retain ANC whilst keeping ESE disabled. Any tests I can do to check whether ANC is enabled/disabled?
Since the tweeters and mids are run in parallel in the three way system, I would tend to think that the 3 pairs of wires are run to the 6.5's, the mid/tweet combo, and the rears, but I could be mistaken.

I havent played with the ASM at all, so I can't comment there, but from all accounts, disabling the mic removes a low freq rumble often heard in the factory sub which sounds like some sort of sound enhancement?
 

acull2000

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I am sure disconnecting the mic does not deactivate the Engine Sound Enhancement - this can be tested on vehicles tuned with an Accessport (where the tune slot is indicated using the rev counter) - when changing tune slots the stereo can be heard emitting the "growling" noise depending on rpm. This happens even with engine off, showing the ESE is active.

Disconnecting the mic does not disable this effect, but I imagine it does trip up the ANC.

I can only image those people disconnecting the mic are disabling ANC, which in cars with any acoustic mods (exhaust, tune, cabin/ stereo mods), may also remove any untoward noises from the sub, caused by a mis-match of stock ANC and the new acoustics of their particular vehicle.

Still looking for a way to test for presence of ANC and I can prove this!
 

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djcwardog

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Swapped in different Kicker woofers in doors

I got a good deal online for a Kicker component set KSS67. This has what they report as a 6 3/4" woofer but it fit exactly in place of the coaxial 6.5" speaker I had installed a month ago as part of the Stage 3 Motorsports car set.

So, I paid just over a hundred bucks for the component set and installed just the bare woofer. While I there, I removed the 3.5" coaxial midrange speakers and clipped the positive wire running to the Tweeter portion. I taped that off and reinstalled everything.

My sound check was awesome! I have now reduced just about all the extreme harshness that I complained of before.

I still have the 1" tweeters from the KSS67 component set and I may see if I can swap those in the A pillars in place of the 3/4" teeeters already there. I would retain the inline filters and just connect the 1" to those. I would end up with unused 3/4" tweeters and the new crossover boxes.

Making these changes may well be the way to go if wanting to use all Kicker speakers.

I still have to complete my subwoofer connection project with the new DSP u it I bought. Been busy lately!
 

mumbles

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I got a good deal online for a Kicker component set KSS67. This has what they report as a 6 3/4" woofer but it fit exactly in place of the coaxial 6.5" speaker I had installed a month ago as part of the Stage 3 Motorsports car set.

So, I paid just over a hundred bucks for the component set and installed just the bare woofer. While I there, I removed the 3.5" coaxial midrange speakers and clipped the positive wire running to the Tweeter portion. I taped that off and reinstalled everything.

My sound check was awesome! I have now reduced just about all the extreme harshness that I complained of before.

I still have the 1" tweeters from the KSS67 component set and I may see if I can swap those in the A pillars in place of the 3/4" teeeters already there. I would retain the inline filters and just connect the 1" to those. I would end up with unused 3/4" tweeters and the new crossover boxes.

Making these changes may well be the way to go if wanting to use all Kicker speakers.

I still have to complete my subwoofer connection project with the new DSP u it I bought. Been busy lately!
So if I read this correctly, you would wind up with the tweeters and woofers from the Kicker set and the mid from the Stage 3 set minus the tweeter? Sounds like that would work.
What DSP unit are looking at and how are you going to tie it in with the rest of the system?
 

djcwardog

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To clarify - Kicker speakers

I am going to give this kit a try:

http://www.stage3motorsports.com/15...ker-Complete-KS-Series-9-Speaker-Package.html

This should make for a decent baseline over stock. This kit requires you to cut the baskets out of the stock 6.5" speakers (thereby destroying them) so you can use those mounting rings for the 6.5" Kickers. No sweat as this will ensure a good door seal along with some dynamat of course. Silk dome tweeters ought to be quite an upgrade over the stock stuff in my 400A car. However, I don't get why the Kicker kit sources a total of four coax speakers for the 6.5" locations. I can always use a low pass filter to choke off the highs going to my lower doors - otherwise I will have a total of seven tweeters up front!

I will try these out along with a factory sub in the back and go from there. I can always go with external amps and Focal speakers later if this does not satisfy me. Unlike prior BMW cars I have had where they ran so quiet that top-line audio upgrades really sounded fine, my GT runs a bit loud. However, it makes good music from the coyote 5.0 so I want to keep the stereo expectations in line with my new reality, a beast of a car - which I love.
Basically, I tried all of this set first. Highs were just way too much with all those tweeters involved. So, I just got the KSS67 set and simply pulled out the 6.5" coax and put in the bare woofer drivers from this new set. While I had the door panels off, I pulled out the 3.5" coax speakers and disabled the tweeters on them by snipping the positive lead near the magnet and taping things well to avoid a short. Result - far better sound because the highs are no longer saturated in the car.

As for the "DSP" questions - I am referring to the stock Ford amp which they call the "DSP" and this is what you address in FORscan when programming. I am now able to tolerate using the Ford "driver" setting with fader and balance set back to zero, treble down 2 and bass up 2. I will soon make the attempt to finish getting the factory subwoofer involved. It is still silent as I had other things to do these past few weeks!
 

cking

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I am sure disconnecting the mic does not deactivate the Engine Sound Enhancement - this can be tested on vehicles tuned with an Accessport (where the tune slot is indicated using the rev counter) - when changing tune slots the stereo can be heard emitting the "
Still looking for a way to test for presence of ANC and I can prove this!
ANC is only on ecoboost
ESE is only on GT350
ANC is disabled by open door or trunk lid

I believe the reason for 3 pairs noise cancel lines is the ANC/ESE is only feed to door woofers and shaker. On GT350 rear shelf speakers are woofers and feed ESE

see factory service notes at
http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89170
 

rambunctious

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ANC is only on ecoboost
ESE is only on GT350
ANC is disabled by open door or trunk lid

I believe the reason for 3 pairs noise cancel lines is the ANC/ESE is only feed to door woofers and shaker. On GT350 rear shelf speakers are woofers and feed ESE

see factory service notes at
http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89170
ecoboost and GT350 have ESE
ESE in GT350 was the big surprise for many of those buyers......
Ramb
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