Hybrid Turbo Possibilities

Just throwing this out there to see what the obstacles and/or restrictions are regarding the creation of a hybrid Turbo for the ecoboost mustang. I'm wondering if it's possible to create a turbo using the stock turbine housing with an upgraded compressor side? Ideally in my mind, a similar spooling turbo as stock with a compressor capable of flowing enough air for 425-450whp? For those familiar with the Mazdaspeed platform, the equivalent to the S3 or s4 turbos? It seems the GTX series turbos have this, but at an increased expense. If the hybrid is possible it could come in as a cheaper alternative. Thoughts?

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Interesting, I'd give it a shot of it were priced below the Vargas stage 2

Vargus had the Stage 1 which was a reworked stock unit. I don't remember the horsepower ratings of that turbo, but it's similar to the work you've described.

Hybrids will be the wave of the future for our cars, I am more than confident with that statement. We now have the Vargas 2, which is basically a Hybrid, but capable of higher HP #s than your asking for, hence why it naturally wont spool like stock. The Cavalli could be something that might fall right into what your asking for. It might take time for manufacturers to see that there's a market for a Hybrid of this sort, but it will come. Forced Performance could be a major player in this market as well if they chose to be, and Tony Vargas might do something a bit smaller if there's a market for it.

Juben said:

Vargus had the Stage 1 which was a reworked stock unit. I don't remember the horsepower ratings of that turbo, but it's similar to the work you've described.

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The Vargas Stage 1 did have an upgraded compressor wheel, but I don't think it had a bigger compressor housing. I guess this is where the hybrid aspect would come in. Is it possible to have the compressor from the Vargas Stage 2 mated to the Vargas Stage 1 turbine side? There may be limitations.there that I'm just unaware of...?

TEXAS HEAT said:

The Vargas Stage 1 did have an upgraded compressor wheel, but I don't think it had a bigger compressor housing. I guess this is where the hybrid aspect would come in. Is it possible to have the compressor from the Vargas Stage 2 mated to the Vargas Stage 1 turbine side? There may be limitations.there that I'm just unaware of...?

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The problem with that situation, is that the Stage 2 Compressor wheel is designed to move quite a bit of air , say 500 - 550 HP, and the stock turbine wheel is very small, and the stock turbine housing and wheel combo is restricted to roughly 400 hp or so ( guesstimate ) Not a good mix.

perfweld said:

Hybrids will be the wave of the future for our cars, I am more than confident with that statement. We now have the Vargas 2, which is basically a Hybrid, but capable of higher HP #s than your asking for, hence why it naturally wont spool like stock. The Cavalli could be something that might fall right into what your asking for. It might take time for manufacturers to see that there's a market for a Hybrid of this sort, but it will come. Forced Performance could be a major player in this market as well if they chose to be, and Tony Vargas might do something a bit smaller if there's a market for it.

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At least for me... a turbo that spools quickly to give that area under the curve like stock (400rwtq @ 3100 and 425-450whp at 5000rpm all the way to 6500rpm) sounds just about right to me!

TEXAS HEAT said:

At least for me... a turbo that spools quickly to give that area under the curve like stock (400rwtq @ 3100 and 425-450whp at 5000rpm all the way to 6500rpm) sounds just about right to me!

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Remember, you cant have everything, you cant have the instant spool, and have it pull to 6500, there has to be a trade off. You might have to trade 500 RPM down low for 500 up high. That would be an excellent trade, but, try to find a manufacturer that will to make a turbo just that little bit bigger, and put it into production. As I said before, Hybrids will be the wave of the future, so what your seeking would be a custom Hybrid we could call it, but im sure in a few years once these cars get more popular, well have lots of options.

perfweld said:

Remember, you cant have everything, you cant have the instant spool, and have it pull to 6500, there has to be a trade off. You might have to trade 500 RPM down low for 500 up high. That would be an excellent trade, but, try to find a manufacturer that will to make a turbo just that little bit bigger, and put it into production. As I said before, Hybrids will be the wave of the future, so what your seeking would be a custom Hybrid we could call it, but im sure in a few years once these cars get more popular, well have lots of options.

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You mean to say that I can't have my cake and eat it too? Lol!

I realize there's always a sacrifice, I'm just hopeful that as this platform develops we will have more options to satisfy my needs/desires. I'm hoping that what you're saying comes to fruition and there will be plenty of choices available for what I'm willing to spend.

Yeah, the Vargas Stage 1 used stock housings machined out to accept larger wheels. This hybrid would ideally be a new compressor wheel bolted to the stock shaft and a larger compressor housing, only requiring a rebalancing of the rotating assembly. The lack of custom parts or machine labor required should keep prices low. (5-700)The hot side would be the restriction but I could see 400/400 out of this turbo with a much healthier top end and minimal spool loss making it a great solution for those whom spool is more important than top end (drag racers) or a more linear top end (road course )

A GTX2867R would work well for keeping near stock spool with about 425hp. The EFR7163 would also be a very good option for that target.

Like the others have said though, the stock frame with a compressor wheel big enough to support 425-450 would be hugely mismatched for the stock turbine side and would have piss poor performance, to say the least.

Also, one thing to consider. When you mate a huge compressor with a tiny turbine the leverage that the compressor has over the turbine eats thrust bearings.

Juben said:

A GTX2867R would work well for keeping near stock spool with about 425hp. The EFR7163 would also be a very good option for that target.

Like the others have said though, the stock frame with a compressor wheel big enough to support 425-450 would be hugely mismatched for the stock turbine side and would have piss poor performance, to say the least.

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I love that 7163, it does seem like such a great turbo, quick spool, and a ton of power. I think the CPE kit is gonna be the best kit out there with the cast stainless manifold. But that being said, I think a lot of us dont want to veer from the stock appearing / location turbo. I like my car to be stock looking, its killing me to put AUX fuel on it, but I have to with the direction im going and am at now. I am confident there will be more manufacturers that will build hybrids. The problem I can see though is that if the cost is not low, there will be no sales, if there are no sales, manufacturers will lose interest.

ZenkaiRacer said:

Also, one thing to consider. When you mate a huge compressor with a tiny turbine the leverage that the compressor has over the turbine eats thrust bearings.

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And we have that small 5mm shaft, that will be a huge issue on the hybrid, they all need to really start from scratch, which drives the cost up.