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Whipple to Custom Tune for Stage 2 Whipple

TooSoonJunior

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For those of you who switched from the Whipple tune to a custom tune, can you post up what track time improvements and/or power gains you saw?

Really interested to see folks who didn't make major mods on the switch of tuner but kept things the same pre and post. And also guys that went tuner kit from the get go but are running a stockish stage 2 kit.
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RockStang

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Went from 11.0x to 10.7x on the 3.6 pulley. Technically I went a 10.7 on the Whipple tune once by manually shifting but Went 10.7s consistently with PBD tune with the auto doing the shifting. Then I went 10.5x on the 3.5 pulley and Octanium. This was all 1500-2k DA. Then when I got some good air I went 10.3x. This was all stock Stage 2 Whipple with no other changes to the car. The car is worlds different now so that’s where the comparisons stop.
 

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really depends on how much your changing, are you adding better fuel? samller pulley, etc.

we have quite a few customers that switch, alot are adding headers, going e85 etc.
 
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TooSoonJunior

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No changes, keeping everything as is.

I am continually being told the Whipple tune is weak especially at the track and a custom tune, all things equal, is a world of difference in power.
 

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TooSoonJunior

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TooSoonJunior

TooSoonJunior

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Thanks, I am trying to sift through all the folks that went custom tune when THEY HAD NO CHOICE, as the Whipple tune is for just that, a base whipple setup.

The argument is clearly being made that a whipple tune for a stock whipple setup will underperform a custom tune for the same setup.

Just not finding the support, everyone with improvements modified their car in some way that necessitated getting a custom tune, and then those folks are coming back saying the custom tune was a huge improvement in power and performance over the whipple tune and the whipple tune is weak. Doesn't make any sense.
 

Matt@Lethal

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Thanks, I am trying to sift through all the folks that went custom tune when THEY HAD NO CHOICE, as the Whipple tune is for just that, a base whipple setup.

The argument is clearly being made that a whipple tune for a stock whipple setup will underperform a custom tune for the same setup.

Just not finding the support, everyone with improvements modified their car in some way that necessitated getting a custom tune, and then those folks are coming back saying the custom tune was a huge improvement in power and performance over the whipple tune and the whipple tune is weak. Doesn't make any sense.
I think it'll be hard to find someone who just converted to a custom tune without changing anything. Whipple will be limited to what they can tune for, so most of the time when people change, there are additional mods or changes that are making them switch.

All in all, I personally feel like it would still be a solid investment. Being able to provide logs and have the car dialed in perfectly with no additional power would still be worth it to me.

Matt
 
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TooSoonJunior

TooSoonJunior

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I think it'll be hard to find someone who just converted to a custom tune without changing anything. Whipple will be limited to what they can tune for, so most of the time when people change, there are additional mods or changes that are making them switch.

All in all, I personally feel like it would still be a solid investment. Being able to provide logs and have the car dialed in perfectly with no additional power would still be worth it to me.

Matt
I hear that. I have converted from the Whipple tune and tweaked it with HP Tuners. I have done NOTHING to the torque control/timing/fueling as it is dead nuts dialed in (STFT's are 0.50 to 1.0, LTFT are 0.00 under WOT), seeing 18.5 to 19.5* of timing with a 3.625 pulley on 93 octane. Have full logging ability with HP Tuners VCM scanner, I am still using the Whipple operating system and the Flare tool settings still function.

Only things ive tweaked is the startup timing, fuel cut method for the rev limiter (changed to mostly spark instead of shutting off injectors), took off shift rpm hang, and added some idle torque and lowered idle rpms.
 

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I hear that. I have converted from the Whipple tune and tweaked it with HP Tuners. I have done NOTHING to the torque control/timing/fueling as it is dead nuts dialed in (STFT's are 0.50 to 1.0, LTFT are 0.00 under WOT), seeing 18.5 to 19.5* of timing with a 3.625 pulley on 93 octane. Have full logging ability with HP Tuners VCM scanner, I am still using the Whipple operating system and the Flare tool settings still function.

Only things ive tweaked is the startup timing, fuel cut method for the rev limiter (changed to mostly spark instead of shutting off injectors), took off shift rpm hang, and added some idle torque and lowered idle rpms.
How much did these tweaks improve the driving experience?

When you make the edits with HP tuners, do you save the tune file and use the Whipple Flare program and flare tool to upload the tune?

I'm considering going with a custom tune now that I have headers, but would really like to keep the whipple flight control if possible. The idea of using the stock whipple tune as a base is quite appealing to me. Especially if I can save money by using the whipple flare tool/ cantaloupe to flash the tunes instead and not be required to purchase an SCT/etc.
 
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TooSoonJunior

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How much did these tweaks improve the driving experience?

When you make the edits with HP tuners, do you save the tune file and use the Whipple Flare program and flare tool to upload the tune?

I'm considering going with a custom tune now that I have headers, but would really like to keep the whipple flight control if possible. The idea of using the stock whipple tune as a base is quite appealing to me. Especially if I can save money by using the whipple flare tool/ cantaloupe to flash the tunes instead and not be required to purchase an SCT/etc.
You save the tune with HP Tuners, and reupload with HP Tuners. All the Whipple Flight functions still work, its a separate software and works on top of whatever tune is in the car. That said, HP Tuners has all the same functions now being testing in real world on several cars, another few weeks and should be all done. The changes I made really were prob only worth a few horsepower, nothing that major. But I had HP Tuners already so I figured why not.

Your ECM is more than capable of handling the headers without a tune change, but you'll be leaving some power on the table but not much more than the same amount of power left on the table by just simply using Whipple's tune in the first place.
 

superman07

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Realistically what is a third party tune going to do? Your AFR and trims are already good, you can tweak your timing yourself if your not seeing any knock activity, maybe tweak cam timing on a dyno?

I respect the hell out of Palm Beach Dyno and if I went anywhere that would probably be the place. They have a awesome reputation for the trans shifting work they do. But you also give up the ability to see, and adjust your own tune. I would try to find a tuner that would be willing to get you on the dyno and use your credits to make the final changes so you don't end up with a locked tune that nets 5-10hp.

my very limited 2 cents.
 
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TooSoonJunior

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Well for starters, Whipple tune commands a richer than needed AFR.

The fuel cut logic (redline) straight up sucks. It works in sequence to first close the throttle body, then cut spark, then cut fuel. I don't know about you but having my throttle body closing 2-300rpms before my rev limit every gear at peak power is worth SOMETHING. A lot of people don't realize this unless you log the car with SCT or HP Tuners. With my rev limiter set to 7800, at 7400-7500 my throttle body would close down 15-20% by 7800. Whipple said this is just how both Ford and Whipple calibrate the car. Creates a soft rev limit.

And my cold start, cold driving experience was not great, had surging and throttle hang. Maybe they fixed it since last year, but I fixed it with about 3 minutes of tuning.

And then you have the entire race fuel / non gasoline tuning. No way is a Whipple calibration going to get you max power when you start adding octane boosters, race fuel, etc. I would guess less than half of people who actually get to the track don't actually try to induce some sort of octane boost to their vehicle. Would be nice to command some more timing and give the knock logic more room to go than allowed by Whipple (capped at 4* max advance IIRC).
 
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stang17

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Do you know if the whipple cantaloupe device can load tunes from HP tuners?

www.evans-tuning.com is close to me and use HP tuners to tune.

I was thinking about having them tune my car, but was hoping I'd be able to get out of purchasing another tuning device to flash my vehicle in case the need ever arises.
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