2017 R Production Nos. - Straight from Flatrock

Edward said:

I don't understand this kind of logic. How are they devaluing the R model? They are not delivering less product. Nor are they raising the prices for the same product. Remember that Ford gets no additional revenue for dealer-charged ADM's; that's pure profit-taking on the part of the dealers. So if Ford decides to build more high-margin vehicles to meet the under-served demand, their revenues are up and dealers will sell more cars - albeit at a lower ADM. The only folks that should be annoyed are those that have paid ADM's with the assumption that they'd recoup it somehow like all the used R's on ebay that don't seem to sell.

I also really can't comprehend any way that this is not good for "future purchasers."

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You said it yourself..... supply and demand. Demand high with a lower supply means the value of th vehicle will be higher for current and collector value.

I get it..... people want widespread availability to bring the price down. My skin in the game is an ADM that is about to be assigned a VIN on an agreed upon price at a value based upon past and projected production. Nobody saw this one coming.

As Epiphany stated, this could be the last hurrah leading into a short year for the next best thing. If that's the case, I'm ok with that. My current 350 was a MSRP deal. I'm not a big fan of handing over extra gobs of money for a car that has been on order for over a year to suddenly find out that they are going to pull out all the stops and break from precedence.

Your skin in the game is an R that you would normally not buy due to the cost. My skin in the game is not paying a big ADM to find out they are changing production numbers and changing the value of the car. And yes, this would affect the value of the R.

JT1 said:

Cool! Hopefully another 1000 for 2018! I'd love to get an R at the price ford intended.

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Exactly....:cheers:

This is AWESOME news!

I agree, only the GT350R speculators are going to object. If you are truly enjoying the car for the wonderful piece of engineering it is, you should be happy they are making more!

Tomster said:

Your skin in the game is an R that you would normally not buy due to the cost. My skin in the game is not paying a big ADM to find out they are changing production numbers and changing the value of the car. And yes, this would affect the value of the R.

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I think you're conflating cost and value as well as the concept of skin in the game. I have ZERO skin in the game as I've spent nothing to date. The cost of the a marked-up R is not what's preventing me from purchasing, it's the value - or rather the lack thereof. At MSRP, or slightly above, I think the R is a solid value. Going into five-figure ADM's, I think it's less so. At that price-point, there are simply other cars I'd be interested in. If I don't find an R at a price I'm satisfied with, I'll order an M3. They're very different cars; but I'm weird that way.

You do have skin in the game because you made your deal on an assumption of exclusivity that may not pan out. However it turns out, you had to know that there was no promise of production limits by Ford - especially when they're hurting for revenue.

MustangGT350 said:

This is AWESOME news!

I agree, only the GT350R speculators are going to object. If you are truly enjoying the car for the wonderful piece of engineering it is, you should be happy they are making more!

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I am not a speculator. I drive and track mine and plan to do the same with the R. Everything has a value based upon supply and demand. The supply has been altered. The value of the car has changed.

Edward said:

I have ZERO skin in the game as I've spent nothing to date.

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Agreed.

We should be seeing evidence of this higher production soon, but so far call me skeptical as the evidence even of widespread $5-9k ADMs is evading me. So far, chassis numbers of cars just produced seem to be hitting the 400s (and have we gone above 4000 in the regular GT350s), nationwide searches are not bringing up a lot more cars in the most desirable colors, websites such eBay, auto trader, cars.com, etc are not showing more inventory moving at lower prices and used ones are being sold in the low 80s (an R just did locally), and for new inventory, local dealers aren't budging on their R markups, even for future production. The last official word from Ford itself was that 10% of production would be Rs. Considering the Carbon Revolution CF wheels are manufactured in a small-scale extreme quality controlled/tested process with long lead times, doubling production of the Rs in an abrupt decision contradicting what Ford has maintained (and had a chance to update with the 2018 info) doesn't feel right.

Would be fantastic if true as would put this car in a lot more hands, but kind of get the sense that these various anecdotes (and of course there are exceptions) don't seem to match the current supply/demand realities. We'll soon find out!

Tomster said:

If this is true, Ford will be devaluing the R model. Not to turn this into an ADM discussion, but if they double the production numbers, people will be less willing to pay up. I dont see this as good for past or future purchasers. I hope this turns out to be a false story.

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Tomster said:

I am not a speculator. I drive and track mine and plan to do the same with the R. Everything has a value based upon supply and demand. The supply has been altered. The value of the car has changed.

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Oh I understand. If I currently had an R or had one coming and was locked on a price, I'd want Ford to decrease production so mine maintained value. Who doesn't want a hot car with low production #'s?

If you're honestly not worried about the price of your car (hence, investment), you'd be happy they were producing more. Most cars lose value when you drive them off the lot.. you'd still lose less on this car than most. What if your car got totaled? Isn't it better that you could more easily replace this car that you loved?

R prices have already been much, much lower than last years prices (before they announced 2X the production #'s), so it is what it is. You still own an incredible track car, enjoy it and don't worry that others will have something as awesome as you.

Tomster said:

If this is true, Ford will be devaluing the R model. Not to turn this into an ADM discussion, but if they double the production numbers, people will be less willing to pay up. I dont see this as good for past or future purchasers. I hope this turns out to be a false story.

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Ford is devaluing them in the secondary market, which doesnt impact Ford corporate at all. Not at all unexpected given how hard Ford has been hit lately.

MustangGT350 said:

Oh I understand. If I currently had an R or had one coming and was locked on a price, I'd want Ford to decrease production so mine maintained value. Who doesn't want a hot car with low production #'s?

If you're honestly not worried about the price of your car (hence, investment), you'd be happy they were producing more. Most cars lose value when you drive them off the lot.. you'd still lose less on this car than most. What if your car got totaled? Isn't it better that you could more easily replace this car that you loved?

R prices have already been much, much lower than last years prices (before they announced 2X the production #'s), so it is what it is. You still own an incredible track car, enjoy it and don't worry that others will have something as awesome as you.

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I don't ever plan to sell the car. However why would I be happy to pay more for it than I have to based upon Ford's 10% R production?

So why the attitude? Read your last sentence. Please don't make this personal, OK?

In my opinion R's are not worth the ADM.
sure you get carbon wheels and aero but woopie.
The main difference is collector status. I'd love to have one though. The dealer I bought my 16 track pack from just received a all black R and asking $98K. Fk that.
I'll never pay over what I paid for my track pack. Fords fit and finish quality still sucks.

MustangGT350 said:

Oh I understand. If I currently had an R or had one coming and was locked on a price, I'd want Ford to decrease production so mine maintained value. Who doesn't want a hot car with low production #'s?

If you're honestly not worried about the price of your car (hence, investment), you'd be happy they were producing more. Most cars lose value when you drive them off the lot.. you'd still lose less on this car than most. What if your car got totaled? Isn't it better that you could more easily replace this car that you loved?

R prices have already been much, much lower than last years prices (before they announced 2X the production #'s), so it is what it is. You still own an incredible track car, enjoy it and don't worry that others will have something as awesome as you.

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News flash.
The insurance company does not care about the adm you paid. And if it did get totaled you'll only get at or near sticker cost. Either way you lose.
EVERY car looses value once you drive it off the lot.
Try it once. Buy it, turn around and go back into the dealer and see what they will give you. Do you think a GT350 or GT350R will bring sticker price if you trade or return the car? HELL NO.
If a R stickers for $68000 and adm is say 20k for a selling price of $88k. The dealer will not even give you $68k for it.

my dealer told me it is 1000 units last week for 2017, i didn't believe him and told him that must be a mistake or maybe you were told its for gt350. Now im believing what he was told is true .My R is HR534 ruby red built 05/09

Weird that they plan on building 17's right until September when they started being built early June last year. Can only assume that it is at least a guarantee of a "short" MY18 for whatever special edition Mustang is coming.

Muligan said:

That would solve the problem of how to deal with the mandated back-up camera for MY'18 cars. Just build them early and call them '17s.

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Why would the MY18 back-up camera mandate be a problem?

They already have back-up cameras, except for the base R. It wouldn't take much to add a little screen to the base R if needed. Or they could eliminate the base R model, since the vast majority of Rs are sold with the electronics pkg option.